Marc Muench - SmugMug Artist-in-Residence

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  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,904 moderator
    edited December 1, 2011
    The catalog is actually several files. There's the catalog itself, a journal file (contains stuff not committed to the database) and the previews. Finally, there's a lock file that tells other instances of Lightroom that the catalog is currently open for write. The lock file contains the application that's opened the DB and the PID of the application-the file is deleted on successful termination of the application.

    If you find a lock file after a crash, you might not be able to open that catalog. Removing the lock file should get you going again. However, if you see a journal file after a crash, do not remove it or you will lose the data in it.

    I've spent some time this evening looking at the file structure and it appears the catalog is a SQL database already--this is a good thing and I can open it with SQLite tools. The previews database isn't a SQLite file at all (nor is the journal or lock file).

    When I talk about other applications using the database, obviously, that would have to be in a read only mode or using a more sophisticated method.

    I'll have to think some more about my answer given my current 'enlightenment' :D


    The database file or "lrcat" file can be opened by one person at a time. This is what keeps it simpler. If this were editable by multiple users simultaneously it would be even more complex. When I used Cumulus by Canto, a $$$$ program, there was a database to keep track of users and an admin and passwords and and and!

    I believe the single user per catalog approach is a compromise but in the end simplifies things. However, this is the reason why I use only one catalog. If I had multiple catalogs, each time I needed to view images in another catalog the program needs to restart!


    Basically, if you keep everything in one catalog, it is a database! Images are stored in the pictures directory and the catalog file is stored in another folder in the same directory. The two are connected via stored "paths" that are created upon import! If those paths are broken by moving something outside of LR then there's some problems. But if everything is done within LR all is good!
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2011
    Hello :D

    I use one catalogue only.
    However, I do not have those huge quantities of files you produce. mwink.gif

    Every time I back up - and I do it frequently and when I wish but not automatically - the size of the document produced is very large. I tend to go and erase the last old back-ups but sometimes I do not return the same catalogue but another one.

    I am very careful and I always clear my Trash before erasing the supposed un-necessary catalogues so I can retrieve them back in case I need them.

    I hope I made myself understand. ne_nau.gif

    I have only 25.000 images :cry rolleyes1.gif

    i-SbRSLMz-L.png
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2011
    ian408 wrote: »
    The catalog is actually several files. There's the catalog itself, a journal file (contains stuff not committed to the database) and the previews. Finally, there's a lock file that tells other instances of Lightroom that the catalog is currently open for write. The lock file contains the application that's opened the DB and the PID of the application-the file is deleted on successful termination of the application.

    I'll have to think some more about my answer given my current 'enlightenment' :D


    Isn't this great Ianwings.gif
    As a relational database there is so much possible!
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2011

    I have only 25.000 images :cry rolleyes1.gif
    i-SbRSLMz-L.png

    The previews file will take much more space if you have LR build 1-1 previews for all files. Most don't know this is possible. Under Library - previews - build 1-1previews will do so for all selected files. BUT, if you do this for all 25k images the file will be many gigs!

    Thanks for the info Antonio
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2011
    I begin a workshop on BIG WAVES in an hour in Los Osos, so off I go to attempt to clarify this conundrum again in as little time as possible, so we can go find WAVES :)
  • jwwjww Registered Users Posts: 449 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2011
    The previews file will take much more space if you have LR build 1-1 previews for all files. Most don't know this is possible. Under Library - previews - build 1-1previews will do so for all selected files. BUT, if you do this for all 25k images the file will be many gigs!

    You can also choose to dump previews after a certain amount of time which helps the folder size shrink back quite a bit.


    ..and yes, I know I am a bit of an advanced pc user. I can't help it I have been a systems analyst by trade for over 20 years as well as a pc guru since the first pc ever came out.

    However.... now that LR can handle all pics, I see no reason why most, especially non pc techie types cannot just keep all their pics in one catalog. I still won't as I find it quicker to locate stuff for my uses, safer, and easier to archive off stuff I don't need much anymore. thumb.gif

    Look forward to more discussions on how to make it simpler for beginners and non techies!
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2011
    The previews file will take much more space if you have LR build 1-1 previews for all files. Most don't know this is possible. Under Library - previews - build 1-1previews will do so for all selected files. BUT, if you do this for all 25k images the file will be many gigs!

