Sleeping with the Enemy—Trying a D700
I'm a curious person to the core. I like to read manuals and learn something deeply. It's not like me to rally behind a product without knowing what else is out there. I like to know how the other half live. I switched from Aperture to Lightroom after spending months learning and using Aperture because I found it suited me better. It was the philosophy behind the product that was my impetus to go through the hassle of switching, but I'm happier for it and glad I gave it a try despite my investment.
I have owned Canon SLR gear since 1998 and own my fourth Canon DSLR. The choice was easy at the time I bought into digital; I owned 2 lenses from my Elan II. But since taking photography seriously again, I have spent over a year reading reviews and talking with advanced amateur friends who shoot Nikon about the differences. As happy as I have been with the end product, I have battled aspects of my cameras that I thought I would just have to get used to, primarily in the handling. When the D700 was announced in July, I thought this is exactly the kind of thing I've been thinking about. I don't care for the big bodies of the 1D-series and I don't wish for an APS-H sensor. I do, however, want autofocus performance that isn't going to fumble in lowly lit conditions, a highly responsive shutter and a no-compromise build that's full frame. Not since the EOS 3 has Canon made a camera like this in the form factor I want.
I have put off testing this heathen Nikon camera mainly for all the reasons other people don't—it's a total PITA to switch and expensive to buy and maintain a system in both should I find a reason to have both. My favourite lenses are my f/1.4s and f/2s and aside from the current state of UWAs, I'm not wanting for too much in the Canon lens arena. As it turns out, however, I'm a control freak and when I started to learn about the controls and the options on the Nikon pro bodies, spending a little time seemed inevitable, despite all the good reasons to leave well enough alone. Here are some initial thoughts on this experiment, which I'll add to in the coming days.
First of all, everything that people say about "the image quality is all the same, really, in modern DSLRs" is 100% correct. I never had any need for better IQ and I won't really talk about it here. Given the differences in resolution, I don't find the disparity troubling, as I was extremely happy with the 8, 10 and 12MP results of my 30D, XTi and 5D respectively. 21MP is slightly intoxicating and looking at a perfectly in-focus 21MP image at 100% is a sight to behold. I imagine the 24MP cameras have a fraction more to get excited about. For me, it's all gravy above about 12MP.
The other adage, "it's all about how the camera feels in your hands, how you like the layout and the way the camera 'thinks'" is worth more than image quality, I'm beginning to understand. I had a kind of Strobist/McNally-style flash setup and was lucky enough to get the family in front of the camera at once. This NEVER happens. I knew I only had a limited window so I had to work fast. Since I don't have any SB flashes or pocket wizards, I used the 5DmkII, which is a great choice for "studio"-type work in any case. I got some great shots but there were 2 moments where I had to quickly change some settings: ISO, metering and go from single to self-timer. One thing that's always been bothersome to me is the way Canon's prosumer bodies have all the 6 primary shooting controls spread across 3 buttons, laid out right next to each other, which all feel the same. Worse is that the main dial does one thing and the nose wheel does the other. For some reason, the only one I know for sure without looking is WB: it's the closest button to the viewfinder and the nose wheel controls it, but that's all I can remember. Seriously, without looking I can't tell you what the main dial controls on that button. I think AF is on the middle button but couldn't say main dial or nose wheel. After years of using these cameras, it's like day one for me whenever I have to change these settings. Needless to say, I fumbled and changed the wrong setting and had to get it back and I cursed it, as I have many times. Using the Nikon for the past few weeks has been a revelation. Spatially, it just makes more sense to me where it's laid out and I can choose the correct control without looking every time. That even goes for the AF mode switch by the lens: single, continuous or manual. The camera lets my muscle memory take over in a way that is confused by the Canon layout. That's just me; I know the Nikon everything-all-over-the-place thing gets on some people's nerves. I'm a musician and muscle memory is everything to me, so I'm glad to find a good match. I have no opinion of the exposure modes being on a dial or on a button. Both are fast for me. I think the nose wheel wins for fastest navigating, if you compare it and the Nikon pad.
the 5dmkII's menu system has been greatly improved and finding things is much better than it was before. My Menu RULES. I like the smart battery thing, even though it seems a little pointless—I don't usually remove batteries until they're close to dead, so I'm not likely to have a menu full of removed batteries the camera thinks are 56% charged or whatever. The D700 has extensive menus that are a little daunting until you get to know them, but they too have a My Menu and also 4 shooting and custom banks, which I haven't got into yet. One thing I think Canon did right was the C1, C2 & C3 modes on the dial. They simply save the current state. on the Nikon, you have to build these banks from scratch each time. Canon wins for simplicity. In learning the complex Nikon, Thom Hogan's D700 guide is a fantastic help. Highly recommended.
