Samantha II

marikris · September 6, 2009

Thank you to those who commented on my last post. I went and got her to
model again today because my new Westcott softbox arrived this weekend.

Just experimenting, though I think I need more light because I had to crank
up the ISO to 2500 on some @f2.8 (Steve commented on that on the last post,
and I really need to be able to go down a few stops. Actually, I need to go
experiment on Manual while I still have a willing body.)

Thanks for looking, and again, any cc or advice (lighting, pp, pose, anything)
will really help

1.

2.

3.

adbsgicom · September 6, 2009

I think you have three very nice images there!
BTW, she has lovely curly hair -- you didn't need to straighten it...

marikris · September 7, 2009

adbsgicom wrote:

BTW, she has lovely curly hair -- you didn't need to straighten it...

Thanks Andrew! I keep telling her she has awesome hair, but she just gives me that stare and points at my straight hair and my array of curling irons

rainbow · September 7, 2009

Nice images -- I like the lighting.

I like the first one the best because of the pleasing position of the eyes. In the second the gaze is so high that white shows under the irises while in the third they are in the corners.

blaser321 · September 7, 2009

like them all nice lighting

cr8ingwaves · September 7, 2009

just wanted to agree with Andrew re: curls.
her hair is awesome. I believe in working with what you were blessed with.

great shots.

divamum · September 7, 2009

#2 is outta this world!

thumb #1 is pretty fabu too (although perhaps a small tad too hot on the rh side of her face?

)

What lighting are you using? It looks fine, but the numbers you're quoting make me think... HUH?? Are you using a hotlight or something? When I'm using studio lights, or speedlights at close(ish) quarters for portraits, I'm usually ISO 100/ F3-5.6 (depending on bg effect desired) and 1/125+ (sometimes quite a LOT "+"). What are you using that's got so little actual power?

marikris · September 7, 2009

divamum wrote:

What lighting are you using? It looks fine, but the numbers you're quoting make me think... HUH?? What are you using that's got so little actual power?

I'm using my 580Ex speedlite in a 28" softbox. I have the softbox very close to her. Are you shooting Manual? I am surely not doing something right. When I give the flash more power, her face gets blown. Now that I think about it, I could've moved the box farther away. She leaves on Wednesday morning, so I'll persuade her to sit for me again tomorrow.

VayCayMom · September 7, 2009

WOW WOW WOW these are great! And all the poses are very flattering. Great eyes. Great hair too!!!

marikris · September 7, 2009

rainbow wrote:

I like the first one the best because of the pleasing position of the eyes.

I hadn't thought of it that way - great observation. I do think #2 has a kind of owl-ish effect. Toning the white of her cornea down a bit might help. I'll experiment on that.

lilmomma · September 7, 2009

These are beautiful! ISO 2500?? wow... I'm on my parents crappy monitor right now but I don't see any noise. Anyway the light is very pretty.

divamum · September 7, 2009

marikris wrote:

I'm using my 580Ex speedlite in a 28" softbox. I have the softbox very close to her. Are you shooting Manual? I am surely not doing something right. When I give the flash more power, her face gets blown. Now that I think about it, I could've moved the box farther away. She leaves on Wednesday morning, so I'll persuade her to sit for me again tomorrow.

I would DEF try upping the power, and moving it back a bit! Yes, closer light source will mean softer light, but you'll get hotspots, too. You can use your flash exposure comp in camera if you need to adjust it (easier than messing with the flash head itself inside the softbox

) FWIW, using my speedlight with a small softbox (~15" - made it out of a sodacan box

), 24" umbrella and 45" umbrella, the 45" umb for sure gives the softest light, and I can move it back a bit. That said, I'm finding I prefer the 24" because I can control the light more, especially in a little room - without a bigger space, it's really hard to position the 45" so it doesn't just become wraparound light without enough shadows between lit- and unlit sides. So, despite the fact that I love great big softboxes in the studio, with my own gear a dinky little 24"-er does a beautiful job

(cheap too - you can pick up a convertible 24" for ~$20)

For metering, as with most I usually start out in ap priority (just what I'm used to and it works for me), but with a flash in a "studio style" setting will often wind up turning to manual after a few test shots to set the exposure (I don't have an external lightmeter, although I want one!) I've just looked at a bunch of my owns exifs, and when using one of my speedlights in a softbox or umbrella, I'm generally 1/200 (flash synch), ISO100 and F3.2-5.6.

