Help With Waterfall Shots

canon400d

Yesterday I took a series of waterfall shots. I used a 40D with a 17-85mm lens. I shoot raw and I always shoot AV mode as I am not professional enough to shoot Manual. I thought the shots were quite good when I took them and looked at them on the LCD but when I put them onto the computer I found that a lot of the whites had burned out and gave a false look to the water. I would appreciate any help and guidance you can give me for my next attempt. C & C is always welcome and truly appreciated.
Regards
Bob.
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9

Tango

im no pro either...but my only thoughts are to spot meter and use manual mode.
just you need to start using the M mode, otherwise you will always have problems....
but if you know you have blinkies using AV then turn down the expo comp a full fstop

also, i really like using a 10stop ND filter for water shots...
you then really need to rely on your histogram and blinkies on the lcd screen..

anwmn1

I agree with Aaron that you really just need to start shooting manual. It seems like a big deal at first but once you shoot for a little bit you will see it is not very difficult.

On my crappy work monitor the biggest issue I see is composition.

Shots 1, 4, 5 and 6 are downward looking and therefore very flat. Just very uniteresting angles and lacking depth.

Shots 2 & 3 are a little better because there are levels there and a better angle. I think you need to include the bottom of the falls or more of the top as a general rule. You accomplished that in the last 2 shots and I think they are better than all but #7.

I think 7, 8, and 9 would have all been better with a shorter exposure time. Most people like to shoot the silky shooth look but they can be over done which I think you did here.

For me the best waterfall shots are a mix of silky and sharp. Not easy to get but when you get it you will know.

geospatial_junkie

Manual is the only way to go as Aaron stated above. You might be able to get by with a polarizer, but ND filters are best.

schmoo

Hi Bob, you're getting there!! :ivar

If you have some time and haven't already seen it, a great waterfalls thread was started here. Great shots and all kinds of perspective on shooting them.

canon400d

schmoo wrote:

Hi Bob, you're getting there!! :ivar

If you have some time and haven't already seen it, a great waterfalls thread was started here. Great shots and all kinds of perspective on shooting them.

Thanks Schmoo and everyone else for your sound advice. I really will have to start learning the manual mode. I have tried several times making a note of the shutter speed when using AV mode and when I try the same shutter speed in Manual I always get a blank pic with a high pointed needle histogram on the right side of the LCD. I just don't know what shutter speeds to use with my aperture which I have truly mastered in AV. I would really love to achieve the Manual mode as I have been struggling along now for over 12 months.
Regards and thanks again for all your kind help.
Bob

Nacho

Waterfalls, Manual, etc.
Hi There! Schmoo's suggestion about the waterfall thread is a good one. I contributed to that thread and recently put together a brief guide to shooting such water flows. It's just a start, but I hope it can be helpful. You can download that guide here:

http://www.willamette.edu/~ncordova/img/Photographing Water Flows.pdf

Regarding Manual: Manual is not too difficult, just make sure you start with something comfy for you. If you are familiar with using Aperture priority (Av) you'll be fine with manual. Start by setting the aperture you think is best. Say you a shooting a portrait and select f/5.6. Look at your meter and it will tell you if the shot is underexposed for the ambient light, or if it is overexposed. Make the necessary adjustments and when the meter says it is just fine, voila!

Now, that's the easiest way to go manual. You are trusting the camera's meter, and going with a fairly automated way of figuring out if your exposure is relatively OK according to the camera meter. As you get more comfy with that, you can make adjustments to the exposure that you think are best for the scene, subject, your creative vision, etc.

But don't forget to adjust White Balance also (even if you are shooting RAW, it is a good habit to make sure you check all settings and learn to read light).

Your settings will vary depending on what you shoot. If you want to shoot some fast action, then remember that your shutter speed should be above 1/250 (and sometimes way faster). Depending on light, you'll have to adjust aperture, and so on. Best way to learn is to dive right in.

