Radio trigger question

Snowgirl · April 2, 2010

Hi - I had posted this in my shooting bikes thread but thought it should have a thread of its own.

I bought a set of radio triggers (Cameron) to use with my 580EXII (Canon) flash and 40D camera. The trigger works when I push the 'test' button on the transmitter. However, when I push the shutter button on the camera - nada.

I've tried having the 580 set as both Master and Slave and there's no difference in response.

Basically - the camera is not talking to the transmitter.

Any suggestions (she said - desperate for help and short on time)? :dunno

Thanks

Dan7312 · April 2, 2010

For a radio trigger you should have the off/master/slave set to off, not master or slave. That switch is for when you are using Canon flashes or the ST-E2 to trigger flashes.

Master and Slave only affect the infrared flash/sensor built into the flash behind the reddish transparent plasic window on the front of the flash. When master is on the infrared flash sends a coded signal to all the other Canon flashes around it. If it's in slave it will respond to those coded signal. The coded signals tell each flash how bright to flash and, of course, to flash.

But if the 580 is working when you press the test button on the transmitter it sounds like the transmitter isn't recoginized the what the hot shoe on your camera is telling the transmitter.

Maybe the transmitter isn't making good contact with the hotshoe. You've probably already tried this, but just take the transmitter off and put it back on again. Carefully clean of the contacts on the transmitter, just a tiny bit of alcohol on a q-tip will do that.

Just to be sure the camera is working as it should have you tried putting the flash directly on the camera? If that doesn't work then the camera has a problem.

If that does work then it sounds like the transmitter or does not understand the signals the pins on the hot shoe are sending to it. Does Cameron have a site where you can check compatibility with your camera?

That's all I can think of offhand to try.

Dan

Snowgirl wrote:

Hi - I had posted this in my shooting bikes thread but thought it should have a thread of its own.

I bought a set of radio triggers (Cameron) to use with my 580EXII (Canon) flash and 40D camera. The trigger works when I push the 'test' button on the transmitter. However, when I push the shutter button on the camera - nada.

I've tried having the 580 set as both Master and Slave and there's no difference in response.

Basically - the camera is not talking to the transmitter.

Any suggestions (she said - desperate for help and short on time)?

Thanks

pathfinder · April 2, 2010

Snowgirl, I asked you in your other thread if you were planning to shoot the 580ex II in Manual Mode and got no answer - http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=1360211&postcount=8

I will ask you again. Are you aware ETTL will not work with standard PWs?

That can be an advantage, but you do need your flash in Manual mode, and I would suggest your camera be in Manual mode as well. Keep you shutter speed less than native flash synch speed which should be 1/200th or 1/250th with Canon DSLRs.

PWs can also be triggered by a PC cord from the camera body.

Snowgirl · April 2, 2010

pathfinder wrote:

Snowgirl, I asked you in your other thread if you were planning to shoot the 580ex II in Manual Mode and got no answer - http://www.dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=1360211&postcount=8

I will ask you again. Are you aware ETTL will not work with standard PWs?

That can be an advantage, but you do need your flash in Manual mode, and I would suggest your camera be in Manual mode as well. Keep you shutter speed less than native flash synch speed which should be 1/200th or 1/250th with Canon DSLRs.

PWs can also be triggered by a PC cord from the camera body.

Hi Pathfinder. Actually - I did answer your question with a definite "yes" - will be using in manual mode. I have experimented with various settings to no avail.

I took Dan's suggestion and cleaned the contacts just in case. Nada.

I put everything in manual mode and made sure the Master/Slave choice was turned Off.

Still - the test button works, through the camera does not.:cry

I put the flash directly on the camera and it fired just fine - so the camera / hot shoe is working. Obviously there's a communication gap between the camera and the transmitter - but I'm totally at a loss.

Here's a link to the manufacturer's website:
http://www.boothphoto.com/prod_detail.cfm?PRODSELECT=12&PAGESELECT=prod_detail_data.cfm

It's the first set at the top of the page.

Dan7312 · April 2, 2010

Hmmm, I think you are in a bad place:cry

Either the part of the transmitter that listens to the hotshoe is broken or the the transmitter doesn't support your camera.

From the picture it looks like this transmitter supports a sync cable, like Pathfinder said. But not all cameras have a flash sync out, and you would need the cable if it did.

