Looking for new PC

HarlanBear · September 5, 2007

I'm looking to upgrade my 4+ year old PC for normal computer stuff and to run PSCS3, Painter, etc. Nothing too fancy. And in researching name brand stuff I keep coming back to this HP:

Model: a6130n

Specs:
dual-core 2.6GHz AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 5000+ processor, Level 2 cache
3GB 667MHz DDR2 SDRAM (expandable to 4)
400GB hard drive ( I keep pictures and music on an external drive)
DVD/CD burner, with lightScribe
NVIDIA® GeForce™ 6150 SE graphics card, up to 632MB video memory - 128dedicated
15-in1 media card reader
6xUSB 2.0, 2xIEEE1394, 2xPS/2 ports
PCI-Express x16 slot
Slot for HP Pocket Media Hard Drive (which I'm thinking I can use for PS scratchdisk)

This system sells for $680.00 off the shelf at Circuity City & Best Buy, etc.

Putting aside the possible Vista problems, this seems like a good deal for my use.

Question is, am I missing something? Still looking at possibly having one built and even looking a bit at Mac (please no "buy a Mac" responses. I very much understand. But that is for another thread. Want to see about PCs here)

I'd appreciate any input from computer gurus out there.

Thanks!

kini62 · September 5, 2007

Other than the kind of weak video card and the fact that it seems to "suck" from system ram (based on your description) it seems like a lot of computer for the money.

Gene

HarlanBear wrote:

I'm looking to upgrade my 4+ year old PC for normal computer stuff and to run PSCS3, Painter, etc. Nothing too fancy. And in researching name brand stuff I keep coming back to this HP:

Model: a6130n

Specs:
dual-core 2.6GHz AMD Athlon™ 64 X2 5000+ processor, Level 2 cache
3GB 667MHz DDR2 SDRAM (expandable to 4)
400GB hard drive ( I keep pictures and music on an external drive)
DVD/CD burner, with lightScribe
NVIDIA® GeForce™ 6150 SE graphics card, up to 632MB video memory - 128dedicated
15-in1 media card reader
6xUSB 2.0, 2xIEEE1394, 2xPS/2 ports
PCI-Express x16 slot
Slot for HP Pocket Media Hard Drive (which I'm thinking I can use for PS scratchdisk)

This system sells for $680.00 off the shelf at Circuity City & Best Buy, etc.

Putting aside the possible Vista problems, this seems like a good deal for my use.

Question is, am I missing something? Still looking at possibly having one built and even looking a bit at Mac (please no "buy a Mac" responses. I very much understand. But that is for another thread. Want to see about PCs here)

I'd appreciate any input from computer gurus out there.

Thanks!

HarlanBear · September 5, 2007

kini62 wrote:

Other than the kind of weak video card and the fact that it seems to "suck" from system ram (based on your description) it seems like a lot of computer for the money.

Gene

Thanks Gene.

So upgrade the video card, eh? That kinda concerned me too. Any suggestions on that front?

Would certainly look into 4GB of RAM, as well.

Anything else sick out?

Pupator · September 5, 2007

HarlanBear wrote:

Thanks Gene.

So upgrade the video card, eh? That kinda concerned me too. Any suggestions on that front?

Would certainly look into 4GB of RAM, as well.

Anything else sick out?

Or, if you don't play high end video games (and I imagine you don't) just set the video card (in the BIOS) to only use its 128MB of dedicated memory and no more. Once you get the computer we can help you figure that out.

3GB of memory is plenty - I ran benchmarks on my computer with 2GB, 3GB, and 4GB and there was no improvement with 4GB.

Not my first choice for a processor, but a pretty good one.

I assume the hard drive is SATA 7200 RPM?

HarlanBear · September 5, 2007

Yes, SATA, 7200 rpm.

What about the fact that Vista hogs memory. I hear it takes about 1GB, so I'd really only have 2GB available for Photoshop, etc. Problem?

I'm really also considering a wait until Vista gets a service pak.

Pupator · September 5, 2007

HarlanBear wrote:

Yes, SATA, 7200 rpm.

What about the fact that Vista hogs memory. I hear it takes about 1GB, so I'd really only have 2GB available for Photoshop, etc. Problem?

I'm really also considering a wait until Vista gets a service pak.

Vista is stable. Very, very stable. I run it on two desktops and two notebooks and oversee its use on several other computers. The service pack likely isn't coming out for a while (Q1 2008 I think?) dispite some reports to the contrary.

The computer I'm using right now has IE7 (with multiple tabs open), Vista sidebar, Pidgin, Windows Task Manager, Outlook, and Nero (burning a DVD). 1.01 GB of RAM are being used. I've tested this system with 2,3, and 4 GB of RAM and found 4 to be not at all helpful for the cost.

YMMV, my 2 cents, etc.

