In need of an outside opinion

Dooginfif20 · December 21, 2008

So I currently have a Nikon D60 and though I love the camera I find it limited. It has no bracketing function, can only be used with AF-S lenses, and many other things. I have researched and I have come to a split. I have the money for a D300, but I am not certain if I want to spend that much. I also looked at the D90 and its slightly smaller, lighter, shots HD video, has live view (heard it was slow though), and also has a 12.3mp sensor like the D300. I know they aren't the same sensor, but they are close. The guy at the camera store says he has a D300 and if the D90 was out when he bought his D300 he would have gotten a D90. Now I am not sure if this was truth or his way of trying to sell me a camera that he has in the store versus a camera he would have to order in. Now I am looking at photography with the possibility of being a part time job in the background, but is the difference between the D90 and D300 going to be worth the money difference? Right now I am thinking about selling my D60 and all the lenses and filters and buying a D90 which comes with a 18-105mm lens, but I am also looking at buying the Tamron 18-270mm lens at the same time. I am open to all opinions. Even those who think I should change to Canon.:deal

Cygnus Studios · December 21, 2008

If you want video, go with the D90. If you want a camera, go with the D300. They are quite different in ability. The 300, 700, and D3 are in a class amongst themselves.

bosco0633 · December 21, 2008

I too was in the same situation as you. I however, had no camera and was deciding between the 2 cameras.

My local store is a great wealth of knowledge and the store owner told me that the D90 under ideal circumstances can take a better picture than the D300.

I read every online article about both cameras and really wanted to like the D90. The two things that made the decision for the D3000 were 1. the d300 is better for sports. I have two young boys just getting into sports and 2. the D300 is a more sturdy body and weather proof with rubber seals. We travel alot to beaches and what not, and thought that the D300 would better fit my needs.

The D90 has scene modes which I thought would be good for me as a rookie to photography, however, the person teaching me photography shoots with a D300 and I thought that it would be great opportunity to shoot with the same camera.

From what I have read about the D90 the video function has some serious limitations so I wouldnt make this your deciding factor.

I think it will come down to choice in the long run, however, for me the d300 was the right choice, and I am so glad that I got it. the learning curve has been crazy but I am enjoying every second with it.

Hope this helps you a bit.

sherijohnson · December 21, 2008

I don't think you should choose any DSLR based on video because if you really want to take video there are better ways to do it without a still camera. I just thought you might want to think about that.

Buy the camera that has the functions and features you feel you will need or want to learn.

I compared a few cameras that I was considering and I did not choose to buy the D90 even though it was on my list.

jonh68 · December 21, 2008

Get the D300 if you want some of it's features like metal body, more dedicated controls etc. The reviews for the D90 tend to lean towards the IQ being slightly better for the D90 as Nikon has refined the technology from the D300. I agree with the camera guy: I would choose a D90 over the D300 if I had to choose today.

Get the D90 or save more for the D700.

Dooginfif20 · December 22, 2008

I greatly appreciate everyones opinions! To make sure I am clear when I stated that D90 does HD video I actually most likely won't ever use it. I was just stating one thing that the D90 had over the D300. The good thing also with the D90 is that it comes with a lens and for the price of the D300 I can get the D90 and the Tamron lens as well. Anyone else?

jonh68 · December 22, 2008

If photography is going to be a potential p/t gig, I would not spend the money on the tamron. We can't make a lens recommendation because we don't what you like to shoot, but you would be better off saving your money for a 2.8 zoom or even buying a 50 mm 1.8 that can be had for $100.

swintonphoto · December 22, 2008

Get whatever is less expensive. Both will give you fabulous results. Spend any excess $$ on some nice lenses. Those will make the MOST difference.

angevin1 · December 22, 2008

Eh, tough choice...glad to hear you at least have the choice!

Your avatar says you're in Seattle, so I would venture a guess that somebody somewhere there has both of those in stock to try out, even if just at the counter....I recently went over to my local Ritz with my own lenses and CF card and tried a D700 in store...easy.