Kinkajou · September 7, 2009

Oh, #2 is simply gorgeous! I don't get 'owl-like' at all; it's my favorite of the group.

Nice job!

marikris · September 8, 2009

lilmomma wrote:

These are beautiful! ISO 2500?? wow... I'm on my parents crappy monitor right now but I don't see any noise.

Yep! The third one has the most noticeable noise @ ISO 3200 (noticeable in the blue-green bg) because it was also cropped. If she wants a print of that, I might run it through noise ninja a bit, but the others seem to be doing ok yeay!

divamum wrote:

I would DEF try upping the power, and moving it back a bit! Yes, closer light source will mean softer light, but you'll get hotspots, too.

Yes, I will try all this! Thank yo so much for the insight. I have no studio and I find that the 28" is big enough for me, plus the Westcott folds like an umbrella. If I ever brave outside my apt to shoot, it would be easy to carry. Unlike my 60" reflector - what a drag to carry around, even if it folds into a big pancake lol. I need to get a smaller one. I bought a reflector arm to hold it and realized that my brand reflector has the frame too wide for the clamps on the arm to hold. I was pretty bummed out. Btw, I'm not sure what flash sync means. I will read up on that.

VayCayMom wrote:

WOW WOW WOW these are great! And all the poses are very flattering. Great eyes. Great hair too!!!

cr8ingwaves wrote:

her hair is awesome. I believe in working with what you were blessed with.

Thank you guys! That hair was straight out of the shower too lol. I have been telling her she's been blessed!

divamum · September 8, 2009

marikris wrote:

Yes, I will try all this! Thank yo so much for the insight. I have no studio and I find that the 28" is big enough for me, plus the Westcott folds like an umbrella. If I ever brave outside my apt to shoot, it would be easy to carry. Unlike my 60" reflector - what a drag to carry around, even if it folds into a big pancake lol. I need to get a smaller one. I bought a reflector arm to hold it and realized that my brand reflector has the frame too wide for the clamps on the arm to hold. I was pretty bummed out. Btw, I'm not sure what flash sync means. I will read up on that.

Flash synch = speed that your camera talks to your flash. The "standard" flash synch in Canon cameras is 1/200 or 1/250, I believe (depending on the model. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong!). You can, of course, drop your shutter speed below that, but if you go above that (without using "high speed synch" on the flash which, in the case of my flash, will only work ON the camera so is useless to me when I'm triggering the flash remotely as a slave), the shutter and flash don't play nice together and you get very strange results....

Btw, cheap and easy reflector is white foamboard. I get mine from the dollar store, and it works a treat for head and shoulders shots! I use clothespins to attach mine to a music stand (makes a remarkably good reflector holder

).

Scott_Quier · September 8, 2009

marikris wrote:

I'm using my 580Ex speedlite in a 28" softbox. I have the softbox very close to her. Are you shooting Manual? I am surely not doing something right. When I give the flash more power, her face gets blown. Now that I think about it, I could've moved the box farther away. She leaves on Wednesday morning, so I'll persuade her to sit for me again tomorrow.

Moving the light back will diminish or reduce the hot-spots - it's a function of the rate at which light intensity falls of with distance between the subject and the light source.

When you boost the power of the flash, you need to either stop down the lens (not recommended in this situation, your OOF blur is soooooo dreamy) or lower your ISO (the preferred solution). I would think that you could easily boost the power of your flash by about three stops and get your ISO down to the 400 neighborhood. With appropriate placement of the light, you should be able to get the light and ISO balanced such that you can shoot at ISO 100.