I think you will have to get a human at Booth to confirm the transmitter is compatible with your camera. If it is, then it needs to be fixed. If not it needs to be exchanged.

One last thing I can think of, does the transmitter have a switch to choose between sync cable or hot shoe?

A last gasp is if there is a nearby photo store where you could get a Canon flash extension cable... if that would reach out far enough for you.

Sorry, but I'm fresh out of idea's for getting you on the air today.

Snowgirl · April 2, 2010

Dan7312 wrote:

Hmmm, I think you are in a bad place:cry

Either the part of the transmitter that listens to the hotshoe is broken or the the transmitter doesn't support your camera.

From the picture it looks like this transmitter supports a sync cable, like Pathfinder said. But not all cameras have a flash sync out, and you would need the cable if it did.

I think you will have to get a human at Booth to confirm the transmitter is compatible with your camera. If it is, then it needs to be fixed. If not it needs to be exchanged.

One last thing I can think of, does the transmitter have a switch to choose between sync cable or hot shoe?

A last gasp is if there is a nearby photo store where you could get a Canon flash extension cable... if that would reach out far enough for you.

Sorry, but I'm fresh out of idea's for getting you on the air today.

Thanks. I do have a Canon cable - it's about 3' long - not quite enough - although it works if I use my bracket. I had hoped to get the flash further away than that - but c'est la vie for today. It's Good Friday so nothing's open today.

Tomorrow I'll be on the phone to the photo store I bought it from (50 miles away) - they SAID it was ok for my Canon 40D but who knows??

I'm just hoping I don't have to drive all the way back up there - other things in the works on spring week-ends, of course. Drat.

Thanks for your suggestions - greatly appreciated.

adbsgicom · April 2, 2010

Snowgirl, try to contact the manufacturer as well. Don't know about your camera store, but sometimes the folks in them don't know the details as well as we'd like.

pathfinder · April 2, 2010

Snowgirl wrote:

Hi Pathfinder. Actually - I did answer your question with a definite "yes" - will be using in manual mode. I have experimented with various settings to no avail.

I took Dan's suggestion and cleaned the contacts just in case. Nada.

I put everything in manual mode and made sure the Master/Slave choice was turned Off.

Still - the test button works, through the camera does not.:cry

I put the flash directly on the camera and it fired just fine - so the camera / hot shoe is working. Obviously there's a communication gap between the camera and the transmitter - but I'm totally at a loss.

Here's a link to the manufacturer's website:
http://www.boothphoto.com/prod_detail.cfm?PRODSELECT=12&PAGESELECT=prod_detail_data.cfm

It's the first set at the top of the page.

If the flash works on the camera, but does not work off camera due to the wireless controller's failure or lack of a good hot shoe to pc cord adapter, I would suggest shooting folks with their bikes in the shade, using the 580ex ii on camera as fill flash. The ETTL II should work quite nicely in that mode. Just keep your camera in Manual mode, and consider using your flash in High Speed Synch. This will let you control the exposure for the subjects separate from the exposure for the background, which can be quite helpful.

I don't think the 40D has a PC connection - I know my 50D does not ( It does but not on the front of the camera; it is on the left side under the rubber gasket door). A hot shoe to PC connection adapters can be found on the web. Don't know if your local camera store has one or not, but I would hope so. Then a standard PC cord and a second PC cord to hot shoe adapter could trigger the 580ex off camera for you.

Snowgirl · April 2, 2010

pathfinder wrote:

If the flash works on the camera, but does not work off camera due to the wireless controller's failure or lack of a good hot shoe to pc cord adapter, I would suggest shooting folks with their bikes in the shade, using the 580ex ii on camera as fill flash. The ETTL II should work quite nicely in that mode. Just keep your camera in Manual mode, and consider using your flash in High Speed Synch. This will let you control the exposure for the subjects separate from the exposure for the background, which can be quite helpful.

I don't think the 40D has a PC connection - I know my 50D does not. A hot shoe to PC connection adapters can be found on the web. Don't know if your local camera store has one or not, but I would hope so. Then a standard PC cord and a second PC cord to hot shoe adapter could trigger the 580ex off camera for you.

You're right - the 40D does not have a PC connection. I do have a double-ended hot-shoe cord that I can use with my bracket set-up.

The problem I will have with the bike shoot is that it's a wide open field with no shade. I went over and checked it again this afternoon to be sure.