    Thanks for the info Antonio


    bowdown.gifD
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • Antonio CorreiaAntonio Correia Registered Users Posts: 6,241 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2011
    jww wrote: »
    You can also choose to dump previews after a certain amount of time which helps the folder size shrink back quite a bit. ...

    That is a good one :D
    bowdown.gif
    All the best ! ... António Correia - Facebook
  • hawkeye978hawkeye978 Registered Users Posts: 1,218 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2011
    I'll put in my 2 cents on this one.

    I've been using Lightroom since 1.0 and now I'm on 3.x. I probably have only 10,000+ images in a single catalog so not huge. But I do have them spread out over a couple of drives because I have an external drive I use for the newest images and a separate drive on the network at home where I keep the files I should delete but can't quite yet. I originally was drawn to it's ability to perform localized adjustments, great control of RAW, and simplified ability to apply the same changes across a number of images.

    There are things that have driven me crazy from the beginning. Since I worked with an external drive to keep everything centralized but allow me to move to different computers, Lightroom never handles that well in Windows (I have since moved to a MacBook Pro exclusively so the external drive is there because of habit). When you plug in an external in Windows it will assign it a drive letter. It's not always the same letter unless you force Windows to do that. So if it's not the same drive letter as before, Lightroom treats it as a new drive and duplicates it in the drive listings on the left. Lightroom gets confused as to the image locations (at least it did) and keeps claiming the image is offline. That makes for some serious database aggravations if you're not careful. OS X doesn't have that issue because it goes by the drive name, which won't change.

    I have also found filtering to be a bit of a nuisance. If you are in Library mode and want to filter images, you need to go into multi image display before you get to do the metadata sort. It also is a bit klugey to change the sort criteria at the top. But I think that's minor.

    I do keep finding new ways to use the features of Lightroom to control the images. I recently started using the Stacking function more to control images I want to use for HDR and that helps a lot. Color coding the HDR images also gives a quick way to filter to to the HDR exposures. I do a little bit of stock photography and I use the smart collection function to add the keyword 'stock' to images I think may be useful. That way I can quickly go to a central collection and work on those images and keep track of the stock/microstock work.
  • BradfordBennBradfordBenn Registered Users Posts: 2,506 Major grins
    edited December 1, 2011
    A few more LR Comments
    I have been thinking about my LightRoom (LR) usage as I just upgraded the latest Nik Software for both PhotoShop (PS) & LR. So here are my biggest issues at the moment

    1) When opening an image in external app, such as PS or Nik, have an option to replace the source file with the new file
    2) More control over the search options
    3) Refined Dual Screen Mode
    4) Better Keyboard Commands (or reassignable)
    5) iPad/iOS integration improvements

    Allow me to elaborate:

    When opening an image in external app have an option to replace the source file with the new file
    I am finding myself doing more work in PS as it can do layers so I have some more options as to how some adjustments are applied. As a result there is a new file created almost certainly; I can start with a DNG, CRW, or JPG then open it in PS and want to keep the PS file so I have a DNG and PS in the catalog. Now I have to replace the previous file every place it was used with the new file. So this means I have to go to the library and find the original file, then click on collections, see every place I used the old image and now place in the new image. Seems relatively small until you start publishing some of the images. Now on SmugMug the file has changed, so I cannot replace the image on SmugMug through LR I have to do it via a browser or have a new image ID on the new image. Often time this happens as a result of uploading/sharing the SOOC images or images in process for comments.

    What would be nice is if when I open an image in an external editor if LR not only asked would I like to open an original, a copy with LR adjustments, or just a copy but also if I would like the new file to replace the old file throughout the catalog. So that it would update all collections, it would also keep the same tracking number so that SmugMug and other services would stay in sync.


