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Torn Between The Nikon D90 And The 5D Mark 2
PhotographicIdiot
Registered Users Posts: 14 Big grins
They're both great cameras, but one is better because of the Full Frame Sensor. But after looking at a post on here with some 5D's pictures I gotta ask is the 5D that much better than the Nikon D90?
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The Nikon D700 is more similar in basic qualities to the Canon 5D MKII and they are both FF and similar cost. I would consider both fairly similar in image output quality, with the Nikon having a potentially better AF system and the Canon with better resolution, especially at base ISO. By ISO 3200 they will deliver similar detail to similar print sizes. I have a Canon 5D MKII and I am very pleased with it. I use it primarily for wedding formals and landscape work.
The Nikon D90 would be more comparable to a Canon 50D.
All of the above are capable of great images of almost any subject to 11" x 14", with many subjects allowing even further enlargement. The FF cameras are greatly reduced in random sensor noise at high ISOs.
I do suggest using http://www.dxomark.com/ to gain additional insight into how RAW captures compare between different cameras.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
Canon also has IS on some EF-S lenses. (EF-S is similar to Nikon DX format.)
Notably the:
EF-S 18-55mm, f3.5-5.6 IS
and
EF-S 55-250mm, f4-5.6 IS
... are very low cost and compare well with their Nikon counterparts.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
You have lots of choices, the 5D is like the D700 but then there is the D300s/7D which are crop sensors, then next tier down is D90 and 50D.
What type of photos do you plan to take? And do you plan to take the camera out in the elements a lot?
The Nikon lenses which are inexpensive and have IS are (I believe) mostly "DX" series lenses, meaning that they are designed for use on the Nikon DX crop 1.5x camera bodies. The same lenses will fit the Nikon FF bodies, but with greatly reduced image sizes they may not be as useful.
Canon calls their crop 1.6x lenses "EF-S" lenses and they will "not fit" either the Canon FF bodies nor will they fit the 1.3x crop bodies (1D series).
I believe that Nikon and Canon have somewhat similar offerings in crop lenses with IS, and the FF capable lenses from either manufacturer, which also have IS, are similarly expensive too.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
Ziggy see thats another thing that is a bit ..hard for me which lenses especially with the Canon ones. As you explained i wouldn't really know which ones would be right or for a full frame sensor aka 5D Mark 2. But with Nikon its a little easier. I don't know if its full blown easier to tell apart from the ones that goes with one sort of camera and the other.
In Canon the FF cameras are the:
1Ds series
5D series
The crop 1.3x (APS-H) cameras are the 1D series.
All of the above use Canon EF lenses.
Canon crop 1.6x (APS-C, similar to Nikon DX) cameras are the:
7D
xxD cameras (10D, 20D, etc. through the 50D)
xxxD cameras (dRebel)
xxxxD cameras (dRebel)
All of the Canon crop 1.6x will use either EF or EF-S lenses, so pretty much any modern Canon lens will fit the crop 1.6x cameras.
If you are considering the Canon 5D series cameras then yes, stabilized (IS) lenses are expensive, but I believe that is also true of the Nikon FF lenses that are stabilized (VR).
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
if so that seems pretty straight forward. i just never worked with a canon is why i am asking.
APS was a film format from years ago. APS-H and APS-C are simply crops from the full APS frame that are similar in size to the imager sizes used in some modern digital cameras.
Disregard the APS stuff for now, since that seems to be confusing the issues.
In basic form, the Canon 1D and 1Ds series cameras as well as the 5D series cameras all use EF series Canon lenses. EF-S designated lenses will not fit those camera bodies.
If you are interested in a Canon 5D series camera, the 5D MKII is the current version, then stay with Canon EF model lenses and stay away from the EF-S lenses.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
The ones that Ziggy mentioned are cheap, but they are EF-S so you cannot use them on a 5d. A 5d is a pretty high end camera, and if you get one you should be looking to spend a fair amount on lenses to get the best from it. If you can't afford that, I would suggest something like a 50d and a EF-S 17-55 2.8 IS which is a great crop sensor lens.
1) The cost of the cameras you’re asking about and
2) The kind of questions you’re asking (please do not take offense, much of the alphabet soup that’s mentioned on these forums is Greek to me, too)
I would suggest that you look at lenses and spend the bulk of your budget on one or two good non-crop lenses (not “-S” in the Canon line, for example) which will keep your future options open, and then buy a less expensive body to start out with, a 40D or 50D for example in the Canon line. This will allow you to invest in lenses that you’ll never outgrow, and if/when you want to step up to a 5D or D90, the older body (the far cheapest part of the system) will become a backup.
Another option would be a 7D with the EF (not –S) kit lens that has IS.
Roak
Ps. Sorry to be Canon-centric, but I know more about them than Nikon, but the exact same line of reasoning goes for their camera body and lens line, too.
USM stands for “Ultrasonic Motor” a very fast, quiet motor that’s on Canon’s mid-range-on-up lenses.
<== Mighty Murphy, the wonder Bouv!
I was a late adopter of IS lenses and I know when to use the feature but I also know that much of the time IS will slow down acquisition (as it takes time for the IS system to engage) and much of the time I leave the IS off. Large aperture lenses, commonly lenses of f2.8 or better, provide:
1) Much better low-light performance, as they collect more light into the camera. This allows faster shutter speeds and lower ISO settings, reducing noise and reducing both camera shake (camera shake is the only thing that IS affects) and a faster shutter also reduces subject blur (and IS has no impact on subject blur.)
2) Faster and more accurate AF. Most modern dSLR cameras are sensitive to the large aperture and they have extra speed and extra precision when using lenses of aperture f2.8 or larger. The camera will focus at maximum aperture regardless of the aperture you set for the exposure.