My sense of urgency today was a baby shoot I wanted to do using the flash for some fill to augment natural light from a window.

I have lots of time until the bike shoot. But I have another baby shoot next week so I'm hoping to get this issue resolved by then.

I'm definitely calling the manufacturer on MOnday if possible.

Thanks everyone for your efforts and thoughts.

MarkW · April 4, 2010

Snowgirl wrote:

You're right - the 40D does not have a PC connection. I do have a double-ended hot-shoe cord that I can use with my bracket set-up.

The problem I will have with the bike shoot is that it's a wide open field with no shade. I went over and checked it again this afternoon to be sure.

My sense of urgency today was a baby shoot I wanted to do using the flash for some fill to augment natural light from a window.

I have lots of time until the bike shoot. But I have another baby shoot next week so I'm hoping to get this issue resolved by then.

I'm definitely calling the manufacturer on MOnday if possible.

Thanks everyone for your efforts and thoughts.

The 40D and the 50d does in fact have a built in pc connection located on the left side of the camera body (viewing the camera as if you were looking through the viewfinder). You have to lift up the front rubber flap to get to it.

Before you go spending for sync cords I have a question about how you're connecting the flash to the receiver. According to the website you listed it states:

"Its transmitter comes with a hot shoe mount for on camera use and a plug in PC cord for large format cameras. The receiver has a standard 6.3mm sync jack (3.5mm reducer included)."

It appears this trigger is made to be used with studio flashes and won't work with hotshot flashes without adapters. Did you buy an additional adapter for change the 6.3mm/3.5mm sync plug to a PC connector? The PC connector is what would connect to the side of the 580EX. Is there any way you can take pictures of how you have everything setup?

pathfinder · April 4, 2010

MarkW wrote:

The 40D and the 50d does in fact have a built in pc connection located on the left side of the camera body (viewing the camera as if you were looking through the viewfinder). You have to lift up the front rubber flap to get to it.

Thanks for correcting me - I did a quick perusal of my 50D at work, and forgot the connections on the left side that I only use for a remote release.

PC connections were always on the front surface of the camera or beneath the film winder on the upper right rear.

Why would I consult a manual on a camera I have used for years:D

Snowgirl · April 5, 2010

MarkW wrote:

The 40D and the 50d does in fact have a built in pc connection located on the left side of the camera body (viewing the camera as if you were looking through the viewfinder). You have to lift up the front rubber flap to get to it.

Before you go spending for sync cords I have a question about how you're connecting the flash to the receiver. According to the website you listed it states:

"Its transmitter comes with a hot shoe mount for on camera use and a plug in PC cord for large format cameras. The receiver has a standard 6.3mm sync jack (3.5mm reducer included)."

It appears this trigger is made to be used with studio flashes and won't work with hotshot flashes without adapters. Did you buy an additional adapter for change the 6.3mm/3.5mm sync plug to a PC connector? The PC connector is what would connect to the side of the 580EX. Is there any way you can take pictures of how you have everything setup?

True Mark - like Pathfinder I didn't look closely enough for a PC connector. But that said - the flash works - I had to get an adapter to connect the receiver to the flash - but the transmitter just slides onto the hotshoe. The transmitter and receiver talk to each other ok and the receiver triggers the flash when the transmitter's test button is pushed. BUT my camera is not talking to the transmitter through the hot shoe connection.

I had an extra hotshoe adaptor and I even tried putting that between the camera's hotshoe and the transmitters foot - didn't work either.

Looks like I'm driving to Moncton tomorrow :cry - back to the camera shop.

MarkW · April 5, 2010

Snowgirl wrote:

True Mark - like Pathfinder I didn't look closely enough for a PC connector. But that said - the flash works - I had to get an adapter to connect the receiver to the flash - but the transmitter just slides onto the hotshoe. The transmitter and receiver talk to each other ok and the receiver triggers the flash when the transmitter's test button is pushed. BUT my camera is not talking to the transmitter through the hot shoe connection.

I had an extra hotshoe adaptor and I even tried putting that between the camera's hotshoe and the transmitters foot - didn't work either.

Looks like I'm driving to Moncton tomorrow :cry - back to the camera shop.

Well it certainly looks like you've exhausted all possibilities. Bummer that it didn't work out of the box. Hopefully they'll exchange it out for you tomorrow.