As for the photos themselves - WOW, they are soooo dreamy. Love the look of the light, the OOF blurring, and she's gorgeous!!

divamum wrote:

Flash synch = speed that your camera talks to your flash. The "standard" flash synch in Canon cameras is 1/200 or 1/250, I believe (depending on the model. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong!). You can, of course, drop your shutter speed below that, but if you go above that (without using "high speed synch" on the flash which, in the case of my flash, will only work ON the camera so is useless to me when I'm triggering the flash remotely as a slave), the shutter and flash don't play nice together and you get very strange results....

A correction. Flash-sync (AKA, x-sync) is the fastest shutter speed you can use with a focal plane shutter camera and still expose the entire frame to the light from the flash. X-sync speeds can vary from 1/60 (for older film SLR cameras - I had one) to as much as 1/500 (or faster for some). The flash and camera communicate at, virtually, the speed of light - after all, it's all electronic.

In the Canon line, most (all?) xxxD cameras have a 1/200s x-sync speed, the xxD 1/250s, and my 5D2 has a 1/200s. If you set your shutter speed to something higher than the x-sync speed, only a portion of you frame will be exposed to the light from the flash - this gives the appearance of a portion of your frame (usually along one of the long edges of the frame) being dark/black. I've actually pushed my 50D about 2/3 stops faster with no issues, but my 5D2 is unforgiving in this regard - 1/250 and 1/3 of the frame was black

.

divamum · September 8, 2009

Scott_Quier wrote:

A correction. Flash-sync (AKA, x-sync) is the fastest shutter speed you can use with a focal plane shutter camera and still expose the entire frame to the light from the flash.

What he said.

(That is what I meant by "talk to the flash", but I couldn't remember the exact technical language/terminology to explain it and didn't want to get it wrong! Thanks for the more complete and accurate explanation

)

In the Canon line, most (all?) xxxD cameras have a 1/200s x-sync speed, the xxD 1/250s, and my 5D2 has a 1/200s. If you set your shutter speed to something higher than the x-sync speed, only a portion of you frame will be exposed to the light from the flash - this gives the appearance of a portion of your frame (usually along one of the long edges of the frame) being dark/black. I've actually pushed my 50D about 2/3 stops faster with no issues, but my 5D2 is unforgiving in this regard - 1/250 and 1/3 of the frame was black .

Since it seems to me that high-speed-synch is one of those camera-feature holy-grail selling points that gets people all fired up ... why does the high-end 5d2 go "back" a step in that regard and match the entry-level cameras?

Not that it matters, really (although it WOULD be nice to HSS when triggering the flash remotely rather than only in the actual hotshoe - unless that's something that's only offered with the 580ex/ii?). Just curious.

Scott_Quier · September 8, 2009

divamum wrote:

Since it seems to me that high-speed-synch is one of those camera-feature holy-grail selling points that gets people all fired up ... why does the high-end 5d2 go "back" a step in that regard and match the entry-level cameras? Not that it matters, really (although it WOULD be nice to HSS when triggering the flash remotely rather than only in the actual hotshoe - unless that's something that's only offered with the 580ex/ii?). Just curious.

High-speed-sync is not a higher x-sync.
From this post

ziggy53 wrote:

Cameras that use a focal plane shutter have a maximum flash sync, except for HSS/FP mode (called HS in the case of the 580EX flash). On the Canon 5D that maximum sync is 1/200th. On the Canon 10D it is also 1/200th.

HSS/FP mode allows the flash to operate at higher shutter speeds by srobing the flash at a very high rate (around 50KHz) during the duration of the shutter travel.

As for the slower shutter speed with the 5D2 (and the 5D) - I'm thinking there are two factors in play here:

The 5D and 5D2 are not action cameras, but are more targeted toward studio work where a 1/200 shutter speed is more than adequate and
These cameras are full frame cameras. The crop sensor is 22.3mm x 14.9mm and the FF is 36.0mm x 24.0mm. In order to attain the 1/250 shutter speed of the xxD cameras, the shutter would have to move 60% faster than it does on the crop-sensor. That means the shutter would have to be that much stronger to withstand the increased forces involved in starting and stopping. This leads to additional weight (of the shutter). This increased shutter leaf weight leads to a requirement that the entire shutter assembly be that much more strongly engineered. The cost would increase ... maybe too much?

