What camera question by PM

Andy · July 4, 2006

pm wrote:

Hi Andy,

I was wondering if I could ask you a question. I'm getting ready to purchase another camera...was wondering if you had any suggestions. I used to shoot with a Canon T70 with a multitude of lens...a little over a year ago went digital and bought the Olympus C8080...while it's a good camera, I want to get maybe a Canon that would perhaps be able to accomodate my other lens. The one I looked at and wanted is around 7,000. for the body...a little out of my price range.
Everything I've learned about photography is all trial by error. I've never taken a class or even read the book for my current camera. I never even had a book for the T70...it was given to me. My business is getting busier and busier and I just thought another camera would be a good thing. I just aim and shoot and hope for the best and so far I'm only having probelms with our night flattrack races...will have to make myself read and learn about shutter speed and apaeture and all that stuff....gulp
Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you so much for all the hard work you to do to keep people like me happy!

HI :wave we'll do this in the open forum, so that you can benefit from many people's valuable experience, as well as my own experience.

Some Questions:

1) what types of photography are you mostly into?
2) what lenses do you own now - specifics please?

the c8080 was/is a great camera but the next step, a Digital SLR, well it's a bit daunting but I'll say this, there are MANY great cameras out there. You really can't go wrong with a Rebel, 20D, 30D from Canon, or the D50, D70, D200 from Nikon. Both systems are great cameras. And don't ignore some of the great offerings from Pentax, Samsung, K-M/Sony, and others.

From the little bit you say in your message, I'd recommennd a camera that excels at the high ISOs, you'll want that for the lowlight work.

Let's hear more from you :ear

claudermilk · July 5, 2006

I would think the 20D or 30D would be best. I have a 20D and use it in low light for action shots (dance & theater) a lot--it's worked wonderfully for that. Noise even at ISO 3200 is IMHO very controllable. Since the 30D is essentially an upgraded 20D, I would expect it to work fine. I looked briefly at the 5D when it came out & determined for my use it is a downgrade with the reduced FPS (3 vs the 20D's 5). Of course the body is only half the equation, so for those night shots you'll end up wanting fast lenses which are not cheap.

photofreak · July 5, 2006

Thank you, Andy...just found you had posted this here. Also,, just read about no private mesages...so very sorry to have done that.
Okay...the lenses I have are...Vivitar 85-205, Sigma 75-250, (don't see the brand name on this one..) 28-80, Vivitar 75-300, Canon 50mm, and an Albinar Auto 2x tele-converter. These are for my Canon T-70 body, obviously. I also have two flashes for that camera...Canon Speedlight 155A and a Sunpack Auto 422D. All of this used to belong to some photographer and I got this huge box with a bunch of stuff in it. Can't even begin to list all of the filters! There never was a book so I learned as I went along.
When I went digital, I did a search on Consumer Reports to find the best camera. The Olympus C8080 was what came up. I have two additional lens for that camera and an additional flash. They are Olympus 08D wide, and an Olympus 14D tele. The flash is the Olympus FL-20 flash. I've added a power battery holder to accomodate 2 batteries. It gets me through weddings but not the night races.
I would upload some of the bad photos but for some reason I've not mastered being able to post photos...it always tells me my files are too big. Plus...I think I've dumped the bad ones.
My forte' is portraits and I'm getting more weddings to do...gulp. But, portraits are what I love doing. My husband is a Flat Track Race Promoter so...since I'm the photographer in the family...he wants me to do those. He doesn't understand why I can take great pics of people but not motorcycles flying past me at 80 miles an hour, at night, while I'm dodging dirtballs and trying not to get run over!!!

I've never taken a class or read a book on photography...have just learned as I go. I know composition very well. I know what looks good through the lens...now, I'm afraid I will actually have to read a book and learn some stuff...hey, there's a concept.

Are there any Canon's out there that would accomodate the lenses I currently have?
And...this question...I know I sound so stupid...what exactly is an SLR digital camera...
Okay all you professionals out there...I'm ready for your knowledge and thank each and every one of you in advance for any information to help me. I'm passionate about creating beautiful photos for people but am struggling with the whole business aspect and the camera part of it all...if only my eyes were a camera:help :help
Thank you, Andy for all your help!!!
Oh...and I have Adobe Photoshop Elements 3.0 and a 149GB Dell computer.
www.mandraleephotography.com
Also, will be pouring through the customization threads, as I want my site to look like yours, Andy.

As it is now....BORING!!!!
Again, THANKYOU!!!!!!!!!!
Mandi

Andy · July 5, 2006

Hi Mandi,

I'm really thinking you'll want to invest in some good, fast glass. Not sure if the FL is good for the flat tracks, but a Canon 70-200 f/2.8L IS is a great lens, paired up with a 30D, or 1D2 N, wow, you'll have great low-light solution.

