Ray flash ring anybody?

Nikolai

This device recently caught my attention: Ray Flash Ring flash adapter.

Does anybody have a hands-on experience with it?
I can see it could have been very a helpful and relatively inexpensive way to move your basic hot-shoe flash to a totally next level, both in studio (as the either key or fill in manual mode) and one location in ETTL mode, (e.g. red carpet, reception), where I would totally dump the - very awkward - "bracket + cord" combo in its favor.

I'm also curious if it's possible to attach it to the flash upside down, i.e. lifting the emitting ring way up and thus kinda simulating the tall bracket.

mr peas

Its very portable, would make a great piece of equipment on the go. Stand alone ring flash units from AB and other companies run for about $500 right? $300 is a hefty price for a such an adapter, but if you do a lot of events, this should pay itself off in a short while. But if my main aim was to do studio work, I would invest an extra few hundred and get a stand-alone ring flash unit. But w/ TTL function, I think it would be a worthwhile investment

I have not yet seen anybody use that adapter yet (seen the review a few months ago I think the price was still the same). I'd have to use it myself, but the idea is sound, place a adapter as a ringflash on your hotshoe mounted flash and you have yourself a portable ringflash.

It would be interesting to see a GF-like copy on Ebay of this product though or if they lower their price to lets say...$150 dollars? I would definitely buy one then. This would be very worthwhile for macro shooters though, unsure if it would fit w/ a MPE-65mm macro lens or a 50mm, but would it work on a 100mm+ macro lens?

But yeah, first hand experience from somebody here would very useful.

Nikolai

I have read all the comments on Strobist (the link in my lead post). For me $300 is an adequate price for having a portabilty.
My concerns (after reading all those comments and contemplating the basics laws of physics) are:

* the unit seems to be unbalanced and needing bottom support, which
1) is a hassle to make and affix;
2) would then block the access to the zom/focus rings;

* the vertical light duct blocks flash's AF assist beam, which can be crucial in low-light reception/night club environment;

* the lighting pattern is described as "narrow" and "delivering a strong vignetting";

* the red-eye effect is noticeable, if ever slightly - I would *really* like to avoid fixing it in hundreds of red carpet/night club shots which I would have to process f*a*s*t...

All in all I'd really like to have an opportunity to test one for myself and see if those concerns are valid.

mr peas

Yeah, the AF part is a definite problem. I didn't think you would have a problem w/ red eye, I mean, its a ringflash, you shouldn't have that problem. But I too wish to test this doo-hickie out. I think it would work great as stated before on macro applications, Lord V. would probably put this thing to good use.

Nikolai

mr peas wrote:

Yeah, the AF part is a definite problem. I didn't think you would have a problem w/ red eye, I mean, its a ringflash, you shouldn't have that problem. But I too wish to test this doo-hickie out. I think it would work great as stated before on macro applications, Lord V. would probably put this thing to good use.

I saw a sample Canon 40D + RRF shot in another forum, and both AF blocking and red eye issues are definitely there :cry
I wonder if a red-eye thingie is typical for ANY righflash reagrdless of its particular design, or it is only a matter for narrow/small ones... I never used one... Can somebody pitch in?

Nikolai

FWIW I wrote them and asked for a test unit for review.

If no answer I'll prolly have to buy one, test quickly and then return if I don't like it. I hate to do that to a seller, but I don't see any other way to test this potentially very interesting device.

evoryware

Nikolai wrote:

I saw a sample Canon 40D + RRF shot in another forum, and both AF blocking and red eye issues are definitely there :cry
I wonder if a red-eye thingie is typical for ANY righflash reagrdless of its particular design, or it is only a matter for narrow/small ones... I never used one... Can somebody pitch in?

I had the chance to use a ringflash (not that one) at a B&H workshop and they said red eye is pretty common for ring flash in general but easily photoshopped out. In the shots I took with it there was no redeye but I'm no leading authority on it so...
I'm sure there has got to be an easy way to create a do it yourself ringflash.

Nikolai

evoryware wrote:

I had the chance to use a ringflash (not that one) at a B&H workshop and they said red eye is pretty common for ring flash in general but easily photoshopped out. In the shots I took with it there was no redeye but I'm no leading authority on it so...
I'm sure there has got to be an easy way to create a do it yourself ringflash.

Thanks for sharing!
My interest in this device is two-prone.

First is a dastardly wish to same $$ and get the ringflash effect in studio portraiture without going through all the $$$ and hassles of attaching and handling a huge and cumbersome AC powered ring flash assembly

Second is an idea to use it in red carpet type of events instead of operating a bracket.

Red-eye is not a problem for studio, since you don't usually have to many finals to take care of, and fixing it would be a very simple problem, since I already spend a lot of time on them.
Red-carpet - or any public event for that matter - is a different story, since we're talking a very high volume, when going through hundreds of images is simply not an option.

I got some nice response from one of the device holders. At this point I only have two major concerns left: the assembly tilting and the red-eye.

pathfinder

Nik,

I am sure you've seen the cheap DIY ringflash setups on the Strobist, but some may not have. It does allow ETTL also..

Basically, take a white 14 or 18 inch bow, put a flash in through a window in the back, and add a reflector in the center of the diffusion screen wire tied to the front of the bowl. The reflector can be a CD or shiny Aluminum tape to reflect the flash from the speedlite back into to the bowl where it is reflected a second time out the front of the ring as a diffused light source.

Some links

http://strobist.blogspot.com/2007/11/ring-flash-week-intro-and-resources.html

http://static.flickr.com/89/239141592_29784dc484_o.png

http://www.flickr.com/photos/snapify/1582241882/

http://eyeonbirmingham.blogspot.com/2007/10/ring.html

http://www.flaghead.co.uk/pages/ringflash-intro.html

http://www.expoimaging.net/products/product_detail.php?prodid=15&productname=Ray_Flash:_The_Ring_Flash_Adapter

Nikolai

pathfinder wrote:

Nik,
I am sure you've seen the cheap DIY ringflash setups on the Strobist, but some may not have. It does allow ETTL also..

