Booked my first job (SCCA Race)

pauliedanger · April 20, 2009

So I booked my first shoot, I'll be covering the Philly SCCA Summer Series. I emailed them just to see about getting a pass so I can get some trigger time, but they're offering me ride alongs and are encouraging me to sell prints on site.

I'm pretty excited. But I've never been to a club racing event, much less shot one. I'm using a pretty minimal set-up, Nikon D40 and kit lens (the kid has to start somewhere). Any suggestions?

nipprdog · April 20, 2009

pauliedanger wrote:

So I booked my first shoot, I'll be covering the Philly SCCA Summer Series. I emailed them just to see about getting a pass so I can get some trigger time, but they're offering me ride alongs and are encouraging me to sell prints on site.

I'm pretty excited. But I've never been to a club racing event, much less shoot one. I'm using a pretty minimal set-up, VB (the kid has to start somewhere). Any suggestions?

Ok. I'll bite.

My suggestion;

Retract the offer.

Here's how it goes. You spend a few years gathering photography experience. At the same time, gathering gear.

THEN, you solicit gigs.

No offense, but if you you show up with a D40 and an 18-55 lens, and no experience, you, and the club, are in for a big disappointment.

Toshido · April 20, 2009

Ahhh Phooey on that.

You did not solicit the gig. You simply asked for access. I say go for it. Worst case you get a great experience and bad photos.

Of course you are being very up front and honest about your abilities.

Looks like these races are all held daylight so it's not like you need fast glass.

Not familiar with the Nikon line up but I know even a rebel XT could keep up to the cars traveling laterally across from you. Couple that with slower shutter speeds, which play nicely into your less than optimum glass (high F stops). You got yourself some real nice panning shots, once you get technique down.

Again not sure about Nikons, assuming lower end Nikon. You might have focusing issues if the cars are coming at you, not sure if the focus can keep up to fast moving objects. But corners and like I said above, panning should be your friend.

Most important of course are two things.

1) Be honest about your abilities. Better to sell yourself short and exceed expectations then upsell yourself and fail to deliver.

2) Have fun! Like I said very least this will be an awesome experience and you should learn and have fun with it. just think of some of the cars you might get to ride in that you otherwise would not.

johng · April 20, 2009

With all due respect to Toshido, I completely disagree. A kit lens is NOT going to capture images worth selling. That will take them all of one event to figure out. Plus there's the selling of images on-site which means the ability to get saleable images strait from the camera, have viewing stations and professional quality printers. My advice is to be upront and tell them you're not ready for that yet - you're just starting out and want to get your feet wet. Neither you, nor them want the embarassment of putting images from the kit lens up for sale right out of the gate. There's nothing wrong with starting at the bottom and learning your craft. But you may find it difficult to recover from that situation. Be honest and don't agree to operate on your first patient before taking your first med school class.

pauliedanger · April 20, 2009

I didn't solicit the gig, I told them up front I was a stone cold rookie and just wanted trigger time. They came back offering ride-alongs and a spot as a vendor.

mud390 · April 20, 2009

Sounds like you scored a pretty nice gig. I'm in the same boat as you... sort of. Just got asked to shoot some little league stuff this week and I'm going in cold with no real sports experience. If nothing else, learn from it and enjoy the experience. I'm sure you'll have fun whether or not you capture that perfect shot or not.

Kris

Toshido · April 20, 2009

See and as long as you are being honest, no harm done.

of course on site printing will be beyond your capabilities, but online selling should be doable.

Also if they are giving you that chance then they likely have nobody else doing pictures at all. Which means you D40 + kit lens should still be miles above the odd shot from one of their drivers or drivers friends/family that are just taking snaps for the hell of it.

Which this all leads me o a big pet peeve of mine.

Photographers go on and on about how it is the photographer not the camera that makes the picture. Then look down their noses at someone with beginner SLR cameras.

Of course you should go shoot for the club. Have fun and be honest about your experience. Like I said worst case is you take bad photos. Not like one bad gig will ruin your life forever.

have fun, take the pics and post them here. Just have thick skin for the critiques so you can learn and improve.

rmwphoto · April 20, 2009

Need Practice first
I started shooting motocross pics last year at a club my family
races at.
I showed some people the pics and even sold some .
They even used my photo's for the plaques they gave the riders
at the end of the year.
I have done 8 events and learned tons .
I just started talking to MX web sites and even got 2 of pics
posted on there website which was cool for me.
Still have alot to learn ,but i wouldn't jump in
that quick to sell your services.
I have raced and been invovled in racing for 20yrs.
That was a advantage for me.
But you should go and practice shooting couple events
and take some pics you like show the drivers and see what kind
of response you get.