The multi-direction pad on the Nikon is like the little 8-way joystick on the Canons, only bigger. It handles some of the things you expect the nose wheel to handle, like scrolling through pics in playback, though you can program the rear dial to do this. I like the nose wheel, so I sort of miss it on the D700 but it's no biggie either way. The bigger change is the difference between the two dials for selecting shutter speed and aperture. I don't mind either, to be honest, and for some reason I don't have a problem remembering that the rear wheel is shutter on Nikon and the front wheel is shutter on the Canon. Nikon let's you reverse these but I haven't bothered. Still—I like to have the option. Nikon's dials are silent, while Canon's are noisy and more detented-feeling. Whatever.
Both viewfinders are about equal in their bigness, brightness and overall pleasure in looking through. The functionality is where Nikon gets the nod, and this is a huge benefit for me. You see much more in the Nikon VF: metering mode, shooting mode (P, A, S, M), exposure compensation shows you on the meter, and in numbers and the icon turns to plus or minus depending. Very cool. Now that Canon gives you full time ISO in the VF, they've caught up a little but need to do more. The 5DmkII shows 3% more of the frame so yay for Canon.
In terms of options for the control freak, Nikon wins hands down. 5 stops vs 2 stops of compensation. Reversibility/swapping of the controls and the exposure meter. Built-in flash that's also a wireless commander. Built-in intervalometer, multiple exposures, and the list goes on and on. Their Auto ISO beats the 5DII's Auto ISO for my uses and I would say is a major factor for me, given the dark-to-light environments I frequent. Without handling the whole range (100-3200) and giving you a minimum shutter speed control, Canon makes themselves look like they didn't understand all the ways people use this feature. Canon shows their smarts, however, by setting the minimum hand-holdable SS based on the lens or FL you're zoomed to. Very clever, just not for my uses. There are so many options for how the camera drives in the D700, like the priority modes for Single and Continuous Servo modes: you choose if the camera releases shutter before having focused, after successfully having focused, or the way in which it tries to regain focus if it loses it and how that relates to the shutter. It's stuff like this I really appreciate that Canon feels is better to choose for us. I understand that some are happy to not have to think about this and just shoot. I took the 5DmkII and a 50mm to a bar tonight to meet friends for a birthday drink, thinking ISO 6400+ here's your shot. Depending on how many focus points were in use, this release priority was different and set in stone. D700 has 4 programable buttons, which is fantastic and I use them all the time and smile because of it. Canon should give us at least one, and we can bind the MLU to it, natch.
Video: Even though the light at this bar was too dark for the 5DmkII to focus (I was really pushing it's limits and would've loved to compare with the D700), the video mode came in really handy. I love how easy Canon have made using it and assigning picture styles. B&W videos came out pretty cool. I love having a camera that shoots HQ video and for all the naysayery, I think it's wonderful. Even if I end up keeping the D700 I will probably keep the 5DmkII just for this reason, and for it's other obvious strengths. I have all sorts of uses for a pre-focused, mounted, remotely-triggered video SLR in my work and Canon appear to have made the best one so far.
I would miss some of my Canon lenses for sure. 35L and 135L are my two faves, and I have my eyes on the 24L II and 50L. Whether Nikon will get it together enough to address these gaping holes (f/4 zooms as well) is anyone's guess. At the moment I'm borrowing an old Nikon kit lens (35-70 f/3.3-4.5—nothing special) and want to get the 50G, so I can't comment too much on lenses yet. I did rent the 24-70 AF-S for a week and it was beautiful with great contrast, sharpness and feel. It was fast to focus and accurate and if this is how most AF-S lenses behave, it's comparable to the best of the Ring USM Canon lenses in that regard. More to come.