    More control over the search options
    There is too much exclusivity in the search dialogs. I can search the metadata or I can search text and attributes. I would like to search metadata and text, but I cannot. I also cannot decide what part of metadata I want to search. Such as if I am looking at a collection and I just want to see images taken between 4PM and 5PM with the text "Chris" and using I can't find that. The reason you might ask, if I know that between 4 and 5 Chris was wearing an outfit called "The Batman" it would be very easy to add that keyword to all of them at the same time. It is just a database, why not expose more portions of it. Some of these are available through Smart Collections, but why should I create a Smart Collection just to do that. Also from my understanding tags applied to the image in a Smart Collection don't traverse back to the folders/library.

    Refined Dual Screen Mode
    I would like to be able to make it so that one screen is the "workspace", but all the tools (the four panels) are palettes on my second screen. Currently I cannot do something such as make my primary screen be the 1:1 view and the secondary screen have the Develop tools on it. Not just a little "strip" but each one of the panels visible, so that I could see the histogram, the Lens Correction and the Camera Calibration palettes easily without scrolling or expanding and collapsing lots of things.

    Better Keyboard Commands (or reassignable)
    I wrote a blog post about this issue (http://www.bradfordbenn.com/2011/05/hacking-the-ui/) and how much I have to move my hands around when doing things. I was wondering why I was getting so physically tired and sore, I realized it was because I was contstantly moving my hand from keyboard to mouse and back to be able to use some of the keys. If you look at my most commonly used keys for my work flow, just think of how P, U, and X are located, you will see how all over the place they are. Here is a rough picture from the blog post, the ones in red are the ones I use most often
    i-kcNXC3b-L.png

    iPad/iOS integration improvements
    This one is a minor one, but it hit me this week. I would like to carry around some of my better images on my iPad. There is no easy way to just say, export these images and load them onto my iPad. I realize I can publish to my hard drive, then link to the hard drive location for the iPad. However I have to set up the settings, why not have a publish plug in for it? Inbound getting from the iPad I have to use iPhoto, I have not been able to just mount it as a device/camera in Lightroom which would save some steps.
    -=Bradford

    Pictures | Website | Blog | Twitter | Contact
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2011
    hawkeye978 wrote: »
    I'll put in my 2 cents on this one.

    There are things that have driven me crazy from the beginning. Since I worked with an external drive to keep everything centralized but allow me to move to different computers, Lightroom never handles that well in Windows (I have since moved to a MacBook Pro exclusively so the external drive is there because of habit). When you plug in an external in Windows it will assign it a drive letter. It's not always the same letter unless you force Windows to do that. So if it's not the same drive letter as before, Lightroom treats it as a new drive and duplicates it in the drive listings on the left. Lightroom gets confused as to the image locations (at least it did) and keeps claiming the image is offline. That makes for some serious database aggravations if you're not careful. OS X doesn't have that issue because it goes by the drive name, which won't change.

    Tom,

    It may help to place your LRcat files in the same external drive? Some say that LR even works faster this way?
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 2, 2011
    I have been thinking about my LightRoom (LR) usage as I just upgraded the latest Nik Software for both PhotoShop (PS) & LR. So here are my biggest issues at the moment

    1) When opening an image in external app, such as PS or Nik, have an option to replace the source file with the new file
    2) More control over the search options
    3) Refined Dual Screen Mode
    4) Better Keyboard Commands (or reassignable)
    5) iPad/iOS integration improvements

    Excellent intel!
    I'm all for the reassignable keyboard shortcutsthumb.gif
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 15, 2011
    Over the past few weeks in workshops and one on one, I explained the benefits of using one catalog. Once I showed how to use folders and collections all are now using ONE catalog!
    I am still not sure why one would not want to cross ref all their images? except for JWW :)

    I am asking for others who can explain to me how they successfully manage multiple catalogs and why?

    Also, it is very helpful for everyone, if you do not understand something basic in LR. Please ask!
  • jwwjww Registered Users Posts: 449 Major grins
    edited December 15, 2011
    I am still not sure why one would not want to cross ref all their images? except for JWW :)

    I am asking for others who can explain to me how they successfully manage multiple catalogs and why?