Jim,
I sure did see a few over time, but this is a geat collection of usable links in one place

Nikolai

I got the following reply from the Customer Service:

Hi Nikolai,
Thank you for your interest in the Ray Flash. Unfortunately supply constraints have limited our ability to provide test samples to the photographic community at large. But I would like to refer you to several of our resellers in the Los Angeles area, including Samy's Camera and Calumet. Both of those resellers have multiple locations with the Ray Flash in stock and should be able to accommodate your needs to handle and test the unit prior to purchase.
I very much appreciate your concerns about the Ray Flash, particularly those pertaining to Red Eye and to the forward tilt of the attached Ray Flash.
You may already be aware that Red Eye results from light reflecting off the back of the eye through the iris. Red eye is more likely to occur in darker ambient light environments where the pupil is dilated larger. Additionally, the closer the light source is in relation to the lens, such as when using any kind of ring light, the greater the chance of producing red eye. The Ray Flash is no different than any other ring light source in this regard.
That is not to say that you will always produce red eye every time you use the Ray Flash, because you will not. In fact, I have rarely seen red eye in resulting Ray Flash sample images. But it is important to understand the limitations, or consequences of using this type of light source, particularly when you are photographing in darker environments.
The forward tilt of the Ray Flash results from the looseness of the top joint in your hot shoe mounted flash. The Ray Flash weighs approximately 16 oz, so placing it on a flash unit will obviously pull the head of the unit down. Some flash units are 'looser' than others in this joint and result in more 'sag' when the
Ray Flash is attached. To help with this problem we include 3 small, rubber fitting wedges that can be placed under the joint to help support the flash head and prevent it from drooping. This is a very simple and low tech solution to the problem, but it seems to work quite well.
If you're looking for some independent, third party opinions of the Ray Flash, then I encourage you to check out some of the following reviews:
1. Popular Photography and American Photo "Editor's Choice 2008: Lighting Product of the Year" - http://www.popphoto.com/americanphotofeatures/5386/editors-choice-2008-lighting.html
2. Scott Kelby - http://www.scottkelby.com/blog/2008/archives/1478#comments
3. Strobist - http://strobist.blogspot.com/2008/03/full-review-ray-flash-ring-flash.html
4. Additional Product Reviews at ExpoImaging Reviews - http://www.expoimaging.net/reviews/
In addition to the positive reviews linked above, we have received many testimonials from satisfied Ray Flash users. ExpoImaging Customer Testimonials - http://www.expodisc.com/reviews/Testimonials.php
I hope I have addressed some of your questions. Please don't hesitate to ask if I can be of any further assistance.
Best Regards,
Erik

Along with some additional info I got this pretty much assured me in good quality of this product.

dogwood

Nik:

I don't use the Ray Flash but with the Zeus RF I find red eye varies depending on the length of lens I'm using. I now limit the RF use to my 24-105 (on a FF body) and the red eye isn't much of an issue.

But I realize the Ray Flash ain't no power pack insanely powered RF too. So it's a little like comparing apples to oranges, but the angle of reflectance issues are similar.

Nikolai

dogwood wrote:

Nik:
I don't use the Ray Flash but with the Zeus RF I find red eye varies depending on the length of lens I'm using. I now limit the RF use to my 24-105 (on a FF body) and the red eye isn't much of an issue.
But I realize the Ray Flash ain't no power pack insanely powered RF too. So it's a little like comparing apples to oranges, but the angle of reflectance issues are similar.

Pete,
do you find RE happening more on a short, or on a long side of the mid focal range?

dogwood

Nikolai wrote:

Pete,
do you find RE happening more on a short, or on a long side of the mid focal range?

Definitely happens more for me when using the 70-200 lens at the 200 end of things (I like headshots with a long lens). Red eye is pretty rare if I can shoot around 105 though, so that's what I go for.

Nikolai

dogwood wrote:

Definitely happens more for me when using the 70-200 lens at the 200 end of things (I like headshots with a long lens). Red eye is pretty rare if I can shoot around 105 though, so that's what I go for.

That's what I thought, makes sense :-)

Manfr3d

One more thing, the Rayflash and alikes allow you to output more
light than a normal Macro Ring Flash does. Giving you a longer working
range. The ring is also larger in diameter and thicker - which leads to a
larger light source and therefor better light for portraits.

evoryware

Thanks for the info guys!

Sam

I just ran across this post.

I had one, tested it, don't like it.

Poor fit on a 580 EX, ( apparently it was designed for a 580 EX II which is dimensionally larger. I never felt that it was secure. Difficult to get, maintain, flat, perpendicular alignment with lens.

I didn't think it had enough power, light distribution for an in the field portrait, people light set up.

It did work as a macro light pretty well, but for the money I would buy a Sigma, or Canon macro light.

For $50.00 I'd own one. For $300.00, I can't see it.

That's just my conclusions.

Sam

Nikolai

Sam wrote:

I just ran across this post.

I had one, tested it, don't like it.

Poor fit on a 580 EX, ( apparently it was designed for a 580 EX II which is dimensionally larger. I never felt that it was secure. Difficult to get, maintain, flat, perpendicular alignment with lens.

I didn't think it had enough power, light distribution for an in the field portrait, people light set up.

It did work as a macro light pretty well, but for the money I would buy a Sigma, or Canon macro light.

For $50.00 I'd own one. For $300.00, I can't see it.

That's just my conclusions.

Sam

Thank you Sam, appreciate your input!