Spend time and energy thinking about lenses. The ones you have are probably not fast enough for the purposes you are talking about.

photofreak · July 5, 2006

Thanks, Andy...I went to Ebay....not sure if it's safe to buy something there....they have a Canon 30D with two lenses 75-300 and 18-55, also a wide angle lens. It also comes with xtra memory, the bag and a tripod...does this sound like a good deal....oh, for 1678. and another 30.00 or so for shipping...any thoughts?
And my other lens won't fit this camera?
Thank you so very much for your help!!!!!
Mandi

[

quote=Andy]Hi Mandi,

I'm really thinking you'll want to invest in some good, fast glass. Not sure if the FL is good for the flat tracks, but a Canon 70-200 f/2.8L IS is a great lens, paired up with a 30D, or 1D2 N, wow, you'll have great low-light solution.

Spend time and energy thinking about lenses. The ones you have are probably not fast enough for the purposes you are talking about.[/quote]

ziggy53 · July 5, 2006

Mandy,

The T70 is an FD series body and uses/used FD mount lenses. While you can get an adapter to allow you to mount the old lenses, you won't be happy with that combination. The optical quality of the adapter is poor, it acts as a teleconverter of about 1.3x but loses a full f stop and you don't get automatic aperture. Add to that the fact that you won't have a split-prism viewfinder, and manual focus becomes a real problem.

You are much, much better off getting new EOS compatible lenses. Been there, done that.

My suggestion would be to purchase a 20D, instead of the 30D, and use the difference in money to purchase lenses. The 20D is still a very responsive camera, suitable for sporting events.

Before trying to recycle the old flashes, take the time to measure their trigger voltage, per the information here:

http://www.botzilla.com/photo/strobeVolts.html

If the measured trigger voltage is more than 6-8 volts, I would not take the chance using the flash on any digital camera. It can literally fry the electronics of a modern digital camera, sometimes over a period of time.

The Canon 144A is GN 51, which is not too powerful, but the Sunpak is around GN 100, considerably better.

For lenses, I would suggest the Canon 70-200mm, f2.8L zoom, either with or without IS, and/or the Canon 300mm, f4L IS. (For night stuff, the f2.8 is a must.)

As far as how to justify the purchase, look at these shots from a fellow DGrinner, Gus (although he used a 400mm lens, I think. I'm not sure what body he uses.)

http://www.digitalgrin.com/showthread.php?t=15567
http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=37468

and these from others with Canon "L" lenses (tried to search for 70-200 images):

http://i.pbase.com/g4/41/28041/2/59252400.AMA_01_0517.jpg
http://img13.imageshack.us/img13/7903/biaggisharper5xz.gif
http://images.fotopic.net/?iid=ys2kq5&outx=600&noresize=1&nostamp=1

(OK, do I put an IMHO here or just assume that, because I'm writing this, Mandy and everybody will figure it out. Hmmm.)

Well, some of this is my idea, and some is other peoples' ideas. Whew!

ziggy53

Sam · July 5, 2006

Welcome Mandi,

I love your enthusiasm. My sugestion is to take your time, and really evaluate what your needs, and wants are. Don't just buy something based on one opinion. Look at the reviews. Do your home work. That said, there is a wealth of knowledge here, and a ton of good advice and recomendations. Read, read, and read.

I'm not a big fan of E-Bay. The one online store that always gets a good rating is B&H Photo.

Another thought, if there is a local camera shop near you, stop in and ask for recomendations, and put the various cameras in your hands.

I have Canon gear and am very pleased with it, and would make the same choice again if I had to, but there are a lot of Nikon shooters here who feel the same way about thier gear.

I don't think you can go wrong with a 20D, or 30D, but I would lean towards the 30D just for the some of the newer features. What ever your choice good glass comes first! Buy the best glass your budget will take.

Good luck,

Sam

Keep asking questions and learning all you can.

photofreak · July 5, 2006

thank you so much for your help it is much appreciated!
Mandi

claudermilk wrote:

I would think the 20D or 30D would be best. I have a 20D and use it in low light for action shots (dance & theater) a lot--it's worked wonderfully for that. Noise even at ISO 3200 is IMHO very controllable. Since the 30D is essentially an upgraded 20D, I would expect it to work fine. I looked briefly at the 5D when it came out & determined for my use it is a downgrade with the reduced FPS (3 vs the 20D's 5). Of course the body is only half the equation, so for those night shots you'll end up wanting fast lenses which are not cheap.

photofreak · July 6, 2006

Totally helpful!!!! Thank you so very much!!
Mandi

Sam wrote:

Welcome Mandi,

I love your enthusiasm. My sugestion is to take your time, and really evaluate what your needs, and wants are. Don't just buy something based on one opinion. Look at the reviews. Do your home work. That said, there is a wealth of knowledge here, and a ton of good advice and recomendations. Read, read, and read.

