WB Question ??

AroundDWorld · April 5, 2009

I think I have pretty much covered most of the posts on this forum regarding WB but I still find myself a little confused. :dunno
Many of my photos taken of snow, a white dress/shirt, black outfits, ect........the coloring is never right or the details are severely lost.
So, I am trying to figure out the gray card, white card, metering off palm of hand techniques.

Example:

A person wearing a solid white dress...would I take a white sheet of paper under the same lighting conditions, snap a photo of it in Aperture or Manual mode, note the shutter speed setting??? and then recompose back to the subject with those same settings and then take the picture?

Or can you just hold the shutter half way down while pointing towards the paper and get the reading then set camera to those settings.....

Same thing with metering off the hand????

And is it the shutter speed that I am looking to adjust to make a correct white balance??
Does it matter what Mode I am in (obviously not AUTO of course)
And exactly what settings am I looking for?

I am really having a difficult time understanding exactly how this works....

And what about black.......handle same as white???

Please don't refer to any technical links.....I have read them.....lol!!!:huh

Right now what I need is instructions that are extremely simple and basic and step by step......

I apologize if this all sounds so silly........but I'm really finding myself challenged in this area......big time!!!

I'm new at all this so please if anyone can give me directions in the simplest of terms...I appreciate it!

Thank you everyone!:D

Scott_Quier · April 5, 2009

AroundDWorld wrote:

I think I have pretty much covered most of the posts on this forum regarding WB but I still find myself a little confused.
Many of my photos taken of snow, a white dress/shirt, black outfits, ect........the coloring is never right or the details are severely lost.

It appears (I believe) you are confusing WB with exposure.

Your camera, left to it's own devices will attempt to render a white dress as a gray ... in other words, it will attempt to under-expose the dress anywhere from 1/2 stop to as much as 2 stops. You have to apply your photograph's brains to the problem and over-ride the stupid computer in the camera because the camera doesn't know that the dress should be white and not gray. The same is applicable to shots in the snow.

To get a good Custom White Balance, you need to shoot a calibration shot - a good gray / or white target is best as it will supply the highest volume of data with which to work. Read your owner's manual on how to set the CWB - it's not hard.

AroundDWorld wrote:

So, I am trying to figure out the gray card, white card, metering off palm of hand techniques.

Example:

A person wearing a solid white dress...would I take a white sheet of paper under the same lighting conditions, snap a photo of it in Aperture or Manual mode, note the shutter speed setting??? and then recompose back to the subject with those same settings and then take the picture?

Read you histogram .... Take a shot and look for the spike that represents the white dress. It should be quite close to the right side of your histogram. If it's not, then you need to increase your exposure and/or supplyl more light to the subject. If you have an over-exposure condition .... reduce your exposure

AroundDWorld wrote:

Or can you just hold the shutter half way down while pointing towards the paper and get the reading then set camera to those settings.....

Same thing with metering off the hand????

And is it the shutter speed that I am looking to adjust to make a correct white balance??
Does it matter what Mode I am in (obviously not AUTO of course)
And exactly what settings am I looking for?

I am really having a difficult time understanding exactly how this works....

And what about black.......handle same as white???

Please don't refer to any technical links.....I have read them.....lol!!!

Right now what I need is instructions that are extremely simple and basic and step by step......

I apologize if this all sounds so silly........but I'm really finding myself challenged in this area......big time!!!

I'm new at all this so please if anyone can give me directions in the simplest of terms...I appreciate it!

Thank you everyone!:D

OK ... simple, cookbook directions for setting a CWB:

Find something you KNOW is a neutral color - most quality gray cards qualify. Some white papers qualify but not all as some are actually a little blue. This is your "target".
Compose a shot of your target, such that the target covers at least the center portion of your viewfinder. There's a circle there (assuming Canon here - you tell us what camera you are using ) ... make sure your target covers at least that much of the viewfinder.
Set your exposure such that you get a histogram spike near the right side of the histogram. This is done by adding light, increasing your aperture, slowing your shutter, or a combination of 2 or more of these. The idea is to get enough light on your sensor to get a good spike near the right edge of your histogram.
Read your owner's manual to find the directions to use this image to register a Custom White Balance.

Some additional notes:

Shutter speed - this controls how long the sensor is expose to the light. The longer the exposure, the "brighter" will be the image ... up to a point as you can expose so long that the entire frame is completly saturated - everything is pure white.
Aperture - this is the size of the "iris" of your lens. The numbers are a way to describe that size. The smaller the number, the LARGER will be the opening.
ISO - This is a (more or less) standard expression of how sensitive the camera sensor is to light.

An "correct" exposure is the proper mixing of shutter speed, aperture, and ISO to match the amount of light availabe (either ambient or flash) with which to make the exposure.

AroundDWorld · April 5, 2009

Wow................THANK YOU, Scott.........!
I am off to digest this and give it a try.
You did a terrific job explaining it!
I'll let you know how it goes!

TonyCooper · April 5, 2009

You haven't mentioned what camera you are using. I use a Nikon dslr, and can tell you how to set the WB with a Nikon, but it may be a waste of words if you are using some other camera.