As for HSS - that is still possble with the 5D2 if one uses something like the ST-E2 for the triggering communication.

divamum · September 8, 2009

Scott_Quier wrote:

High-speed-sync is not a higher x-sync.
From this post

Right - HSS being a function of the *flash* rather than the shutter (yes?)

As for the slower shutter speed with the 5D2 (and the 5D) - I'm thinking there are two factors in play here:
The 5D and 5D2 are not action cameras, but are more targeted toward studio work where a 1/200 shutter speed is more than adequate and

These cameras are full frame cameras. The crop sensor is 22.3mm x 14.9mm and the FF is 36.0mm x 24.0mm. In order to attain the 1/250 shutter speed of the xxD cameras, the shutter would have to move 60% faster than it does on the crop-sensor. That means the shutter would have to be that much stronger to withstand the increased forces involved in starting and stopping. This leads to additional weight (of the shutter). This increased shutter leaf weight leads to a requirement that the entire shutter assembly be that much more strongly engineered. The cost would increase ... maybe too much?

As for HSS - that is still possble with the 5D2 if one uses something like the ST-E2 for the triggering communication.

Ok, that makes sense. Thanks for the clear explanation!

So the 5d can HSS a flash when triggering remotely? Eeenteresting... the xsi/ste2 can't with my 430ex (which does have the feature). It won't do 2nd-curtain off-camera either. A minor niggle since I don't use either particularly often, but can be annoying sometimes.....

adbsgicom · September 8, 2009

divamum wrote:

So the 5d can HSS a flash when triggering remotely? Eeenteresting... the xsi/ste2 can't with my 430ex (which does have the feature). It won't do 2nd-curtain off-camera either. A minor niggle since I don't use either particularly often, but can be annoying sometimes.....

Far as I can tell, no canon flash can do rear-curtain in master/slave mode. :cry

bendruckerphoto · September 8, 2009

#1 is OK, the 2nd is great, and the 3rd one isn't a keeper. The second one is really good though. Relaxed pose and good composition and lighting.

marikris · September 10, 2009

Thank you guys! The discussions about flash made me realize how much of a newb I am lol, and warrant a more in-depth reading and application on my end.

My cousin has since left, and I want to share a specially goober mistake I made on her last day here. I told her I'd love to give her a print as a Thank You for being exceedingly patient with me, as well as low-res images of all the ones that turned out (meaning the ones I processed already, which are not a lot, but I failed to be more specific about that).

She had one question: could she see the rest of the images that didn't make it? Pretty please with a cherry on top?

I wish I was a stronger person, but how could I resist when she was batting those lashes at me? Plus, I felt bad only showing her so few when we spent so much time on preparing. If I had known she would choose the one photo to print from these images, I think I would have given a firm "No" lol.

She chose a handful (and I mean SOOC that didn't make it into my culled pile) and then I proceeded to tell her why I had culled them out (focus, softness, too dark). For every focus issue I had, she countered that they looked focused to her (grr *pulls hair*). In the end we compromised, and I chose the one that I felt was the most printable - though still *too* soft to my eyes.

She also only wanted to print the SOOC file (because she thought the touch-up lost her tan -_-), but I re-adjusted for a bronzer new file (I was on PS and she told me when to stop on the slider) and I was satisfied enough with the 12 x 18 print - which, btw, she loved, judging from the "Ohhhh, Kris, this is sooooo nice" sigh when I showed it to her.

So I was happy, but it suuuuure taught me a lesson.

Photosbychuck · September 10, 2009

Great Set

I like #2 the best

Take Care,
Charles

adbsgicom · September 10, 2009

marikris wrote:

...I proceeded to tell her why I had culled them out (focus, softness, too dark). For every focus issue I had, she countered that they looked focused to her (grr *pulls hair*). In the end we compromised, and I chose the one that I felt was the most printable - though still *too* soft to my eyes.

So I was happy, but it suuuuure taught me a lesson.

Samantha II

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