I'm not a big fan of E-Bay. The one online store that always gets a good rating is B&H Photo.

Another thought, if there is a local camera shop near you, stop in and ask for recomendations, and put the various cameras in your hands.

I have Canon gear and am very pleased with it, and would make the same choice again if I had to, but there are a lot of Nikon shooters here who feel the same way about thier gear.

I don't think you can go wrong with a 20D, or 30D, but I would lean towards the 30D just for the some of the newer features. What ever your choice good glass comes first! Buy the best glass your budget will take.

Good luck,

Sam

Keep asking questions and learning all you can.

Andy · July 6, 2006

photofreak wrote:

Thanks, Andy...I went to Ebay..

Don't buy from Ebay when you can buy from reliable sources.

www.bhphoto.com
www.onecall.com

are two of my favorites.

photofreak · July 6, 2006

I won't...have always done business at B&H photo...will go there, although I was a victim of identity theft last week and this is one of the places the S.O.B. purchased from. I hope they will still do business with me:cry
Mandi
Can you answer this? Are the Sigma lenses as good or equal to the Canon lenses? They are half the price...just wondering. Thanks for all the replies and help!!!

Andy wrote:

Don't buy from Ebay when you can buy from reliable sources.

www.bhphoto.com
www.onecall.com

are two of my favorites.

ziggy53 · July 6, 2006

photofreak wrote:

I won't...have always done business at B&H photo...will go there, although I was a victim of identity theft last week and this is one of the places the S.O.B. purchased from. I hope they will still do business with me:cry
Mandi
Can you answer this? Are the Sigma lenses as good or equal to the Canon lenses? They are half the price...just wondering. Thanks for all the replies and help!!!

Mandi,

Some Sigma lenses test actually better than Canon, Tamron and Tokina, some test slightly under the others, and some are just bad news. (Canon also has some duds, for that matter.) Sigma does seem to have more quality control issues, so you may have to try a couple before you find a winner.

I tried two copies of the Sigma 70-200mm, f2.8, but they were both unsuitable for my purpose. I got one of the Canon 70-200mm, f2.8L (non IS) and it was great from the start.

Then again, I have a Sigma 18-50mm, f2.8 that is fantastic, first try.

Feel free to ask here about particular lenses or ranges and you will usually get a few honest opinions from users.

Best,

ziggy53

photofreak · July 7, 2006

I so appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions! I also LOVED the shots you directed me to!!! The motor cross shots are what I want to be able to do.
I made the purchase yesterday through B&H. I love their customer service! I placed the order yesterday and already recieved an email saying it already shipped!!! Can't wait to get my toys!!!!
Thank you, to all who have shared their knowledge with this newbie! I'm enthusiastic and passionate about my photography but, have a harder time learning the way you all did...by reading. A few circuits in my brain don't connect:uhoh ...so, I turn to the professionals here for help and, you all came through!! SO VERY MUCH APPRECIATED!!!!!
Mandi

ziggy53 wrote:

Mandi,

Some Sigma lenses test actually better than Canon, Tamron and Tokina, some test slightly under the others, and some are just bad news. (Canon also has some duds, for that matter.) Sigma does seem to have more quality control issues, so you may have to try a couple before you find a winner.

I tried two copies of the Sigma 70-200mm, f2.8, but they were both unsuitable for my purpose. I got one of the Canon 70-200mm, f2.8L (non IS) and it was great from the start.

Then again, I have a Sigma 18-50mm, f2.8 that is fantastic, first try.

Feel free to ask here about particular lenses or ranges and you will usually get a few honest opinions from users.

Best,

ziggy53

henryp · July 7, 2006

photofreak wrote:

I made the purchase yesterday through B&H. I love their customer service! I placed the order yesterday and already recieved an email saying it already shipped!!! Can't wait to get my toys!!!!
Mandi

Thanks for your kind words. We're glad you're so pleased.

ziggy53 · July 7, 2006

photofreak wrote:

... I made the purchase yesterday through B&H. I love their customer service! I placed the order yesterday and already recieved an email saying it already shipped!!! Can't wait to get my toys!!!!
...
Mandi

So, what did you wind up ordering?

Camera?
Lenses?
Flat track chase vehicle? (No wait, that's the other store.):D

ziggy53

photofreak · July 8, 2006

I like you Ziggy...you have a great sense of humor...like me.