3) A larger aperture allows better background blur (bokeh) which helps to isolate and separate your subject from the background, helping to make the subject "pop" from the surroundings.
A tripod is a much better stabilization system than any IS system.
If IS is important to you because of a medical condition, A Sony Alpha DSLR-A900 or Alpha DSLR-A850 might be a better solution in that they are FF bodies which have in-body (chip based) stabilization, meaning that "any" lens used has stabilization benefits. The downside is that the body based stabilization is typically less effective for long focal lengths than optical stabilization.
The Alpha DSLR-A850 is also the only FF body at less than $2000USD new, and it has the highest resolution at 24.6 MPix. Continuous shooting is a bit slow by current standards. Dynamic range also suffers a bit more than competitors at high-ISO. Still the a850 and a900 are very nice dSLRs and capable of professional results.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
This is true but it needs a bit of clarification. Canon has multiple USM motor technologies. The "Ring-Type" USM is the fastest and most accurate and tends to be used on the most expensive lenses. There is also a "Micro-Motor" USM used on some less costly lenses and it has less benefit than the ring type.
As a rule the ring type allows full-time manual focus override and has the greatest torque, meaning fastest AF performance.
I have the EF 50mm, f1.4 USM and it uses the micro-motor USM. Thankfully it has enough torque and speed to be useful, but it is not a sports lens by any means. I also have an EF 135mm, f2L USM which has the ring-type USM and it is fast enough to be used for any application.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
The true investment is in quality glass and accessories.
Put together a list of lenses in the focal lengths you want. Add flashes and transmitters etc. Price it ALL out without the camera....read reviews. Buy the system....NOT the camera.
Jeff
-Need help with Dgrin?; Wedding Photography Resources
-My Website - Blog - Tips for Senior Portraiture
The 5D has more resolution and which would be nice for the landscapes but 12MP of the D90 is a lot on its own.
For using it out in the field the D300s actually has better weather sealing than the 5D.
I would also look at the A850 Sony, a big thing to look into is the weather sealing (I cannot comment personally on this but it should be good and someone else should be able to here) it is 2,000 dollars and you get 24MP. The downsides compared to the 5D are the high ISO performance is not as good, and there is no video. You do get built in VR/IS with sensor based stabilization, and the higher MP.
Roak, i'm glad you know more about canon as i don't.lol But i might look at 50d and look at some more lenses. Maybe your right, i should start off small. My third choice was actually the 50D. also my buddy whos a photographer as well i believe just got his new 7D and seems to like it a lot.
Ziggy, I thought because in the past was told i had a bit of a shakey hands problem but I just now ask the very person who said that to me and they said my hands arent at all shaky. a tiny bit maybe but not hugely. barely noticeable apparently. So i may not need the IS after all. I just want to honestly spend money and have it be that i cant exactly use it without a tripod. you know what i mean? I will however look at the Sony one but I mostly likely going to just look at Canon and Nikon. So USM is a good thing right? or no?
Jeff - your absolutely right. Technology changes so much that as you said you buy one then the next minute you know its old and you need a newer camera. which is ridiculous because if I do get the Canon 5D i am never going to need another. I don't care if its ten years i still probably be loving it if i get it.
Nikon - I think i am going to mostly likely stick with Nikon or Canon.
A lens with a larger/faster aperture still wins over a slower aperture lens with IS, for the reasons I stated above.
Canon's Ring USM, like that used in the "L" series lenses, is very good indeed. It means faster and more accurate focus, with very little noise. Look for the Canon lenses with a "red" ring on the front of the barrel.
In Nikon look at the Nikon lenses which say AF-S and have a "gold" ring on the front.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
No...just because a newer model is released doesn't mean you need a new camera.
If the camera behaves as it should when the shutter button is pressed....ie: it focuses, guages exposure, and opens/closes the shutter, then the camera is still sound regardless of age and what is new on the market.
I have taken outstanding images with Canon cameras and shoot both an XTi and 50D. The difference in image quality between the two cameras at ISO's of 100 to 400 is negligable. At higher ISO's the 50D clearly shines, but I don't shoot above ISO 800 THAT often so for me it's either or. The true difference is in resolution and the ability to crop deeper into an image without losing IQ. Add in micro focus adjustment and the 3 inch LCD, and the 50D is my prefered camera...but not because it performs THAT much better on other counts.
If the camera is of sufficient resolution, and behaves well enough at the ISO's you intend to shoot, and offers a fast enough frame rate for your intended purpose, then it will get the job done as long as it works.
Again...the REAL investment will be in QUALITY glass and accessories.
Unless you want video capability.
Jeff
-Need help with Dgrin?; Wedding Photography Resources
-My Website - Blog - Tips for Senior Portraiture
Ditto on the 50mm F1.4.....definately NOT a sports lens.
I bought an 85 F1.8 for sports based on excellent reviews.....however...I found my 17-55 F2.8 IS to be better suited to sports for ME. I personally had trouble keeping fast running basketball players in the viewfinder at 85mm. The 17-55 gave me a MUCH wider view and simpler task. I use the 70-200 F2.8IS when I cant get close enough for the 17-55.
As far as focus speed, the 85 F1.8 Canon is far superior than its 50mm F1.4 brethren....and the 17-55 is just as fast if not faster in my opinion.
I also found the Tamron 28-75 F2.8 to be sluggish for sports....however for other purposes it was an excellent lense.
Jeff
-Need help with Dgrin?; Wedding Photography Resources
-My Website - Blog - Tips for Senior Portraiture