LCDs are pretty similar. I love the option to zoom to 100% in one click on the D700. I love Canon's option to have blinkies on the primary display page. Both have good options for viewing histograms and blinkies. Ultimately, I think Canon's 100% zoom looks better than Nikon's. Don't know why but 100% on the D700 still shows a minor pixelation that I can't explain. I'm not confusing it with the 200% you get when you zoom all the way in. Canon's seems perfect in this regard.
The shutter on the 5DmkII sounds and feels like a motor drive winding film (chick-uuuuh, chick-uuuuh) compared to the D700, which is fast, crisp and responsive (clack!). I don't mind the Canon shutter's rate of 3.9/sec (plenty for me), just make it fire right when I squeeze the button, please. Canon wins in coolness for the Live View silent modes, which may prove to be a boon for me. Too bad you have to have LV on; focusing makes the mirror clack, negating the benefit of the quiet shutter. It's pretty much manual focus if you want this feature, for my purposes.
The grips for the right hand feel different and I like both. The fingers wrap around more on the Nikon and they sit more casually on the Canon. I'm happy with either, but I know some people can't get comfortable with one or the other.
Jeez, I'm starting to write a novella. More to come I'm sure.
I have owned Canon SLR gear since 1998 and own my fourth Canon DSLR. The choice was easy at the time I bought into digital; I owned 2 lenses from my Elan II. But since taking photography seriously again, I have spent over a year reading reviews and talking with advanced amateur friends who shoot Nikon about the differences. As happy as I have been with the end product, I have battled aspects of my cameras that I thought I would just have to get used to, primarily in the handling. When the D700 was announced in July, I thought this is exactly the kind of thing I've been thinking about. I don't care for the big bodies of the 1D-series and I don't wish for an APS-H sensor. I do, however, want autofocus performance that isn't going to fumble in lowly lit conditions, a highly responsive shutter and a no-compromise build that's full frame. Not since the EOS 3 has Canon made a camera like this in the form factor I want.
I have put off testing this heathen Nikon camera mainly for all the reasons other people don't—it's a total PITA to switch and expensive to buy and maintain a system in both should I find a reason to have both. My favourite lenses are my f/1.4s and f/2s and aside from the current state of UWAs, I'm not wanting for too much in the Canon lens arena. As it turns out, however, I'm a control freak and when I started to learn about the controls and the options on the Nikon pro bodies, spending a little time seemed inevitable, despite all the good reasons to leave well enough alone. Here are some initial thoughts on this experiment, which I'll add to in the coming days.
First of all, everything that people say about "the image quality is all the same, really, in modern DSLRs" is 100% correct. I never had any need for better IQ and I won't really talk about it here. Given the differences in resolution, I don't find the disparity troubling, as I was extremely happy with the 8, 10 and 12MP results of my 30D, XTi and 5D respectively. 21MP is slightly intoxicating and looking at a perfectly in-focus 21MP image at 100% is a sight to behold. I imagine the 24MP cameras have a fraction more to get excited about. For me, it's all gravy above about 12MP.
The other adage, "it's all about how the camera feels in your hands, how you like the layout and the way the camera 'thinks'" is worth more than image quality, I'm beginning to understand. I had a kind of Strobist/McNally-style flash setup and was lucky enough to get the family in front of the camera at once. This NEVER happens. I knew I only had a limited window so I had to work fast. Since I don't have any SB flashes or pocket wizards, I used the 5DmkII, which is a great choice for "studio"-type work in any case. I got some great shots but there were 2 moments where I had to quickly change some settings: ISO, metering and go from single to self-timer. One thing that's always been bothersome to me is the way Canon's prosumer bodies have all the 6 primary shooting controls spread across 3 buttons, laid out right next to each other, which all feel the same. Worse is that the main dial does one thing and the nose wheel does the other. For some reason, the only one I know for sure without looking is WB: it's the closest button to the viewfinder and the nose wheel controls it, but that's all I can remember. Seriously, without looking I can't tell you what the main dial controls on that button. I think AF is on the middle button but couldn't say main dial or nose wheel. After years of using these cameras, it's like day one for me whenever I have to change these settings. Needless to say, I fumbled and changed the wrong setting and had to get it back and I cursed it, as I have many times. Using the Nikon for the past few weeks has been a revelation. Spatially, it just makes more sense to me where it's laid out and I can choose the correct control without looking every time. That even goes for the AF mode switch by the lens: single, continuous or manual. The camera lets my muscle memory take over in a way that is confused by the Canon layout. That's just me; I know the Nikon everything-all-over-the-place thing gets on some people's nerves. I'm a musician and muscle memory is everything to me, so I'm glad to find a good match. I have no opinion of the exposure modes being on a dial or on a button. Both are fast for me. I think the nose wheel wins for fastest navigating, if you compare it and the Nikon pad.