HarlanBear · September 5, 2007

Thanks so much. Pupator. Certainly feeling better about the system and Vista. Really no reason to wait, I'm thinking, so maybe there's a new computer in my not so distant future.

And thanks for the offer to help on the new purchase. I certainly be in touch.

Much appreciated.

jay · September 5, 2007

Pupator wrote:

Vista is stable. Very, very stable. I run it on two desktops and two notebooks and oversee its use on several other computers. The service pack likely isn't coming out for a while (Q1 2008 I think?) dispite some reports to the contrary.

The computer I'm using right now has IE7 (with multiple tabs open), Vista sidebar, Pidgin, Windows Task Manager, Outlook, and Nero (burning a DVD). 1.01 GB of RAM are being used. I've tested this system with 2,3, and 4 GB of RAM and found 4 to be not at all helpful for the cost.

YMMV, my 2 cents, etc.

HarlanBear · September 5, 2007

jay wrote:

I take it this is a bash. Anything useful, Jay?

Lovesong · September 5, 2007

I think that Jim is rather amused by the Pro-Vista response that Pupator gave. The fact is, in your shoes, I would figure out how much money you want to spend, and then go online. Best Buy and Circuit City are large corporations that sell computers that are generally over-priced, under-powered, come with an excess of crapware and designed to meet only basic needs.

If you're looking to spend a certain amount, and are certain you want a PC (by the way, if you live anywhere near a computer store, or, better yet, an Apple store, check those out-- PLEASE), go to an online store such as Dell, and built yourself a machine with better CPU, hard drives in the array that you want, a decent video card (PS will take advantage of it- think at least a 6800 or ATI 800XT), as much RAM as you want, and XP- yes XP.

Despite the "WOW" that Redmond trumps around, Vista is a glossed-over version of XP, with some bells and wistles, hogs RAM and resources, annoyingly reminds you that you're about to do this or that (Are you sure you want to do that), and there is still a bunch of hardware that doesn't work with it. I have the thing installed on my MacBook Pro, and it has been on about twice since it came out.

HarlanBear · September 6, 2007

Thank you, Lovesong. Definate food for thought.

Being in TV produciton, I've worked on both PCs and Macs for many, many years and each has their strengths and weaknesses. I am certainly cautious about any MS ver1 OS, knowing their history. But don't really like to pay a premium for iLife. But at the end of the day I want to use the computer as a tool, so there you go.

So I'm still researching each. Thankfully, I think there may be a computer store or two around here in San Francisco somewhere.

Thanks again for your help and useful input.

Pupator · September 6, 2007

This'll be my last post in this thread since, as usual, you cannot have a conversation on dgrin/DDGear that doesn't dissolve into a "pro-mac/and anti-MS" party.

Just a few things:

Lovesong wrote:

I think that Jim is rather amused by the Pro-Vista response that Pupator gave.

And as the OP pointed out - he had nothing useful or factual to offer.

The fact is, in your shoes, I would figure out how much money you want to spend, and then go online. Best Buy and Circuit City are large corporations that sell computers that are generally over-priced, under-powered, come with an excess of crapware and designed to meet only basic needs.

If you're looking to spend a certain amount, and are certain you want a PC (by the way, if you live anywhere near a computer store, or, better yet, an Apple store, check those out-- PLEASE), go to an online store such as Dell, and built yourself a machine with better CPU, hard drives in the array that you want, a decent video card (PS will take advantage of it- think at least a 6800 or ATI 800XT), as much RAM as you want, and XP- yes XP.

HA! I'm not sure where you're getting your info, but Dell is the king of crapware! While you can (by paying attention to sales and coupons) get a good price at Deal (sometimes/often better than BBY/CC) you certainly wouldn't shop there to have less "junk" installed on your computer. If you do your homework (like the OP has done) and pay attention to specs, you never have to worry about buying under-powered. And I'll guess with that sort of research he isn't going to fall into the over-priced trap either.

Despite the "WOW" that Redmond trumps around, Vista is a glossed-over version of XP, with some bells and wistles, hogs RAM and resources, annoyingly reminds you that you're about to do this or that (Are you sure you want to do that), and there is still a bunch of hardware that doesn't work with it.

If it's a glossed-over XP (which I dispute) what's the difference between that and Mac OS 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, etc? I gave a listing of the programs I was using earlier and the amount of RAM being used - it certainly seemed like a reasonable amount to me, but what do I know?

It's more stable than XP and the "annoying" User Access Control that so troubles you can be turned of in a few clicks. Between my multiple computers I use 4 different printers, two scanners, lots of hard drives, digital cameras -- I've encountered two things that didn't work with Vista (ATI All-In-Wonder 2006 TV Tuner, and an HP large format printer).

I have the thing installed on my MacBook Pro, and it has been on about twice since it came out.