Matt336 · April 21, 2009

You are going to want a much bigger lens than an 18-55. I found that my 70-200 wasn't big enough sometimes when shooting autocross.

That was taken at 130mm.

johng · April 21, 2009

Toshido wrote:

Photographers go on and on about how it is the photographer not the camera that makes the picture. Then look down their noses at someone with beginner SLR cameras.

Of course you should go shoot for the club. Have fun and be honest about your experience. Like I said worst case is you take bad photos. Not like one bad gig will ruin your life forever.

I'd like to address these two points. First, you are correct there are a lot of snobs in the sports shooting world. BUT, if you look at the responses in this thread from people that shoot sports you'll find the biggest issues pointed out were: A) the lens is too short and

not enough experience to sell. Both very valid points. It's not about the OP not having a D3. But the kit lens is quite a bit short. You don't have to like that fact, but it's still a fact. No one said the OP needs to go out and buy a 400mm 2.8 lens but a longer lens will be required to get decent shots. Trying to shoot with the kit lens will be very frustrating.

Second, you mention "the worst that can happen is you take bad photos" - that is true IF you're not selling. If you're selling, the worst that can happen is you gain a quick reputation for having very poor results. That is tough to recover from if your customers are the same customer over and over. After a couple of races seeing bad results the potential customers will have a rather fimrly entrenched opinion of the quality of your goods.

Now, if you go into it with the concept of learning and not selling and just soliciting feedback then you get the benefit of learning and getting better without your potential clients associating bad quality to the product you're trying to sell.

Again, I think it's a great opportunity to be able to shoot. But, if you try to sell right off the bat, you'll be doing your business more harm than good.

Again, just my opinion as a sports photographer. Others can and will have differing opinions.

aj986s · April 21, 2009

I think its an opportunity you shouldn't ignore. Since you were just looking for a pass, don't give them false expectations. Let them know you're new and want to learn. IMHO, I wouldn't go to your first event and setup a sales booth yet. But what you can do is take pics the best you can, and then print your best and try to sell them to the specific racers at the next event (or the next day if you have time to go home and do some processing/printing).

Do print out some business cards to hand out when you show your best prints (5x7 or 8x10). You can even put "Proof" watermark on them and just hand them out. If someone wants to buy, be prepared to take an order (maybe print out some sort of order form). Or direct them to you online site (smugmug?) where they can order prints directly.

It becomes very challenging if you try to setup a booth of photog service at car events, because you must try to take multiple pics of every car, and often from multiple vantage points. Becomes a large logistics issue. IMHO, best to stick initially with onesy-towsey sales based upon what you did take, until you get experience and gear.

I've done lots of track and autox events, but not professionally (yet). I'm also a driver/instructor, so don't have the time to properly take pics of everyone. I end up posting in forums my low-rez pics on smugmug and let folks download. Occasionally I get some print sales, or get contacted for a hi-rez of something special, and I work out a fair price.

Also be aware that many tracks have "contracts" with photogs, who may have rights/priviledges to an event, that your SCCA contact may not be aware of. In that case, you may not be able to legally setup a booth. I would search online to see if any photogs regularly cover the track (I believe its Pocono in your case). You might also check with the track management about exclusive arrangements already in place. I think if another photog is already on site, you may want to approach them about being an apprentice, and see if they can help shorten your learning curve.

Also, consider that the local SCCA club may also be interested in event pictures for their website & publications.

If you can make some sales, save your pennies to invest in some better glass for track events. I have 100-400 and 70-200 zooms that I use a lot. Pics of cars that fill the frame tend to be the most desirable. A kit lens will basically provide a lot of scenic views. However, one thing to consider is shooting at lowest possible ISO, and then do some zoom cropping to get nicer closeups. This will effectively reduce your resolution, but some decent 8x10 should be possible. Price accordingly.

My pic galleries are a bit bloated; I only started using Lightroom last year which has helped tremendously to weed out the bad stuff. Please feel free to take a look.

mercphoto · April 21, 2009

Toshido wrote:

Which this all leads me o a big pet peeve of mine.

Photographers go on and on about how it is the photographer not the camera that makes the picture. Then look down their noses at someone with beginner SLR cameras.