If your camera has the ability for you to manually set the WB, the WB is set for the shooting conditions at that time. If it is manually set with a white card or a gray card, the setting is only good for the same lighting conditions. In other words, you can't manually set WB today and use that same WB setting tomorrow.

White balance can also be set in post-processing if you are shooting RAW and doing the post-processing in Photoshop or Elements. Even .jpgs can be adusted in post in Elements.

So...you will get better answers if you provide a better explanation of the equipment and software program you are using.

AroundDWorld · April 5, 2009

Oh, I have a Canon 50D, currently the lens I am using...(not sure that makes a difference) is a Canon 17-55mm IS f/2.8!!

I do have CS3 and Lightroom 1, though limited knowledge!

Thank you for any advice!!

TonyCooper · April 6, 2009

I have a Nikon, but the Canon 50D surely provides the means to set a manual white balance. Basically, you set the camera's menu to WB, look for the setting that allows you to manually set it, point the camera at your WB card so the card fills the view, and trip the shutter. The camera should tell you that the WB setting has been recorded. No actual photograph is taken even though the shutter is tripped.

I keep a WB 18% gray card in my camera bag. It was $6 at a camera store, and I cut it in half so it would fit in the bag. Some people feel that a gray card is best, and some feel that a white card is best. There are more expensive gadgets, but the cards work.

That said, with Lightroom you could shoot on Automatic White Balance and make any corrections in Lightroom or the RAW processing in CS3. You shouldn't have to make any major adjustments if your camera is set to Automatic WB. Just a tweak will usually work

Outdoor shots are seldom very far out. Indoor shots often require adjustment when there are several sources of light. You can have a room with sunlight, incandescent light, and fluorescent all illuminating your subject. That can confuse the camera.

Here's a tutorial video on using Lightroom to correct WB: http://www.adobe.com/designcenter/lightroom/articles/lir1am_whitebal.html# The thing that throws most newbies in Lightroom is the word "Temperature" on the panel.

That's what is adjusted. There's a color temperature to every source of light. Daylight is from 4800 kelvin to 5500 kelvin. (and up) Incandescent is about 3000 kelvin. That figure to the right of the temperature slider is the temperature on the kelvin scale.

Bring up a photo and experiment with the slider and you will soon grasp what is going on. By deliberately making a photo wrong, you will start to understand WHY it looks wrong. That will help you evaluate your real shots.

Scott_Quier · April 6, 2009

AroundDWorld wrote:

Oh, I have a Canon 50D, currently the lens I am using...(not sure that makes a difference) is a Canon 17-55mm IS f/2.8!!

I do have CS3 and Lightroom 1, though limited knowledge!

Thank you for any advice!!

To set a CWB on a 50D (page 72 of your owner's manual)

Take a picture of a neutral. The owner's manual says to get a shot of a white object. The ojbect needs to fill the "spot metering circle" of the viewfinder. The owner's manual says that using a commercially available gray card can produce a more accurate CWB - depends on the quality of the gray card.
Press the "Menu" button (top, left-most button on the back of the camera)
Using the Main Dial, select the menu that is second from the left
Using the back dial (the thumb dial) select "Custom WB" and press the "Set" button
Now, to import the white balance data - turn either the main dial or the thumb dial to scroll through you photos on the card until you get to the one with the white balance target (the shot in step 1)
Press the set button, select "OK" and press the set button again.
Press the Metering Mode/White Balance select button near the top LCD
Looking at the top LCD panel, turn the thumb dial until the CWB icon is selected (looks like two triangles with a black dot between them).
Press the Metering Mode/White Balance select button near the top LCD to exit that mode and return to "shooting mode" - or you can simply 1/2 press the shutter button.

The CWB data will be registered in your camera until you reset the CWB - that is go though all the steps above. You can remove your card and not change the CWB because, once the data has been registered, the camera no longer references your reference shot. You can also change the active WB setting to anything you like, us it for a while, and return back the CWB. You CWB settings will still be there.

AroundDWorld · April 7, 2009

Thank you!!!
I actually did read the manual on this but it seemed sooooooooo involved....I felt like "what?????"......but I guess once you are used to the steps it probably isn't such a process.
Thanks for the great info........off to practice!!!

Oh....1 more thing.......am I understanding it right that with the 50D I cannot do RAW in Lightroom?? I have to use the program that came with the camera??? What are your thoughts on how well it works? And why do companies do that.....geeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeshhhh!

Art Scott · April 7, 2009

AroundDWorld wrote:

Oh....1 more thing.......am I understanding it right that with the 50D I cannot do RAW in Lightroom?? !

You need LightRoom 2 with the newest available raw conveters installed......before upgrading just go to the download section of Adobe andsee if the converter is there yet for the C. 50D..........

pathfinder · April 7, 2009

The latest version of LR2 does support the 50D and the 5D MKii.

My Lightroom opens 50D raw files routinely.

Scott_Quier · April 7, 2009

Art Scott wrote:

You need LightRoom 2 with the newest available raw conveters installed......before upgrading just go to the download section of Adobe andsee if the converter is there yet for the C. 50D..........

Even easier - startup LR, under the Help menu is the "Check for Update" option. There ya go! Easy peazy!

AroundDWorld · April 7, 2009

oooooooooooooh I like easy.....................!!!
Thanks everyone!

WB Question ??

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