You could make a list of things you need in a camera and things you want in a camera and see which fits your list best. I will say reading one other poster talk about weather sealing is a good thing to look at!! And I have to agree about the video thing...though many many folks are going for the new Canon offering due to its HD video...and pricing.

Good luck and have fun with the choosing!

tom

Qarik · December 22, 2008

Cygnus Studios wrote:

If you want video, go with the D90. If you want a camera, go with the D300. They are quite different in ability. The 300, 700, and D3 are in a class amongst themselves.

I have to diagree here. The d700 and d3 are in the a similar class. The d300 and the d90 are in a similiar class with respect to image quality and iso performance.

If money is a factor then the d90 is your best value in the whole nikon lineup. It shoots like a d300 with exception to fps and metal/sealed body.

ziggy53 · December 22, 2008

Qarik wrote:

I have to diagree here. The d700 and d3 are in the a similar class. The d300 and the d90 are in a similiar class with respect to image quality and iso performance.

If money is a factor then the d90 is your best value in the whole nikon lineup. It shoots like a d300 with exception to fps and metal/sealed body.

The Nikon D300 also has a potentially better AF system versus the D90. (Multi-CAM3500 DX vs Multi-CAM1000)

The D300 has:

ISO 100 (in the boost settings)
1/8000th shutter speed
1/250th flash sync
100% coverage pentaprism
CPU and AI meter coupling

... all of which can make a difference if you need them. (Many people do need these things.)

Of these things the AF section, ISO 100 capability, faster flash sync, 100% viewfinder coverage and CPU and AI meter coupling would make enough of a difference to justify purchase of the D300, if I were in the market for a DX Nikon camera.

Dooginfif20 · December 22, 2008

Thank you for more responses! The question here is what camera is going to be more flexible as in with different types of shooting? Ziggy you always seems to have a ton of knowledge! Me still being somewhat of a newbie what is the difference in the two meterings and is the sensors of the two cameras a lot different? The autofocus of the D300 was something else that I thought pretty impressive as well. But compared to my D60 11 is better then 3. I dont really do too much sports shots or fast moving objects just yet so the fps doesn't really matter at this point, but it could in the future. If I chose to to get a D90 is the flash sync going to be that big of a disadvantage? Yes I went to Kits up here and they only had a D90. I live in Oak Harbor actually so its kind of a small store and they usually have to order things in. I have held a D90 and its deffinately heavier then my D60 and I was told that the D300 was a tad bit more which makes me wonder if the weight is going to be an issue. Also I have read that the ISO on the D90 was really good, but is the D300 that much better? I really appreciate everyones comments. I really look to you guys for more info about these things because some of you might have had the same questions!

ziggy53 · December 22, 2008

Dooginfif20 wrote:

... what is the difference in the two meterings and is the sensors of the two cameras a lot different? The autofocus of the D300 was something else that I thought pretty impressive as well. But compared to my D60 11 is better then 3. ...

The difference between CPU and AI meter coupling is when you try to use an older manual focus lens on the body (assuming the lens has the AI coupling). If the body will not meter AI lenses you would have to select manual mode for shutter speed and either guess the aperture or use an external light meter to set the aperture of the lens.

A CPU lens uses an electronic coupling to relay aperture information and other lens information including distance.

An excellent explanation of lens/body compatibility as well as the meaning behind the Nikon abbreviations:

http://www.nikonians.org/nikon/slr-lens.html

Dooginfif20 · December 22, 2008

ziggy53 wrote:

The difference between CPU and AI meter coupling is when you try to use an older manual focus lens on the body (assuming the lens has the AI coupling). If the body will not meter AI lenses you would have to select manual mode for shutter speed and either guess the aperture or use an external light meter to set the aperture of the lens.

A CPU lens uses an electronic coupling to relay aperture information and other lens information including distance.

An excellent explanation of lens/body compatibility as well as the meaning behind the Nikon abbreviations:

http://www.nikonians.org/nikon/slr-lens.html

Ziggy thanks again for the helpful info. I wish you lived out here so I could shadow you to get more indepth info. I think what it boils down to is I need to go and try them both out and see which I like best since they are both close to what I am looking for.

Cygnus Studios · December 22, 2008

D90 compared to D300 Scroll down to see side by side D90-D300.