Best Regards,

Nacho

Tango

Nacho wrote:

http://www.willamette.edu/~ncordova/img/Photographing Water Flows.pdf

canon400d

Nacho wrote:

Hi There! Schmoo's suggestion about the waterfall thread is a good one. I contributed to that thread and recently put together a brief guide to shooting such water flows. It's just a start, but I hope it can be helpful. You can download that guide here:

http://www.willamette.edu/~ncordova/img/Photographing Water Flows.pdf

Regarding Manual: Manual is not too difficult, just make sure you start with something comfy for you. If you are familiar with using Aperture priority (Av) you'll be fine with manual. Start by setting the aperture you think is best. Say you a shooting a portrait and select f/5.6. Look at your meter and it will tell you if the shot is underexposed for the ambient light, or if it is overexposed. Make the necessary adjustments and when the meter says it is just fine, voila!

Now, that's the easiest way to go manual. You are trusting the camera's meter, and going with a fairly automated way of figuring out if your exposure is relatively OK according to the camera meter. As you get more comfy with that, you can make adjustments to the exposure that you think are best for the scene, subject, your creative vision, etc.

But don't forget to adjust White Balance also (even if you are shooting RAW, it is a good habit to make sure you check all settings and learn to read light).

Your settings will vary depending on what you shoot. If you want to shoot some fast action, then remember that your shutter speed should be above 1/250 (and sometimes way faster). Depending on light, you'll have to adjust aperture, and so on. Best way to learn is to dive right in.

Best Regards,

Nacho

Hey Nacho thanks ever so much for your reply. I am really green here, but when you are talking about a meter are you talking about the shutter speed after I have nominated the aperture, or are you talking about a separate meter I have to use. I have tried several times setting the shutter speed after a successful shot in AV and as I say when I put the same shutter speed in Manual I just get a blank LCD with a needle on the right side. Sorry to be such a damned nuisance.
Regards
Bob

Awais Yaqub

Hi
While reviewing your image you can always check if the highlights are blown or not. I try to eliminate slightest chance of blown highlight this helps to preserve lightest colors in the scene, check the blue sky in this picture i remember blue was hardly visible to eye and almost merged into bright white but PS helped here . i used 17-85 once on 400D got great results at f32 check here.

Nacho

Meters
Hi There:

There's a variety of good sites that cover this stuff better than I can here, but let me try to answer at least the most direct query:

Here's a shot of a viewfinder display for a Canon camera:



As you can see, this shows a variety of things. The ISO set (800), the aperture (5.6), the mode (Av), and a host of other things (see that AWB? that's auto white balance). In short, that Canon camera is set to Av (Aperture Priority -- you select aperture and the camera sets shutter speed).

The important thing to notice here is the little scale on the upper left. It shows a 0 in the middle, and the numerals 1 and 2 separated by some ticks, to each side. One side has a -sign and the other a +sign. That scale is a visual display of the camera's meter that helps you know if the exposure is correct. When the black little block is under the zero in the middle that means that the camera meter "thinks" the aperture and shutter will give a proper exposure. If the black little block was to the left (the -side) the camera meter would be signaling that the scene is overexposed (too much light is coming in). If the black little block is to the right, it means that the scene is underexposed. Check that with your Camera. In my Nikon going to the left means overexposed, and to the right means underexposed, but in this Canon display it seems to be the opposite.

So, if you put your camera in Av mode - you get to select the aperture (f/5.6, or f/8, or f/4, whatever you think is best for the situation) and the camera meters the available light and selects a proper shutter speed for that aperture. You don't have to do anything else. Well, you probably have already decided on an ISO (sensitivity to light let us call it). My advice is to keep that ISO at its lowest setting for now, until you master the rest.

If you put the camera in Manual mode (M), you have to make the decision about aperture and shutter speed, look through the viewfinder and see where the little black block is at. Then use the dial to control either shutter speed or aperture (again depending on the situation and your goals) until the meter reads back a proper exposure (black block is in the middle).

You can see this display when you look through the viewfinder of the camera. You can also see it in the LCD, and you can see it in the small LCD on top of the camera body. Here's a top display for a NIkon:



See the scale (meter) there also? That one shows how the move to the left means overexposure, and to the right means underexposure (see the + and - signs).

