Proof delay - replace photo question

Nikon_Mario

Did some reading but still not completely understanding this process. Here is what I am wondering:
I would like to have a gallery (say Gallery A) for sale.
Gallery A will have the lesser resolution jpg 7 file.
I set proof delay on Gallery A.
I would like the photos in Gallery A not to change when I process an order.
I set up Gallery B for my hi-res versions.
When a Gallery A photo gets ordered, I upload the hi-res version of the pic to Gallery B and then substitute that photo for the one being ordered?

Will this work?

That is, will I be able to complete the order with the hi-res version from Gallery B without affecting the low-res version in Gallery A so that Gallery A will always show the same low res file?

gluwater

Nikon_Mario wrote:

Did some reading but still not completely understanding this process. Here is what I am wondering:
I would like to have a gallery (say Gallery A) for sale.
Gallery A will have the lesser resolution jpg 7 file.
I set proof delay on Gallery A.
I would like the photos in Gallery A not to change when I process an order.
I set up Gallery B for my hi-res versions.
When a Gallery A photo gets ordered, I upload the hi-res version of the pic to Gallery B and then substitute that photo for the one being ordered?

Will this work?

That is, will I be able to complete the order with the hi-res version from Gallery B without affecting the low-res version in Gallery A so that Gallery A will always show the same low res file?

Hi Mario. That is not possible to do. When a customer places an order you need to replace the image when using Proof Delay. You cannot tell the order to use a different image already on your site, you have to actually replace the image that was ordered. Here's a link to the Proof Delay help page for your review: http://www.smugmug.com/help/proof-retouch-replace.

Was there a reason you want to only keep low res images in the gallery A? From what I have seen on your site you already have right click protection enabled and you also have only Large images enabled for viewing. That is basically doing what you are asking. You only have low res images available for viewing and when an order is placed the original high res image is sent to the lab.

Nikon_Mario

gluwater wrote:

Hi Mario. That is not possible to do. When a customer places an order you need to replace the image when using Proof Delay. You cannot tell the order to use a different image already on your site, you have to actually replace the image that was ordered. Here's a link to the Proof Delay help page for your review: http://www.smugmug.com/help/proof-retouch-replace.

Was there a reason you want to only keep low res images in the gallery A? From what I have seen on your site you already have right click protection enabled and you also have only Large images enabled for viewing. That is basically doing what you are asking. You only have low res images available for viewing and when an order is placed the original high res image is sent to the lab.

Thanks, Nick.
The images that I currently have throughout my galleries are a mix of different jpg compressions. I was thinking of re-designing and making sure that I had all jpg 7 for viewing purposes (concerned with speed, especially with slide shows), but wanted to be sure that I could substitute a higher quality jpg for printing purposes, especially if the print is a little larger.

But I see from the link that if I replace the photo that's ordered with a higher res version, as soon as I send the order, I can then put the lower res file back into the gallery. Correct? I assume that since some of my jpg 10 quality files sometimes get into 10mg+ files that I wouldn't want to have large numbers of those in my galleries.

jfriend

Nikon_Mario wrote:

Did some reading but still not completely understanding this process. Here is what I am wondering:
I would like to have a gallery (say Gallery A) for sale.
Gallery A will have the lesser resolution jpg 7 file.
I set proof delay on Gallery A.
I would like the photos in Gallery A not to change when I process an order.
I set up Gallery B for my hi-res versions.
When a Gallery A photo gets ordered, I upload the hi-res version of the pic to Gallery B and then substitute that photo for the one being ordered?

Will this work?

That is, will I be able to complete the order with the hi-res version from Gallery B without affecting the low-res version in Gallery A so that Gallery A will always show the same low res file?

I think you don't understand that Smugmug auto-generates web display copies for you from what you upload and they pick the JPEG compression and size to use for those web copies and those settings have nothing to do with what you originally uploaded. Your web display images will be nearly identical whether you upload a 12MP image with JPEG compression level 12 or a 3MP image with JPEG compression level 7. Smugmug will downsample them to web size and pick their own JPEG compression level. Run a simple test. Upload your high res original at JPEG compression level 10 and upload a resampled 3MP version at JPEG compression level 7. Then, compare the Smugmug Large size of both images. I'd be surprised if you saw much difference in speed if any.