I bought the 20D and it came with a lens(it was a B&H Photo Kit)...also, got the 70-200 f2.8 lens..had to go with the sigma...cross your fingers for me...just could not afford the 1600. right now for the Canon. Got some extra batteries, the battery grip so I can have more than one battery at a time...I ended up spending 2500.00...I'm sure I'll be happy...my Olympus looks so puny now compared to what I was looking at.
I'm going to go out to mainstreet at nght and photograph cars...just to practice...can't keep using my husband's races as practice.
Mandi

ziggy53 wrote:

So, what did you wind up ordering?

Camera?
Lenses?
Flat track chase vehicle? (No wait, that's the other store.):D

ziggy53

ziggy53 · July 8, 2006

photofreak wrote:

I like you Ziggy...you have a great sense of humor...like me.

I bought the 20D and it came with a lens(it was a B&H Photo Kit)...also, got the 70-200 f2.8 lens..had to go with the sigma...cross your fingers for me...just could not afford the 1600. right now for the Canon. Got some extra batteries, the battery grip so I can have more than one battery at a time...I ended up spending 2500.00...I'm sure I'll be happy...my Olympus looks so puny now compared to what I was looking at.
I'm going to go out to mainstreet at nght and photograph cars...just to practice...can't keep using my husband's races as practice.
Mandi

Mandi,

Don't encourage me.

Sounds like a great system! I am hoping you like the Sigma 70-200mm, f2.8. Most folks do like it. The challenge is going to be figuring out if it focusses quickly enough for your needs.

If you find that the autofocus is not quick enough, you can always pre-focus on something at a similar distance, and then wait for your subject to hit that distance to follow through with the exposure. It's what old-timers did before high-speed autofocus was invented. (Go ahead, ask me how I know.)

I hope everything works out for you and keep us posted here. Everyone learns and benefits when everyone shares their collective wisdom and experiences.

Best,

ziggy53

photofreak · July 10, 2006

I have a new toy...I have a new toy....okay when reading this you have to say it in a sing-song voice and be doing a little jig at the same time...go ahead...I'll wait for you to finish.
Meanwhile I'm doing back flips!!!!

A great thing that I wasn't aware of....the battery grip can use AA batteries. Now, this might not seem important to some but, when you are on the last race of the night and your battery is going low and you've already used your backup batteries...double A's can be a beautiful thing, man...
Okay...I'm going back to dancing my little jig. I'm doing it in the front window...the neighbors are staring!!! I want to scream, "Take a picture!" but...I'm the one with the new camera...let me take yours!!!!!

Mandi

ziggy53 wrote:

Mandi,

Don't encourage me.

Sounds like a great system! I am hoping you like the Sigma 70-200mm, f2.8. Most folks do like it. The challenge is going to be figuring out if it focusses quickly enough for your needs.

If you find that the autofocus is not quick enough, you can always pre-focus on something at a similar distance, and then wait for your subject to hit that distance to follow through with the exposure. It's what old-timers did before high-speed autofocus was invented. (Go ahead, ask me how I know.)

I hope everything works out for you and keep us posted here. Everyone learns and benefits when everyone shares their collective wisdom and experiences.

Best,

ziggy53

claudermilk · July 11, 2006

The AA tray is nice and all, but pretty much sucks. I have never, ever used it & it's still in the original box. I just went to Sterlingtek & got a second battery. With that & the OEM battery I have never run out of charge--even on a multi-day shoot where I really put it to the test: 70-200 IS & about 8,000 frames with no recharge. The 20D is quite efficient with power usage.

: Actually any DSLR is worlds better with batteries than any P&S. So, back to your regularly scheduled happydance.

photofreak · July 11, 2006

claudermilk wrote:

The AA tray is nice and all, but pretty much sucks. I have never, ever used it & it's still in the original box. I just went to Sterlingtek & got a second battery. With that & the OEM battery I have never run out of charge--even on a multi-day shoot where I really put it to the test: 70-200 IS & about 8,000 frames with no recharge. The 20D is quite efficient with power usage. : Actually any DSLR is worlds better with batteries than any P&S. So, back to your regularly scheduled happydance.

Thanks for the reply...I did buy extra batteries...3 to be exact. I didn't want to run into the problem of no power at the crucial moment...:):
still doing my happy dance!
Mandi
www.mandraleephotography.com

athos · July 11, 2006

definitely a 30d over 20d. for shooting action the 30d has better AF and AI servo shoots 5fps whereas with 20d it rarely kept up that speed.

the 5d is the camera i would go for with your budget, but it only shoots 3fps - for action you want the 2 extra frames.

What camera question by PM

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