Macro flash question

Joemess

Hey folks,

I am interested in purchasing a flash for dedicated macro work. I shoot a 30D and have the 100:2.8 and the 60:2.8 lens for macro work... Up until now I have just waited on a bright day to get out and shoot but now I would like to get a flash.

out of the MR-24 and the MT 14, which is more bang for the buck. Both of them are pricey, however if they are worth the investment I am fine with that.


Also, I would like to use this flash on a 28-135 that is typically used for photographing flowers for research (I am a botanist).

link to specifications of each.
http://tinyurl.com/9vhvzm


Andrew

puzzledpaul

Have you considered a single (std) flash + macro bracket rig - quite a few ppl (incl. me) use such a setup and you've only got to check LordV's results to see what can be achieved

pp

ziggy53

Andrew,

If you are looking for the best "bang for the buck", it would probably be the rig that our own LordV uses (very effectively I might add):

http://www.dgrin.com/showthread.php?t=64695

angevin1

And this gentleman from Kuala Lampur: http://www.flickr.com/photos/liewwk/sets/72157605664386633/ I think his dgrin moniker is Liewwk: la



cheers, tom

ps: there are some amazing shots from the mentioned folks over in the Holy macro forum!

Robinivich

I also use what's been most recommended, a standard flash (430EX in my case) on a macro bracket. Something important to consider, the MT-24, MR-14, and a typical flash head off camera light things very differently.

As I understand it, the MR-14 is designed to be able to produce images virtually without shadows, and ring flashes like this are often used for product, medical, scientific, and even crime scene photography for this reason (watch CSI, you'll see ). It allows you to adjust brightness between the two halves of the ring, and will still I'm sure work wonderfully for macro, but it's primary design is to remove shadows. This may or may not be a bad thing, this is a question only you can answer (given your mention of photographing flowers for research, might be worth another look, this is probably the best suited flash for documenting specimens)

The MT-24 on the other hand is a specialist macro flash, the twin heads can be repositioned in various ways to light your subject differently, which would allow very creative lighting. The only drawback is that I've read the light from the fairly small flash heads can be harsh (unless the subject is tiny), and I can only guess it'd be tricky to fit a diffuser between flash and subject as things are getting this small. This one sounds most popular with people using the MP-E 65mm "super macro" lens that goes to 5:1.

An off-camera bracket setup for a normal flash head is IMHO the most versatile. While you only have one flash head, there are thousands of modifiers and diffusers you can buy or make for it. With a good flash bracket, it can be used for subjects 2 centimetres from the lens, or 20 feet away. You also have different options for how to use it.

With either of the dedicated macro flashes, you'll need the appropriate adapters for whichever lenses you wish to use it on. I had a quick look and Canon does sell a part, the macrolite adapter 72c that allows MR-14 and MT-24 lenses to attach to a 72mm filter thread like on the 28-135, though adapters are unnecessary on your current canon macros. Where bang for the buck is concerned, having a regular flash head when you're done shooting macro is a big bonus.

All in all a bit of a tossup. If this is business first, you're a botanist who happens to have a camera, maybe the MR-14 EX will function best. If you're a photo hobbyist whose day job is botanical research, I'd go with a typical flashgun, and a nice bracket and off camera cord to go with it. You might be surprised at how much difference a flash can make to your other photographic pursuits.

ziggy53

Robinivich wrote:

I also use what's been most recommended, a standard flash (430EX in my case) on a macro bracket. Something important to consider, the MT-24, MR-14, and a typical flash head off camera light things very differently.

As I understand it, the MR-14 is designed to be able to produce images virtually without shadows, and ring flashes like this are often used for product, medical, scientific, and even crime scene photography for this reason (watch CSI, you'll see ). It allows you to adjust brightness between the two halves of the ring, and will still I'm sure work wonderfully for macro, but it's primary design is to remove shadows. This may or may not be a bad thing, this is a question only you can answer (given your mention of photographing flowers for research, might be worth another look, this is probably the best suited flash for documenting specimens)

The MT-24 on the other hand is a specialist macro flash, the twin heads can be repositioned in various ways to light your subject differently, which would allow very creative lighting. The only drawback is that I've read the light from the fairly small flash heads can be harsh (unless the subject is tiny), and I can only guess it'd be tricky to fit a diffuser between flash and subject as things are getting this small. This one sounds most popular with people using the MP-E 65mm "super macro" lens that goes to 5:1.

An off-camera bracket setup for a normal flash head is IMHO the most versatile. While you only have one flash head, there are thousands of modifiers and diffusers you can buy or make for it. With a good flash bracket, it can be used for subjects 2 centimetres from the lens, or 20 feet away. You also have different options for how to use it.