Dooginfif20 · December 22, 2008

Cygnus Studios wrote:

D90 compared to D300 Scroll down to see side by side D90-D300.

Thanks for the post. I have read this before and it was one of the reasons I posted this thread. After talking to the guy at Kits he had told me that the sensors were the same and at that point I was pretty close to sold until I read that article. I guess I really need to go shoot both of them and see which one feels right to me. How is that D3?

MooreDriven · December 22, 2008

Dooginfif20 wrote:

So I currently have a Nikon D60 and though I love the camera I find it limited.

I think you need to define what those limits are, and determine which camera fits your needs best. Just a guess, but I think your saying you want a camera to grow into. I think that's the D300.

Dooginfif20 wrote:

The guy at the camera store says he has a D300 and if the D90 was out when he bought his D300 he would have gotten a D90.

He may like to take shots in the "auto" mode and not like the flexibility or complexity of the D300.

If you decide to stay with a DX format, then you can use your existing lenses. If not, you'll potentially have to start all over. I would not buy a 1st generation camera that has the capability to take video's. I'm not doubting that this is the future.

The D90 is a nice camera, it is lighter than the D300. Something to consider. But the D300 has so much more flexibility, is more rugged, and will provide you years of great shots. You asked about the D3. If your really thinking about going to this level, then your not seriously considering the D90. If your concerned about weight, then your not interested in the D3, so you may want to consider the D700, which is in the same body as the D300.

Good luck.

Dooginfif20 · December 24, 2008

MooreDriven wrote:

I think you need to define what those limits are, and determine which camera fits your needs best. Just a guess, but I think your saying you want a camera to grow into. I think that's the D300.

He may like to take shots in the "auto" mode and not like the flexibility or complexity of the D300.

If you decide to stay with a DX format, then you can use your existing lenses. If not, you'll potentially have to start all over. I would not buy a 1st generation camera that has the capability to take video's. I'm not doubting that this is the future.

The D90 is a nice camera, it is lighter than the D300. Something to consider. But the D300 has so much more flexibility, is more rugged, and will provide you years of great shots. You asked about the D3. If your really thinking about going to this level, then your not seriously considering the D90. If your concerned about weight, then your not interested in the D3, so you may want to consider the D700, which is in the same body as the D300.

Good luck.

Thanks for the comment. The camera store guy owns a D300 and he told me if he would have had the chance to buy a D90 he would have. The thing I am worried about is if I get the D90 will have upgradeitis if I don't go big enough. I bought my D60 and within a few months I knew that it wasn't enough of what I was looking for so I started puting money away for a D300. I went to the store for information on the D300 and to see if they had it in store to see it and I got thrown for a loop by being told that the D90 is more user friendly (which I would agree with) and is pretty close to the same thing as the D300 (which I don't really agree with). I think that I need to try them both out and see which one is more for me and weigh out the pros and cons. Oh and the only reason I said D3 was because I saw someones signature and was kind of joking around

. Thanks for your response and I am hoping here soon I will be able to let everyone know what I decided!

jonh68 · December 26, 2008

Dooginfif20 wrote:

Thanks for the comment. The camera store guy owns a D300 and he told me if he would have had the chance to buy a D90 he would have. The thing I am worried about is if I get the D90 will have upgradeitis if I don't go big enough.

When you buy the D300, you will see it's limitations and want the D700, and then....

If better IQ is wanted, better lenses will help more than the camera.

Dooginfif20 · December 26, 2008

jonh68 wrote:

When you buy the D300, you will see it's limitations and want the D700, and then....

If better IQ is wanted, better lenses will help more than the camera.

Haha so what you are saying is this is a never ending cycle? I think if I went with the D300 it would last a little longer then the D90 and probably keep me happier longer. Yes lenses are on my list but I am just trying to find a fast lens that isn't too much that I can use for all around work.

jonh68 · December 26, 2008

Dooginfif20 wrote:

Haha so what you are saying is this is a never ending cycle? I think if I went with the D300 it would last a little longer then the D90 and probably keep me happier longer. Yes lenses are on my list but I am just trying to find a fast lens that isn't too much that I can use for all around work.