Wow. You've used it twice. You are indeed quite the Vista expert.

Lovesong · September 6, 2007

Pupator wrote:

This'll be my last post in this thread since, as usual, you cannot have a conversation on dgrin/DDGear that doesn't dissolve into a "pro-mac/and anti-MS" party.

You're probably right. But me being a mac-fag, and suggesting that he try a mac, doesn't negate the fact that you're a blind PC zealot, and from the sounds of it, relatively adamant about it too.

Pupator wrote:

HA! I'm not sure where you're getting your info, but Dell is the king of crapware! While you can (by paying attention to sales and coupons) get a good price at Deal (sometimes/often better than BBY/CC) you certainly wouldn't shop there to have less "junk" installed on your computer. If you do your homework (like the OP has done) and pay attention to specs, you never have to worry about buying under-powered. And I'll guess with that sort of research he isn't going to fall into the over-priced trap either.

Sure, Dells suck as much as anyone else. One thing that is nice is that you can select NOT to have any other software installed on a computer (it costs an extra $5. You should have researched that yourself before posting.

Pupator wrote:

If it's a glossed-over XP (which I dispute) what's the difference between that and Mac OS 10.1, 10.2, 10.3, etc? I gave a listing of the programs I was using earlier and the amount of RAM being used - it certainly seemed like a reasonable amount to me, but what do I know?

Really? You're asking what the difference between Vista and 10.1-10.3 is?
Let's say that you are aware that 10.x is based on Unix (I'm giving you some credit here), and that you're basically comparing the transition between 9.2 and 10.x to going from XP to Vista. Vista is based on the same architechture as XP, does little different- nice sidebar, and search function, has aero (if you can push it), and includes a slightly better photo sorting program- to put this in mac terms, XP now has widgets/Dashboard, Spotlight, Expose (kinda), and iPhoto (sorta).
When 10.0 was introduced, it was the mac os rewritten from scratch and based on BSD. I doubt you can compare the two things here.

If you're saying that transitions from say 10.3 to 10.4 was the same as from XP to Vista, then my one objection would be that 10.3 and 10.4 are still the same operating system (they are not touted as the new thing! and are not called 11.x). That, and they come every 2 years on average, as a single package, and cost a quarter of what you'd pay for Vista.

Pupator wrote:

It's more stable than XP and the "annoying" User Access Control that so troubles you can be turned of in a few clicks. Between my multiple computers I use 4 different printers, two scanners, lots of hard drives, digital cameras -- I've encountered two things that didn't work with Vista (ATI All-In-Wonder 2006 TV Tuner, and an HP large format printer).

Yup. Add to that list an LG chocholate, a Minolta 2430 DL color laser printer, and oh yeah... an Apple Airport base station.

Pupator wrote:

Wow. You've used it twice. You are indeed quite the Vista expert.

I never claimed to be one. That, and figurative speech tend to escape you a bit. Trust me- I gave it the best shot I could, and I'm rather computer-literate. At work, I have to use both PCs and Macs, and ALL the PCs in the entire department (University setting) are still running XP. It's not like we can't afford the license for Vista, it's that so few of the programs that we run will actually work with it.

claudermilk · September 6, 2007

I'll ignore the childish spat and address the OP's question.

The basic specs look ok, especially at that price. Brand of the box?

The video card is probably the weakest link & I'd disable it and get a decent one from Newegg. You said the drive is SATA, which is good, but is it SATA I (now obsolete) or SATA II (the new hotness--and most new drives are this format)? How many SATA channels are available? I'd assume 4, but it pays to check.

The desirability, and stability of Vista is obviously hotly debated, I'll leave it to you to decide which way to go there.

HarlanBear · September 6, 2007

Thanks Chris. You can imagine my surprise when I saw all the debate this morning. NOT ! While some want to argue about the size of their hammer, I just want to hang a picture.

Anyway, It's a Hewlett Packard, which I feel is as good as any, and I'm currently on my second one.

Drive is SATA II and I'll check on channels.

Vista does concern me. Everything 1.0 concerns me.

As for swapping the video card, is that a fairly simple operation? Like adding memory boards?

Thanks for your help. BTW, not committed to anything quite yet.

entropysedge · September 6, 2007

Personally, i've not had any problems with Vista and i purchased my HP notebook with it at the end of February. I did have to wait until mid-March for driver updates from Epson for my scanner, however I had no problems with any of my programs running on Vista (and the copy of CS3 I just installed is running VERY well)

Swapping out the memory card is easy, if you've done memory upgrades ... and as Chris said, check out NewEgg.com for the card, you'll spend less there

HarlanBear · September 6, 2007

entropysedge wrote:

Personally, i've not had any problems with Vista and i purchased my HP notebook with it at the end of February. I did have to wait until mid-March for driver updates from Epson for my scanner, however I had no problems with any of my programs running on Vista (and the copy of CS3 I just installed is running VERY well)

Thanks, Louise. Appreciate the input.