He has never shot a race before. By all means take advantage of the access, but really, don't try to sell anything yet. Shoot, learn. Then do it again. Then do it again. After you have the photography end down start learning about the business end. And get a longer lens. That kit lens will do you no good at a club race. 200mm minimum. Even 300mm can be a bit short.

There's a lot to selling photos that most people just don't realize until they are in over their head.

What's the worst that can happen if he does do this gig and does try to sell photos, as you suggest? He could get a reputation based on his first attempt at an event like this. There is zero reason to risk this.

No offense Toshido, but I started photography listening to advice like yours, rather than the dissenting veiws that you have issues with. In hindsight I really should have taken more time practicing, more time learning the business side, before even trying to sell my first photo.

Cygnus Studios · April 21, 2009

There are two different aspects to this. The shoot and the business end. It sounds as if the client knows the ability of the shooter. No harm, no foul.
You get experience by doing, and this is a great opportunity to get in there and get the feet wet. Good, bad or otherwise this is a learning experience. The guy will learn what his kit lens will and won't do. Same with his camera.
There are certain situations where he can still get some good shots, and others where he will not.
It isn't as if he is being hired as the official event photographer.

Now on the selling end. This is going to be tough. He will be going head to head with advanced users and pros.
While the photographer is responsible for getting the pics, some tools make the job easier than others.

I would suggest getting the pics that you can, and count it as a great chance to shoot.
If you manage to capture a stellar image, by all means sell it. If you end up with average to lousy shots, keep them for friends and family.

Have fun.

Toshido · April 21, 2009

I am not suggesting an aggressive selling campaign. but online display of the photos and take orders from people that want to buy it. That seems perfectly reasonable.

It also sounds like he is not going against pros and advanced amateurs here. Otherwise the club would likely not be giving him this access and requests for onsite prints.

it is definately my opinion that mediocre photos (Sorry OP) are better then no photos.

Of course given time no reason those mediocre photos can't turn to stellar photos

johng · April 21, 2009

Toshido wrote:

Of course given time no reason those mediocre photos can't turn to stellar photos

But after 1 or 2 trips to his site and viewing mediocre photos, customers aren't likely to come back. Never show a customer a bad photo. Friends and family sure - even sites like this. But don't show potential customers photos until they're good.

Toshido · April 21, 2009

Well John, you do have a point.

Mike J · April 22, 2009

johng wrote:

The lens is too short and not enough experience to sell.

This has been a very interesting thread for me...
For me the lens is the biggest issue here. I would definitely rent something longer and faster. Maybe even a different camera. If you really want to get into this, you will need to step up in equipment at some time.

Again, I think it's a great opportunity to be able to shoot. But, if you try to sell right off the bat, you'll be doing your business more harm than good.
Again, just my opinion as a sports photographer. Others can and will have differing opinions.

I tend to agree with John...protect your reputation. You want people to want to come back to your website. After the shoot, I would agressively cull. If you don't get anything get, don't post and try to sell. You can always post your images here and get some honest and almost unbiased opinions.

FL00DY · April 22, 2009

As a total n00b myself I think what the others are saying sounds bout right, both the size of your lens and selling your photos. If you're shooting Motorkhana or autox then you'll be some distance from the action. Like I said I'm also new to photography and just shot a race day at my local race track with a 55-200 kit lens and it was OK for distance for each corner I was on. Shooting at proper race track and at a autox tarmc slab will be different as you might be able to see everything but your lens wont capture it.

As for selling my shots, I captured a real close corner between two cars and had a chat showing one of the guys (the gur worse off) the shots. He gave me his email address and ask me to send him the shots. I sent him the shots last night and he said he loved them. I think this is the best approach. Also I think it helps to have an understanding about the sport you're shooting. I race a bit in my street car and so have an understanding about what and where might look good or what corners will produce exciting shots.

Good luck and I think for your first time just enjoy the action, the shots will be a bonus

Cayuse · April 23, 2009

Since it's a series why not shoot the first few events to get some practice and build a bit of a portfolio with your best shots and then start selling at the last few races of the season?

Photosbychuck · May 2, 2009

Sounds like fun to me.
I checked out the link you listed for the club and they do have at least one Photographer. His name is John Kolb and the web site lets viewers rate each photo if they want. There are some photos with 111 views and some with only 3 so, they must have someone trying to take several photos for each race and then sending them to the person over there web site and photo gallery. The person over the photo gallery maybe only posting the ones he/she likes best on the site.

Good Luck,
Charles,

Booked my first job (SCCA Race)

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