Now, having said all that... and this is going to screw with your mind a bit -- exposure depends on what the camera meter "measures." In other word, on what object it uses to determine the amount of light in the scene. If you point the camera to a very bright object the camera meter will think that there is too much light in a scene and will place that little black block way to the left! The opposite is also the case: if you point the camera to a dark object in the scene, the meter will think there is just not enough light and will place the black block to the right. Which is right? Well, you need to decide what object or portion of the scene to meter. And remember, it is not enough to just point the camera. You have to point it, depress the shutter half-way down, and then the meter is activated and renders a reading.

How do you learn what to meter, what is the appropriate exposure for a particular scene or situation, and how to manage aperture, shutter speed, etc.? Practice, study, exploration, and more practice and study. It is not super complicated, but it does require practicing and reading a bit on how best to do all this.

Another thing to remember: a proper exposure is not necessarily what a camera meter tells you. You can be quite creative in how you decide exposure. You can compensate and decide to underexpose a bit so that some very bright parts of the scene don't come out overexposed, etc.

There's certainly more to be covered here, but I'd suggest this site:

Digital Camera Tutorial: Exposure & Metering

Here's another one: Correct Exposure

Have fun, and keep exploring, the learning is just totally cool.

Best,

N

gdaddy

waterfall help

Awais Yaqub wrote:

Hi
While reviewing your image you can always check if the highlights are blown or not. I try to eliminate slightest chance of blown highlight this helps to preserve lightest colors in the scene, check the blue sky in this picture i remember blue was hardly visible to eye and almost merged into bright white but PS helped here . i used 17-85 once on 400D got great results at f32 check here.

Check out the Waterfall thread started a couple weeks ago. Try shooting manual, in the morning, aperture of f/16, f/22, shutter at 1/2 second or longer, use at least a polarizer filter, bracket +- 2/3 to 1 full stop, mirror lock up, tripod, cable release. Take a custom white balance at each waterfall and use it then (or later in RAW). ISO of 100 or 200. IF you have a canon you may can shoot in live view where the mirror stays up during the whole live view time and you can still bracket and all the rest in live view as well. Plus you will have a 100 percent view of the scene that will appear later on screen or in print.
gdaddy

canon400d

Awais Yaqub wrote:

Hi
While reviewing your image you can always check if the highlights are blown or not. I try to eliminate slightest chance of blown highlight this helps to preserve lightest colors in the scene, check the blue sky in this picture i remember blue was hardly visible to eye and almost merged into bright white but PS helped here . i used 17-85 once on 400D got great results at f32 check here.

Thanks Awais for the advice. I looked at all your shots and they are all really first class. I will certainly remember the colour of the sky when reviewing in future. Your country has some beautiful landscapes. I would love to visit sometime.
Regards
Bob

canon400d

canon400d wrote:

Thanks Awais for the advice. I looked at all your shots and they are all really first class. I will certainly remember the colour of the sky when reviewing in future. Your country has some beautiful landscapes. I would love to visit sometime.
Regards
Bob

Thanks ever so much Nacho. I have never ever had this fully explained to me the way you have outlined it for me. You have given me confidence and I am sure I will certainly master the Manual mode after some practice. I understood exactly what you have explained and I just can't wait to try it out.Once again a big thank you for taking your time and trouble to help me out.
Regards
Bob

canon400d

canon400d wrote:

Thanks ever so much Nacho. I have never ever had this fully explained to me the way you have outlined it for me. You have given me confidence and I am sure I will certainly master the Manual mode after some practice. I understood exactly what you have explained and I just can't wait to try it out.Once again a big thank you for taking your time and trouble to help me out.
Regards
Bob

Thanks Gdaddy for your reply. My 40D has Live View and I sometimes use the cable release. I will certainly remember all you have said and will give it a try once I have mastered the Manual mode that Nacho has been so kind to give me. My confidence is building in strength all the time with all the sound advice and help I have received.
Regards
Bob