the 5dmkII's menu system has been greatly improved and finding things is much better than it was before. My Menu RULES. I like the smart battery thing, even though it seems a little pointless—I don't usually remove batteries until they're close to dead, so I'm not likely to have a menu full of removed batteries the camera thinks are 56% charged or whatever. The D700 has extensive menus that are a little daunting until you get to know them, but they too have a My Menu and also 4 shooting and custom banks, which I haven't got into yet. One thing I think Canon did right was the C1, C2 & C3 modes on the dial. They simply save the current state. on the Nikon, you have to build these banks from scratch each time. Canon wins for simplicity. In learning the complex Nikon, Thom Hogan's D700 guide is a fantastic help. Highly recommended.
The multi-direction pad on the Nikon is like the little 8-way joystick on the Canons, only bigger. It handles some of the things you expect the nose wheel to handle, like scrolling through pics in playback, though you can program the rear dial to do this. I like the nose wheel, so I sort of miss it on the D700 but it's no biggie either way. The bigger change is the difference between the two dials for selecting shutter speed and aperture. I don't mind either, to be honest, and for some reason I don't have a problem remembering that the rear wheel is shutter on Nikon and the front wheel is shutter on the Canon. Nikon let's you reverse these but I haven't bothered. Still—I like to have the option. Nikon's dials are silent, while Canon's are noisy and more detented-feeling. Whatever.
Both viewfinders are about equal in their bigness, brightness and overall pleasure in looking through. The functionality is where Nikon gets the nod, and this is a huge benefit for me. You see much more in the Nikon VF: metering mode, shooting mode (P, A, S, M), exposure compensation shows you on the meter, and in numbers and the icon turns to plus or minus depending. Very cool. Now that Canon gives you full time ISO in the VF, they've caught up a little but need to do more. The 5DmkII shows 3% more of the frame so yay for Canon.
In terms of options for the control freak, Nikon wins hands down. 5 stops vs 2 stops of compensation. Reversibility/swapping of the controls and the exposure meter. Built-in flash that's also a wireless commander. Built-in intervalometer, multiple exposures, and the list goes on and on. Their Auto ISO beats the 5DII's Auto ISO for my uses and I would say is a major factor for me, given the dark-to-light environments I frequent. Without handling the whole range (100-3200) and giving you a minimum shutter speed control, Canon makes themselves look like they didn't understand all the ways people use this feature. Canon shows their smarts, however, by setting the minimum hand-holdable SS based on the lens or FL you're zoomed to. Very clever, just not for my uses. There are so many options for how the camera drives in the D700, like the priority modes for Single and Continuous Servo modes: you choose if the camera releases shutter before having focused, after successfully having focused, or the way in which it tries to regain focus if it loses it and how that relates to the shutter. It's stuff like this I really appreciate that Canon feels is better to choose for us. I understand that some are happy to not have to think about this and just shoot. I took the 5DmkII and a 50mm to a bar tonight to meet friends for a birthday drink, thinking ISO 6400+ here's your shot. Depending on how many focus points were in use, this release priority was different and set in stone. D700 has 4 programable buttons, which is fantastic and I use them all the time and smile because of it. Canon should give us at least one, and we can bind the MLU to it, natch.