Are you sure you are actually solving a problem that exists?

Nikon_Mario

jfriend wrote:

I think you don't understand that Smugmug auto-generates web display copies for you from what you upload and they pick the JPEG compression and size to use for those web copies and those settings have nothing to do with what you originally uploaded. Your web display images will be nearly identical whether you upload a 12MP image with JPEG compression level 12 or a 3MP image with JPEG compression level 7. Smugmug will downsample them to web size and pick their own JPEG compression level. Run a simple test. Upload your high res original at JPEG compression level 10 and upload a resampled 3MP version at JPEG compression level 7. Then, compare the Smugmug Large size of both images. I'd be surprised if you saw much difference in speed if any.

Are you sure you are actually solving a problem that exists?

Thanks, John. I guess I am confused about the instruction that I read somewhere about uploading a jpg 7 file and then replacing it with a jpg 10 file when an order is placed. I thought I had read that in the Proof-Delay info, but maybe it was elsewhere on this site and for a different reason? It was definitely connected to SmugMug. Darn senior moments!

Anyway, if I can just upload jpg10 quality files and not have any speed issues, then I'll just do that and have proof-delay only to check cropping issues. Anything to save a step in the workflow!

jfriend

Nikon_Mario wrote:

Thanks, John. I guess I am confused about the instruction that I read somewhere about uploading a jpg 7 file and then replacing it with a jpg 10 file when an order is placed. I thought I had read that in the Proof-Delay info, but maybe it was elsewhere on this site and for a different reason? It was definitely connected to SmugMug. Darn senior moments!

Anyway, if I can just upload jpg10 quality files and not have any speed issues, then I'll just do that and have proof-delay only to check cropping issues. Anything to save a step in the workflow!

The ONLY reason I know of to upload lower res images initially and then replace them at order time is to save on your own upload time if you have a really slow upload link. I don't believe it will help the speed of your site at all for your or your viewers.

That's what I use proof delay for. Check crops and make one last look to see if there's any more post processing that should be done. I will also occasionally upload a looser crop version in proof delay to allow a non-matching print size to print with a better crop.

Nikon_Mario

jfriend wrote:

The ONLY reason I know of to upload lower res images initially and then replace them at order time is to save on your own upload time if you have a really slow upload link. I don't believe it will help the speed of your site at all for your or your viewers.

That's what I use proof delay for. Check crops and make one last look to see if there's any more post processing that should be done. I will also occasionally upload a looser crop version in proof delay to allow a non-matching print size to print with a better crop.

Thanks so much, John. I appreciate your quick and very helpful responses.
Cheers,
Mario

timgangloff

another consideration
One thing you might want to consider is that by uploading full resolution image files, you essentially get off-site back up storage for free.

klinksk8

uploading hi-res vs low res images
You are actually discussing something I have been wondering about. I am currently uploading in low res (50% of jpg size) in order to hurry up the process of getting MANY photos on Smugmug for my customers to view and order. Then when they order I have to go through, ONE BY ONE and edit, save to desktop, then replace/upload each picture, one at a time. This can get pretty time-intensive, and I keep thinking, there must be an easier way. As I see it, my only other option is to edit ALL of my pics before the initial upload in their full resolution, and then upload them...Since I have 10,000 to 14,000 images after a weekend event, this could take a LONG time...and I'm editing LOTS of pictures that will never be purchased. I sure do hope someone has a solution! I've been asking all around, and it appears I am the only one with this issue???

Thanks for any help! Desperate here!

jfriend wrote:

The ONLY reason I know of to upload lower res images initially and then replace them at order time is to save on your own upload time if you have a really slow upload link. I don't believe it will help the speed of your site at all for your or your viewers.

That's what I use proof delay for. Check crops and make one last look to see if there's any more post processing that should be done. I will also occasionally upload a looser crop version in proof delay to allow a non-matching print size to print with a better crop.

jfriend

klinksk8 wrote:

You are actually discussing something I have been wondering about. I am currently uploading in low res (50% of jpg size) in order to hurry up the process of getting MANY photos on Smugmug for my customers to view and order. Then when they order I have to go through, ONE BY ONE and edit, save to desktop, then replace/upload each picture, one at a time. This can get pretty time-intensive, and I keep thinking, there must be an easier way. As I see it, my only other option is to edit ALL of my pics before the initial upload in their full resolution, and then upload them...Since I have 10,000 to 14,000 images after a weekend event, this could take a LONG time...and I'm editing LOTS of pictures that will never be purchased. I sure do hope someone has a solution! I've been asking all around, and it appears I am the only one with this issue???