Until you upgrade your lenses, your pics are not going to be any different regardless of your camera body. You will get far more out your money if you get better lenses than spending money on a camera body. A d60 with pro glass would smoke a D300 and a kit lens, given the photography skills are equal.

The lenses you are thinking about getting will look NO different on the D300 as it would the D60.

Dooginfif20 · December 26, 2008

jonh68 wrote:

Until you upgrade your lenses, your pics are not going to be any different regardless of your camera body. You will get far more out your money if you get better lenses than spending money on a camera body. A d60 with pro glass would smoke a D300 and a kit lens, given the photography skills are equal.

The lenses you are thinking about getting will look NO different on the D300 as it would the D60.

I am thankful for your comment. I have been spending all day looking at lenses and trying to decide between a great lens and the D90 or a good lens and the D300. I guess its going to come down to how much I can get the D300 body for if I went that route. Do you have any suggestions on lenses? I am looking for a wide angle zoom for a more all around. I plan on getting a better zoom for portraits later.

Art Scott · December 26, 2008

Quote:
<table width="100%" border="0" cellpadding="4" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr> <td class="alt2" style="border: 1px inset ;"> Originally Posted by jonh68
When you buy the D300, you will see it's limitations and want the D700, and then....

If better IQ is wanted, better lenses will help more than the camera.
</td> </tr> </tbody></table>

Dooginfif20 wrote:

Haha so what you are saying is this is a never ending cycle? I think if I went with the D300 it would last a little longer then the D90 and probably keep me happier longer. Yes lenses are on my list but I am just trying to find a fast lens that isn't too much that I can use for all around work.

I HAVE BEEN A real fan of the lenses in the realm of 24-70 and 70-210 (200 now) at f2.8......these 2 lenses have served me well over a 20+ yr time frame and for more than the 1st half of my pro shooting I was only using a 70-210 f2.8....portraits, weddings and also wildlife and concert photos.....a lot of my 35mm and ned format bodies wer / are still manual......so elctronics can make life somewhat easier until you loose your battery power then it is all over.....hence I still own some manual cams....and have film in the freezer also......my next lens purfchase needs to be something in the 10 - 22 real but it has to be usable on ff also ....it does not have to be 10-22mm prese...some where in that realm so it could be 12-20 or what I can find taht will work on ff also.....that is on the wide end...on the long end I realy need much longer than 200 so in the realm of 500 - 1000 primes and the 1000 will be only if I can find a benfactor to gift it to me :-}}}:D

jonh68 wrote:

Until you upgrade your lenses, your pics are not going to be any different regardless of your camera body. You will get far more out your money if you get better lenses than spending money on a camera body. A d60 with pro glass would smoke a D300 and a kit lens, given the photography skills are equal.

The lenses you are thinking about getting will look NO different on the D300 as it would the D60.

This is true especially in your case with being limited to a certain sect of Nikons lenses.......In your you need to move on up and that up being a D300.....and by the time the upgraditis resurfaces you will have a choice of (hopefully) a true D300 upgrade.....or you will have found the need for FF.....My suggestion is to buy lenses that are compatable with FF cams also so that if you get a chance to shoot a FF with your glass and own cf card you can do so to compare you lenses on both cams and your ability to use them.............

Dooginfif20 · December 26, 2008

Art Scott wrote:

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=4 width="100%" border=0> <TBODY><TR> <TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset"> Originally Posted by jonh68
When you buy the D300, you will see it's limitations and want the D700, and then....

If better IQ is wanted, better lenses will help more than the camera.

</TD> </TR> </TBODY></TABLE>

I HAVE BEEN A real fan of the lenses in the realm of 24-70 and 70-210 (200 now) at f2.8......these 2 lenses have served me well over a 20+ yr time frame and for more than the 1st half of my pro shooting I was only using a 70-210 f2.8....portraits, weddings and also wildlife and concert photos.....a lot of my 35mm and ned format bodies wer / are still manual......so elctronics can make life somewhat easier until you loose your battery power then it is all over.....hence I still own some manual cams....and have film in the freezer also:D

This is true especially in your case with being limited to a certain sect of Nikons lenses.......In your you need to move on up and that up being a D300.....and by the time the upgraditis resurfaces you will have a choice of (hopefully) a true D300 upgrade.....or you will have found the need for FF.....My suggestion is to buy lenses that are compatable with FF cams also so that if you get a chance to shoot a FF with your glass and own cf card you can do so to compare you lenses on both cams and your ability to use them.............