    AWWWwww ;) lol. No worries I understand. However to reiterate, for me much easier to find and also archive older events off the main drives to make room for the upcoming year.

    However, you will be please to know with your most recent news of LR being able to now handle tons of photos, I am starting to use ONE catalog for all non event photos. mwink.gif
  • eoren1eoren1 Registered Users Posts: 2,391 Major grins
    edited December 15, 2011
    Marc-
    At the Bar Harbor meetup, I remember you commenting on using the brush in LR to 'paint in' adjustments (ie exposure) and that you found it led to artifacts in the final print. That must have been LR2 at that point and I wanted to see if you had updated thoughts on this.
    Also, would love to hear if you have any develop settings you apply on import. I'm tempted to start using a lens auto correct (ie vignette, CA) automatically when I first get the images off the card.
    Finally, your thoughts on DNG format? I'm very hesitant to move away from my 'untouched' CR2 + XMP sidecar.
    Thanks
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 15, 2011
    Great jaw! Happy Holiday editing :)
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 15, 2011
    eoren1 wrote: »
    Marc-
    At the Bar Harbor meetup, I remember you commenting on using the brush in LR to 'paint in' adjustments (ie exposure) and that you found it led to artifacts in the final print. That must have been LR2 at that point and I wanted to see if you had updated thoughts on this.
    Also, would love to hear if you have any develop settings you apply on import. I'm tempted to start using a lens auto correct (ie vignette, CA) automatically when I first get the images off the card.
    Finally, your thoughts on DNG format? I'm very hesitant to move away from my 'untouched' CR2 + XMP sidecar.
    Thanks

    I still only use the LR brush for regions with gradated edges on quick web display renders only. The mask leaves tiny, but obvious halos, and most importantly I find it poky in LR compared to the brush in PS. For me, going into PS is very efficient!

    I always rec the Flat Tone Curve setting. This shows up near the bottom of the default import dev settings list. Personally I have one with the following:
    Brightness = 0
    Contrast = 0
    Tone Curve = Flat
    Lens Correction = Enable profile correction on
    Detail = Luminance in Noise Reduction to +20

    White Balance is as shot and I shoot with AWB


    This gives me the starting point I like, flat but natural :)
  • eoren1eoren1 Registered Users Posts: 2,391 Major grins
    edited December 15, 2011
    Thanks a lot for sharing this info Marc. I have to admit to being a bit scared of what my images will look like with these settings. It's bad enough when I hit the strong contrast and then move it back to medium...the image suddenly looks quite flat. I can only imagine what it will look like when it is really set to be 'flat'.
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 17, 2011
    eoren1 wrote: »
    I can only imagine what it will look like when it is really set to be 'flat'.

    The main reason I began using this as a default was to process images taken at night! This I will explain in depth when I get "YOUR" tutorial up :)

    In addition to my defaults listed in my previous post, for the night exposures I even take the black slider to "0" and the fill light slider to +5 just to view before I begin editing.
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 22, 2011
    Just so you know!

    To save valuable time in LR make personal presets.

    I suggest making user templates for multiple repetitive edits in develop mode. For example, you change things in multiple panels such as Tone Curve, Lens Corrections and Detail many times on many images.
    On the left panel there is "Presets" click the + sign and give your preset a name to recall those specific changes. If this is your first preset, I suggest making a Folder titled "personal" and saving it in there.
    You will notice that LR ships with many and did I say many included presets! Maybe you will like to use some of these also?

    I know this has nothing to do with backing up or catalogs but it may save you time while actually doing the fun stuff :)
  • eoren1eoren1 Registered Users Posts: 2,391 Major grins
    edited December 22, 2011
    Thanks Marc
    I actually made a Marc Muench preset based on the settings above.
    I was up at 5am shooting the stars and used that preset on import mwink.gif
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited December 22, 2011
    eoren1 wrote: »
    Thanks Marc
    I actually made a Marc Muench preset based on the settings above.
    I was up at 5am shooting the stars and used that preset on import mwink.gif

    Your on it!

    tip for night stuff, as I know the full tut will not come for a bit!