Swapping out the memory card is easy, if you've done memory upgrades ... and as Chris said, check out NewEgg.com for the card, you'll spend less there

Yep. Done memory cards. Any suggestions for the system I'm looking at? What about the 6800 or ATI800XT as suggeated by Lovesong in this thread.

entropysedge · September 6, 2007

HarlanBear · September 7, 2007

Thanks again, Louise. Very informative.

entropysedge · September 7, 2007

Glad to be of help

claudermilk · September 10, 2007

If newer HPs are anything like the one I have, swapping out the video card is simple. They should also be darn reliable. I have an old Pavilion (600MHz screamer!) running FC2 as a web server now. It's still going strong after 5 years as my primary workstation and another 5 as webserver (that's running 24/7).

aerialphoto · September 10, 2007

I'm not a huge fan of the big name machines anymore. There's another alternative, ask around (like you are) for the kind of specs you might need, then find shop for a reputable builder in your area. You won't get name brand, but you'll no doubt get decent brand equipment. You can even read up on newegg.com about the various types of motherboards, drives, memory, video cards, etc - and see a slew of comments about everything out there.

FWIW Friday afternoon I built up a new PC from an ASUS-brand motherboard, with an Intel Core 2 Quad 2.4 Ghz processor, 4gb of higher-end RAM, and an Nvidia-based 8800gtx video card. The board is capable of up to 8gb of RAM, I think it supports up to 8 SATA II drives, and 2 IDE drives. Typically I have two internal drives and two mounted in removeable cartridges for data storage.

For PS-CS3 the difference between using this and other machines I've used is night and day. I'm dealing with huge aerial images, but it works as efficiently as if they were 6mp digital files.

HarlanBear · September 10, 2007

Thanks, Chris. I am a fan of HP computers since I've had three now and no problems I didn't cause myself. With the one I have now, which is nothing special and 4+ years old, I've been able to run PSCS2, PSCS3 and After Effects with really no problem. But it's getting old, crowded and very slow since I only have 1GB memory. Which is why I'm looking at replacing it. I added the memory myself and was amazed how easy it was, so the graphics cards seems easy enough.

And thanks, Scott, for the input on building one. In fact, I'm checking online now for local builders to see what the market and specs are like. This, too, is an option.

I'm a research freak, so this all may take a while. But learning much, thanks to you folks and the SM community. Much appreciated.:D

claudermilk · September 11, 2007

Building your own is much easier these days than in the past. I used build my own back in the DOS5 days--it was a PITA to get everything working together then. My current box is a DIY with all the parts sourced from Newegg. It took less time to assemble than it did for XP to install. Everything worked the first time. Things have come a long way.

dogwood · September 11, 2007

My two-cents-- the specs on the machine you list are decent and certainly attractively priced. I've used HP's/Compaq's for years now and find the motherboards are their weakness. That said, I did buy an HP notebook (to replace my aging Compaq) about six months ago, so I'm definitely not anti-HP. I did find my ol' HP didn't come with a very good power supply either-- but I like to add LOTS of power hungry accessories.

My main work computer these days though is a home-built system mainly for the power supply and motherboard.

And personally, I've had no problems with Vista. I'm running that on the notebook with 2GB RAM and using Photo Mechanics and PSCS3 for my digital photography workflow in the field and it works great for me.

Oh yeah-- it's VERY minor, but the HP developed Lightscribe is AWESOME! Of course, you can buy the burners seperately for around $40, so don't buy a machine just for Lightscribe. But it is so cool-- I can't tell you how many clients say something like, "Ooohhh, love the picture on on the CD". You'll be able to create the coolest CD's/DVD's you've seen-- it actually burns your custom label right onto the CD surface so it looks really, really nice (in my opinion).

entropysedge · September 11, 2007

^^^ I've had the same reaction (to the Lightscribe discs) from customers as well

HarlanBear · September 13, 2007

I'm wondering if it's worth the extra money to jump from the AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000+ to the Intel Core 2 Quad (Q6600 for example)?

Any thoughts on that?

Thanks.

cletus · September 13, 2007

HarlanBear wrote:

I'm wondering if it's worth the extra money to jump from the AMD Athlon 64 X2 5000+ to the Intel Core 2 Quad (Q6600 for example)?

Any thoughts on that?

Thanks.

It would depend on how Photoshop is multithreaded. If it can use more than two threads then the Quad will probably give you a good jump in performance. If it's limited to two threads (which is what seems to be the case from a quick google search) and you don't have a whole lot else running on the system, then the dual to quad jump might not buy you much.

Looking for new PC

Comments