With either of the dedicated macro flashes, you'll need the appropriate adapters for whichever lenses you wish to use it on. I had a quick look and Canon does sell a part, the macrolite adapter 72c that allows MR-14 and MT-24 lenses to attach to a 72mm filter thread like on the 28-135, though adapters are unnecessary on your current canon macros. Where bang for the buck is concerned, having a regular flash head when you're done shooting macro is a big bonus.

All in all a bit of a tossup. If this is business first, you're a botanist who happens to have a camera, maybe the MR-14 EX will function best. If you're a photo hobbyist whose day job is botanical research, I'd go with a typical flashgun, and a nice bracket and off camera cord to go with it. You might be surprised at how much difference a flash can make to your other photographic pursuits.

This is a wonderful explanation of the options available. Thanks. clap

Joemess

man, ya'll are making this tough....



Okay, lets say I go with a bracket rather than a ringflash.... Are these ready made? (I have an eight month old that severely limits my time) or do I need to start piecing one of these together.


I still have about the same budget if that helps....

Robinivich

ziggy53 wrote:

This is a wonderful explanation of the options available. Thanks. clap

What can I say, I love to help!

Joemess wrote:

Okay, lets say I go with a bracket rather than a ringflash.... Are these ready made? (I have an eight month old that severely limits my time) or do I need to start piecing one of these together.

You have both options. A lot of people customize their own, personally I went with Wimberley's macro flash bracket http://www.tripodhead.com/products/flash-bracket-macro-brackets.cfm. It's not particularly cheap, but it is well constructed and versatile. You have a number of options for attaching it to your camera setup, if your lens has a tripod foot (there's an optional one for the 100mm macro) you can attach it by buying a lens plate for the tripod foot, or you can buy a body plate, and have it attach to the camera (this is what I'd recommend in your case, this way you're set with all your lenses). There are other companies that make brackets, like http://www.kirkphoto.com/ and http://reallyrightstuff.com/home.html, but when I was doing my research I found the wimberley seemed most freely adjustable. You might also try just heading into a brick and mortar store and seeing what they have around that might work.

Hope this helps!

Joemess

Robinivich wrote:

What can I say, I love to help!

You have both options. A lot of people customize their own, personally I went with Wimberley's macro flash bracket http://www.tripodhead.com/products/flash-bracket-macro-brackets.cfm. It's not particularly cheap, but it is well constructed and versatile. You have a number of options for attaching it to your camera setup, if your lens has a tripod foot (there's an optional one for the 100mm macro) you can attach it by buying a lens plate for the tripod foot, or you can buy a body plate, and have it attach to the camera (this is what I'd recommend in your case, this way you're set with all your lenses). There are other companies that make brackets, like http://www.kirkphoto.com/ and http://reallyrightstuff.com/home.html, but when I was doing my research I found the wimberley seemed most freely adjustable. You might also try just heading into a brick and mortar store and seeing what they have around that might work.

Hope this helps!

I like that one. Thanks for the links, they have helped and made me consider other questions I did not know about...


what type of ballhead are you using? currently I am using a manfrotto ballhead (486RC2) that has been through the ringer with use. However, I am fairly certain that it does not have the plate that I need to attach it to the camera.


Andrew

Robinivich

Joemess wrote:

what type of ballhead are you using? currently I am using a manfrotto ballhead (486RC2) that has been through the ringer with use. However, I am fairly certain that it does not have the plate that I need to attach it to the camera.

Kirk, Wimberley and Really Right Stuff all use variants of the Arca-Swiss style plates, there are subtle differences, but the good ideas seem to get passed around between manufacturers. I don't know what system the manfrotto uses though.

I'm afraid I can't be much more help than that, since funny enough, I don't actually own a ballhead! Or a proper tripod that would mount one! It's just always been a little down the list for me. I use a sigma 150mm macro, which has a tripod foot, and I have a lens plate on it, which my flash bracket is attached to. I then run around handholding this attached to a 40D and sometimes some tubes

Joemess

Robinivich wrote:

Kirk, Wimberley and Really Right Stuff all use variants of the Arca-Swiss style plates, there are subtle differences, but the good ideas seem to get passed around between manufacturers. I don't know what system the manfrotto uses though.

I'm afraid I can't be much more help than that, since funny enough, I don't actually own a ballhead! Or a proper tripod that would mount one! It's just always been a little down the list for me. I use a sigma 150mm macro, which has a tripod foot, and I have a lens plate on it, which my flash bracket is attached to. I then run around handholding this attached to a 40D and sometimes some tubes

Thanks, you have been an amazing help!

Robinivich

Joemess wrote:

Thanks, you have been an amazing help!

Anytime!

Qarik

I have also used the setup inspired by lord v in the macro forums with very good results.



Just need:

1) flash bracket
2) flash cord
3) one soda can, some packaing tape, duct tape and a paper towel