Help with B & W nature shots........

Markjay

Maybe I'm too fussy but, do these first two shots ( B & W images) look like they have been post processed effectively, for black and whites? I'm not concerned about how much USM I used, my composition, or the natural light that was available to me.... I'm concerned with the tone, contrast, curves?

If you can improve on these two, tell me what I can do to get the image where you believe it could be taken to (in improvement in quality).

I'm having a hard enough time trying to "justify" shooting nature images in B & W but, customers are asking and I gotta give the customers what they want when possible. By "justfify" I mean, the eye naturally sees in color and, I'm not used to seeing beautiful birds in B & W!

Thank you in advance for your suggestions..... geez I have still have a long way to go to learn, don't I? (!)

We'll call this image #1, next image #2 and third image is a color shot I wanted to share.

Tanks!
Markjay

David_S85

Love the composition on that first one, with the space on the left for the bird to look into. Th seafoam just rolling in, but not to far in, and just enough on a curve to frame the feet. The upper left looks blown out to me, but it might be just the way the smaller images appear in my browser.

As far as the toning, contrast, etc., they look OK to me the way you've got them here (except for the possible blown highlights), but harder to tell since I don't know what they started out as.

I like all three.

Markjay wrote:

Maybe I'm too fussy but, do these first two shots ( B & W images) look like they have been post processed effectively, for black and whites? I'm not concerned about how much USM I used, my composition, or the natural light that was available to me.... I'm concerned with the tone, contrast, curves?

Tanks!
Markjay

Markjay

Thanks, David........
I happen to enjoy the first image the best also. It's a nice compo.

As for the blown water reflections.... they were bright direct sunlight reflecting of the water there. The image out of camera is actually somewhat darker in levels so I upped the levels to avoid an overall darkish appearance to the image. While the water reflections are quite strong, they don't bother me as much as the poor composition of my second image :-)

The originals of all three have very sharp details showing up on all three birds, none of which is noticed in the downsized image.

Markjay

David_S85 wrote:

Love the composition on that first one, with the space on the left for the bird to look into. Th seafoam just rolling in, but not to far in, and just enough on a curve to frame the feet. The upper left looks blown out to me, but it might be just the way the smaller images appear in my browser.

As far as the toning, contrast, etc., they look OK to me the way you've got them here (except for the possible blown highlights), but harder to tell since I don't know what they started out as.

I like all three.

Khaos

I like both, but the lighting in the second one is killer.

Markjay

RE: the light in the second image....
Unfortunately, the images does not really express just how beautiful that light was at that moment, coming in from the right side of the image, near sundown.
It was the light itself, that attracted my attention to that bird at that moment.... there were three fellas playing musical chairs with me :-)

Markjay

Khaos wrote:

I like both, but the lighting in the second one is killer.

wxwax

Markjay, just my humble opinion.... the birds don't stand out enough. White bird against white water = low conspicuity.

If there were a way to darken the background against which the birds were seen, perhaps the shots would be more powerful?

Markjay

You are right.......
the birds do not stand out as much as I would have liked. I did attempt darkening the water levels but, it just made the water look "muddy" and unnatural IMO. The problem is the location / scene itself and the fact that the birds ARE white and, the fact that this is a B & W in a late day water scene, under a pier. Oh well, sometimes I'm in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Thank you for your useful comment.

wxwax wrote:

Markjay, just my humble opinion.... the birds don't stand out enough. White bird against white water = low conspicuity.

If there were a way to darken the background against which the birds were seen, perhaps the shots would be more powerful?

rahmonster

Shooting B&W is hard. You have to teach your brain to stop looking at the colour and just look and the light and tones. I think the first shot is fantastic. My B&W Photography teacher once told me, that a great B&W image, has one spot that is pure white, and one spot that is pure black. That way you get a good range of tones between. I have been shooting in B&W so long I feel odd going back to colour sometimes...I just keep looking for the tones.

I think you did a great job

Markjay

Thank you and, I agree......
Shooting b & W is hard. In a way though, it's also easy! Why Do I say / think it's easy / easier than color? Because when you are shooting B & W your mind can concentrate more on the shapes, textures, composition, your scene and your subject... rather than all of the above including the color relationships, white balance, and color saturation. That is, in my opinion anyway.

What makes B & W tough for me is, I'm really not well studied on how to post process the images to the degree that you see experts like Andy and Shay, Ulysses, Jim Fuglestad... they are more schooled in how to get the tone / curves right for the images, I'm still learning and have a long way to go yet in my B & W processing, I believe.

Thank you for your great / helpful comments.

Markjay

rahmonster wrote:

Shooting B&W is hard. You have to teach your brain to stop looking at the colour and just look and the light and tones. I think the first shot is fantastic. My B&W Photography teacher once told me, that a great B&W image, has one spot that is pure white, and one spot that is pure black. That way you get a good range of tones between. I have been shooting in B&W so long I feel odd going back to colour sometimes...I just keep looking for the tones.

I think you did a great job

rahmonster

Ah yes I understand. When I studied B&W it was working with film and the darkroom, and being relatively new to PS I know what you mean. I know how I would do it in a darkroom but in photoshop?Sometimes I get lost.

I guess it's just like when I started learning to developing in the darkroom...PRACTICE PRACTICE PRACTICE...:giggle

You already have a great eye for it so you are on the right track:D