Thanks for any help! Desperate here!

Proof Delay was built for you. You upload unfinished photos, then finish them when you get an order. What specifically are you asking for beyond that?

klinksk8

Proof delay

jfriend wrote:

Proof Delay was built for you. You upload unfinished photos, then finish them when you get an order. What specifically are you asking for beyond that?

I am just finding the uploading the editing pictures (in proof delay) one by one and waiting for each to finish to start another upload is very time consuming, and if we were to get any more orders than we currently have, I don't know how we would process all of them. I thought there surely must be a better way, and maybe some other photographers out there with a huge volume might have discovered it. :-)

Thanks for your fast reply!

jfriend

klinksk8 wrote:

I am just finding the uploading the editing pictures (in proof delay) one by one and waiting for each to finish to start another upload is very time consuming, and if we were to get any more orders than we currently have, I don't know how we would process all of them. I thought there surely must be a better way, and maybe some other photographers out there with a huge volume might have discovered it. :-)

Thanks for your fast reply!

I see.

First, you don't have to wait for the first upload to finish to start another one. Just open a new browser window and get one going in every open window.

Second, I believe that StarExplorer has a feature for "bulk image replacement". You could check it out. I use it as my regular uploader, but don't do a lot of replace photo.

klinksk8

Thanks! I will try the multi-window replace! Hadn't thought of that. Also, I've been in contact with Star Explorer, so am glad to hear someone else has had a positive experience with them.

Thanks again!

jfriend wrote:

I see.

First, you don't have to wait for the first upload to finish to start another one. Just open a new browser window and get one going in every open window.

Second, I believe that StarExplorer has a feature for "bulk image replacement". You could check it out. I used it as my regular uploader, but don't do a lot of replace photo.

Baldy

klinksk8 wrote:

I am just finding the uploading the editing pictures (in proof delay) one by one and waiting for each to finish to start another upload is very time consuming, and if we were to get any more orders than we currently have, I don't know how we would process all of them. I thought there surely must be a better way, and maybe some other photographers out there with a huge volume might have discovered it. :-)

Thanks for your fast reply!

Tonight's feature release includes bulk replace for proof delay. Here are the release notes, help pages on their way:

http://blogs.smugmug.com/release-notes/2009/10/30/bulk-settings-bulk-replace-for-pros-badge-love-feed-and-iphone-opt-outs-october-29-2009/

swampler

Baldy wrote:

Tonight's feature release includes bulk replace for proof delay. Here are the release notes, help pages on their way:

http://blogs.smugmug.com/release-notes/2009/10/30/bulk-settings-bulk-replace-for-pros-badge-love-feed-and-iphone-opt-outs-october-29-2009/

All it says at that link is:

Pros will find a time-saving new Replace Multiple Photos button for their Proof & Retouch orders. It automagically replaces photos from sales with your retouched photos having the same file names.

and doesn't really tell how to do it. Where do you put the retouched files with the same name? Would be great to have some details here!

Andy

swampler wrote:

All it says at that link is: and doesn't really tell how to do it. Where do you put the retouched files with the same name? Would be great to have some details here!

The help page is coming

swampler

Thanks, Andy. I don't see that screen when I click replace multiple...it takes me back to my home page. Is it still being implemented or do I have an issue on my end? I'm running Firefox 3.5.4 on Win 7 64 bit.

EDIT: Same problem in IE 8.

Thanks, again!

Andy

swampler wrote:

Thanks, Andy. I don't see that screen when I click replace multiple...it takes me back to my home page. Is it still being implemented or do I have an issue on my end? I'm running Firefox 3.5.4 on Win 7 64 bit.

EDIT: Same problem in IE 8.

Thanks, again!

Order #? - can you write our Support Heroes, we'll help you from the desk, thanks!

swampler

Andy wrote:

Order #? - can you write our Support Heroes, we'll help you from the desk, thanks!

Will contact the heroes, thanks.