JohnBiggs · April 12, 2010

Try the cable from camera PC connector to the transmitter. I do this with my camera anyways to keep the hotshoe free.

John

Snowgirl · April 12, 2010

JohnBiggs wrote:

Try the cable from camera PC connector to the transmitter. I do this with my camera anyways to keep the hotshoe free.

John

Thanks, I'm off to the camera shop in the morning to get a cable.

JohnBiggs · April 12, 2010

Snowgirl wrote:

Thanks, I'm off to the camera shop in the morning to get a cable.

Well if you are going to the shop that sold it to you, get a new transmitter from them. Still, grab a cable while you are there too.

Snowgirl · April 13, 2010

JohnBiggs wrote:

Well if you are going to the shop that sold it to you, get a new transmitter from them. Still, grab a cable while you are there too.

Thanks John. I returned everything - they didn't have any to exchange.

So now I'm trying to decide (since my emergency is over and I have time to wait for delivery) whether to order a Cactus Wizard V4 set from the USA for $39 plus shipping and duty or through the camera shop for $139 + sales tax - hmmm, tough choice - or something else. Sadly Pocket Wizards are out of my snack bracket at the moment.

JohnBiggs · April 14, 2010

Snowgirl wrote:

So now I'm trying to decide (since my emergency is over and I have time to wait for delivery) whether to order a Cactus Wizard V4 set from the USA for $39 plus shipping and duty or through the camera shop for $139 + sales tax - hmmm, tough choice - or something else. Sadly Pocket Wizards are out of my snack bracket at the moment.

I absolutely love the alien bees cybersyncs. The transmitter can slide on the hot shoe or connect via cable and they include the cable for free. The receivers come with 3 or 4 different cables for hooking up as well. I don't know if others come with all the cables but it is something to consider as cables can get pricey.

Cybersyncs are insanely simple to use. Just one button on the whole thing. Everyone who tries them loves them.

But yeah, you will still have the state shipping problem and they cost a little more than Cactus. The plus to me is AA batteries in the cybersync (I already carry spare AA for my lights so I don't need to worry about another battery type). The cybersync receiver looks about the same size as the cactus. The channel selector is easier to use on cybersync. And finally the cybersync receivers can also be used as a repeater if you want to really extend the range.

Two things I like about the cactus (I haven't used them) The hotshoe for the flash, and the ability for it to act as a flash stand. Those seem like great features. The cybersync receivers don't have an easy way to hold them to a flashstand so I end up using bongo ties.

Good luck

pyry · April 14, 2010

Snowgirl wrote:

Thanks John. I returned everything - they didn't have any to exchange.

So now I'm trying to decide (since my emergency is over and I have time to wait for delivery) whether to order a Cactus Wizard V4 set from the USA for $39 plus shipping and duty or through the camera shop for $139 + sales tax - hmmm, tough choice - or something else. Sadly Pocket Wizards are out of my snack bracket at the moment.

I have a set of Cactus V4s and they are fine on my 20D. I'd wish for better range on them, but they do get the job done.

Now, I know this comes a bit late, but does your flash fire when it's sitting directly on the hotshoe? I was thinking of the custom function that allows turning the main light off...

Snowgirl · April 14, 2010

pyry wrote:

I have a set of Cactus V4s and they are fine on my 20D. I'd wish for better range on them, but they do get the job done.

Now, I know this comes a bit late, but does your flash fire when it's sitting directly on the hotshoe? I was thinking of the custom function that allows turning the main light off...

Hi. Thanks. Yes, I did check the flash on the hotshoe (to make sure the hotshoe on the camera was working) and it fired just fine. So I returned the ones I had and am now moving forward to either the Cactus or the Cybersyncs.

Thanks everyone. This is the greatest place for getting help.

Art Scott · April 14, 2010

Here is the trigger I have used for over a year and also the ebay reseller:

http://tinyurl.com/y488ns7

Good Luck

Snowgirl · April 14, 2010

Art Scott wrote:

Here is the trigger I have used for over a year and also the ebay reseller:

http://tinyurl.com/y488ns7

Good Luck

Thanks Art. I meant to include that in my list of "options".

I still can't get over the $100 difference in price on the Cactus triggers between the USA and here. Can you spell r-i-p????

Radio trigger question

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