    I prefer a blue sky.
    My Temp is usually between 4300 and 4500 and tint between -4 and +8 with not much moon light
    I notice this works with setting the camera to AWB on both Canon (multiple bodies) and Nikon 1d3 body.
    If full moon temp is closer to 5000!

    I do most of the additional work in PS as the masking of the sky and ground is VERY important!
  • eoren1eoren1 Registered Users Posts: 2,391 Major grins
    edited December 22, 2011
    Thanks Marc
    I was going to mention that I was waiting on the tutorial but decided to hold off as I didn't want to nag.

    I did a real quick scan through my shots from this morning and worked on two for about 5 minutes each. Found that Lightrooms auto WB was much better than the camera's setting but will see what the temp/tint was based on that. We had a sliver of a moon this morning.

    My posts to my website are all set through the new year and I have a backlog of 100 images waiting in the queue so I can definitely keep waiting on the tutorial. I'll try my hand at the star shots when I have more time to devote to them and see what others think.

    Thanks for all of your help on Dgrin (and off)!
  • cabbeycabbey Registered Users Posts: 1,053 Major grins
    edited January 21, 2012
    I am asking for others who can explain to me how they successfully manage multiple catalogs and why?

    Hey Marc, I know one LR user that maintains more than one catalog successfully, her reasoning is separation of the three parts of her business. One catalog for boudoir shots, one for engagements and weddings, one for school portraits. The first two are setup to publish to her two SmugMug accounts, the last one is setup to publish to harddrive for ROES. I think she also said she had a fourth catalog for personal stuff.
    SmugMug Sorcerer - Engineering Team Champion for Commerce, Finance, Security, and Data Support
    http://wall-art.smugmug.com/
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited January 22, 2012
    cabbey wrote: »
    Hey Marc, I know one LR user that maintains more than one catalog successfully, her reasoning is separation of the three parts of her business. One catalog for boudoir shots, one for engagements and weddings, one for school portraits. The first two are setup to publish to her two SmugMug accounts, the last one is setup to publish to harddrive for ROES. I think she also said she had a fourth catalog for personal stuff.


    Cabbey,
    Thanks for the note.
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited January 31, 2012
    Still using my one single catalog in LR!


    DavidTO and I scouted in Death Valley this past weekend for our upcoming workshop. There were some great night scenes,
    i-c5VsNrB-M.jpg


    but also some very interesting salt encrusted grasses,
    i-DSH4XjB-L.jpg

    DV never fails to amaze me. We were both hot after only a half hour in 65 degree sun on this salt flat
    i-NRkVtHh-L.jpg
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited March 9, 2012
    you still haven't found Ian's truck grill? :D

    We did hold a very emotional ceremony at which point Ian broke down in tears.

    With a Waning moon, the stars will be bright early in the night, so we may actually get some descent sleep...... at least a few hours.

    Here is a short vid with some tips for shooting at night! However, the scene with Ian's grill ceremony was cut at the last minutemwink.gif
  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,904 moderator
    edited March 9, 2012
    We did hold a very emotional ceremony at which point Ian broke down in tears.

    Why did you have to bring that up again? I was...just.......starting to get...over it :cry
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
  • Marc MuenchMarc Muench Registered Users Posts: 1,420 Major grins
    edited March 23, 2012
    Hi, Marc
    Not sure when you can comment on my question, but let me throw it out there...

    Your image : K-4714

    What struck you to do what you did when you did it?


    Aaron, sorry I missed this. Not sure which image your referring to?
  • wfellerwfeller Registered Users Posts: 2,625 Major grins
    edited March 24, 2012
    maybe this link will work,

    http://muench.photoshelter.com/image/I00008qBMvT3oAks

    p.s. while looking for that link I was going through somemore of your work and I have questions on about everyone of them.... here's the plan... I win the lotto, give you a huge pile of it and you teach me everything you know... k?:D

    psssst, I think that's David's photo.
    Anybody can do it.
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