Thanks for the response. I am very new to all the photography world and just reading on this website has increased my knowledge and eye ten fold. When I first purchase my D60 from Kits I bought what they suggested because I didn't have the slightest idea what I wanted or what to look for and this site and people like you and John have really helped out.

I like the D90 but I am affraid that the whole shooting HD video might have taken away from the lift of the camera because it is a new function. The D300 is a quality camera and I know I will be happy with it. It is just that price tag that makes me a litle woozy. The whole reason for posting this thread was to hear other peoples opinions on the subject rather then hearing it from the guy who is selling me the camera.

Do I think I would be happy with either camera? Yes. Do I feel like I might want to upgrade sooner if I get the D90? Yes. Do I feel like I can increase my knowledge by getting and learning a D300? Yes. So to me its either get a great camera and a good lens, or get a good camera and get a great lens and possibly want to upgrade sooner then I want.

Once again I just want to thank everyone for there responses. I have learned a great deal from you and hope to continue to learn more.

Art Scott · December 26, 2008

I totally understand where you are coming from and unfortunately the lenses you currently have are not compatable out side of the D40/60 world ...... but you can get great used lenses....a lot of times on here, ebay and other forums allowing sales......and do not forget there is great lenses to be had from 3 parties such as Sigma and Tamron and Tokina.....most other brands I would run from................

I have in body stabilization with my KM 7D's but prior to digital all my stabilization was in the form of my body and straps, tripod(s) and mono pods....if shooting a strict landscape and in the KS wind....I ould lock lens on tripod and camera body to a mono pod ....of course I was also using either self timer of a remote cord to trigger the cam.......
I have resorted to that same technique with digital and it really raises eyebrows especially in shooting in the city(s)......

So I do not place real high value on lens or body stabilzation as when the camera is on a pod all that is supposed to be turned off any way.....and I 'pod a most of my shoots.........

So in a nutshell I am trying to say you can get great lenses and not bust the budget if you are willing to go used or 3rd party....I know Sigma and Tamron hold their value real well and I have use Sigma for well over 30 yrs.......

Good Luck with your decision.

Get 'er done!!! and get to postin' some pics here so we can see how it is all working out for you

Dooginfif20 · December 26, 2008

Art Scott wrote:

I totally understand where you are coming from and unfortunately the lenses you currently have are not compatable out side of the D40/60 world ...... but you can get great used lenses....a lot of times on here, ebay and other forums allowing sales......and do not forget there is great lenses to be had from 3 parties such as Sigma and Tamron and Tokina.....most other brands I would run from................

I have in body stabilization with my KM 7D's but prior to digital all my stabilization was in the form of my body and straps, tripod(s) and mono pods....if shooting a strict landscape and in the KS wind....I ould lock lens on tripod and camera body to a mono pod ....of course I was also using either self timer of a remote cord to trigger the cam.......
I have resorted to that same technique with digital and it really raises eyebrows especially in shooting in the city(s)......

So I do not place real high value on lens or body stabilzation as when the camera is on a pod all that is supposed to be turned off any way.....and I 'pod a most of my shoots.........

So in a nutshell I am trying to say you can get great lenses and not bust the budget if you are willing to go used or 3rd party....I know Sigma and Tamron hold their value real well and I have use Sigma for well over 30 yrs.......

Good Luck with your decision.

Get 'er done!!! and get to postin' some pics here so we can see how it is all working out for you

Art thanks for the response! All the lenses I currently have I am going to sell with my D60. They are just kit lenses and in my opinion aren't going to do me any good like you said. I will look around and see what there is to be found! Thanks for all the advice! Oh and if you want to see some of my current work check out my smugmug and let me know what you think!

Thanks again!

In need of an outside opinion

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