Video: Even though the light at this bar was too dark for the 5DmkII to focus (I was really pushing it's limits and would've loved to compare with the D700), the video mode came in really handy. I love how easy Canon have made using it and assigning picture styles. B&W videos came out pretty cool. I love having a camera that shoots HQ video and for all the naysayery, I think it's wonderful. Even if I end up keeping the D700 I will probably keep the 5DmkII just for this reason, and for it's other obvious strengths. I have all sorts of uses for a pre-focused, mounted, remotely-triggered video SLR in my work and Canon appear to have made the best one so far.
I would miss some of my Canon lenses for sure. 35L and 135L are my two faves, and I have my eyes on the 24L II and 50L. Whether Nikon will get it together enough to address these gaping holes (f/4 zooms as well) is anyone's guess. At the moment I'm borrowing an old Nikon kit lens (35-70 f/3.3-4.5—nothing special) and want to get the 50G, so I can't comment too much on lenses yet. I did rent the 24-70 AF-S for a week and it was beautiful with great contrast, sharpness and feel. It was fast to focus and accurate and if this is how most AF-S lenses behave, it's comparable to the best of the Ring USM Canon lenses in that regard. More to come.
LCDs are pretty similar. I love the option to zoom to 100% in one click on the D700. I love Canon's option to have blinkies on the primary display page. Both have good options for viewing histograms and blinkies. Ultimately, I think Canon's 100% zoom looks better than Nikon's. Don't know why but 100% on the D700 still shows a minor pixelation that I can't explain. I'm not confusing it with the 200% you get when you zoom all the way in. Canon's seems perfect in this regard.
The shutter on the 5DmkII sounds and feels like a motor drive winding film (chick-uuuuh, chick-uuuuh) compared to the D700, which is fast, crisp and responsive (clack!). I don't mind the Canon shutter's rate of 3.9/sec (plenty for me), just make it fire right when I squeeze the button, please. Canon wins in coolness for the Live View silent modes, which may prove to be a boon for me. Too bad you have to have LV on; focusing makes the mirror clack, negating the benefit of the quiet shutter. It's pretty much manual focus if you want this feature, for my purposes.
The grips for the right hand feel different and I like both. The fingers wrap around more on the Nikon and they sit more casually on the Canon. I'm happy with either, but I know some people can't get comfortable with one or the other.
Jeez, I'm starting to write a novella. More to come I'm sure.
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Comments
FWIW I believe the D700 will actually zoom to a maximum of 400% in playback mode which explains why one step back looks pixellated (it's still at 200%)
Thanls for the insights and comparisons.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
It seems with your keen interest in perusing manuals that you'll get the best out of whichever body you choose, although only one will look cool around your neck and that's the Nikon
Well it might be worth a lot. I'll have to look into this. Thanks for the heads-up
I see it all the time. "I'm not happy with my photographs and thinking of upgrading my camera"-type of thing. When I look at shots I took with my 400D, I don't think, "boy, those really look cheap" or "that camera really held me back." One of my favourite photos I've ever taken was with that camera. IQ is a non-issue, in my view. Thanks for reading.
If I had just some Canon gear and was deciding on the 5D2 or the D700.. boy it would have been a tough tough call! You make me want to sleep with the enemy too!
www.tednghiem.com
You're quite right. You have a choice of Low (50%), Medium (100%) or High (200%) magnification. Obviously Medium is the ticket.
Very informative and useful, this would be a wonderful piece to look at when people are trying different brands, points out how nuanced and subtle this kind of choice can be.
Thanks for the good read!
I recently decided to upgrade my Canon 350D and did not have much invested in glass so was torn between the Canon 50D and Nikon D300. Read the reviews, looked at samples until I was thoroughly confused. Then I went to the local camera store and picked up the D300. First thought were:
"wow, there sure are a lot of buttons" and "how the h--l do I tell it where to focus?!?!?!"
I realized that I was now comfortable with the Canon system and to relearn all of the settings and switches wasn't worth the premium price involved. Ended up with the 50D and couldn't be happier (well, I guess if I had gotten a 5DII for the same price I might have been just a bit happier
E
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Some of the files can be processed in the newer RAW converters to pretty nice images these days.
The Nikon camera bodies are really tempting these days, and I say that as a white lens shooter.
I REALLY miss the built in wireless shutter release, and the wireless flash commander modes that Nikon has! Canon needs these modes badly! As well as easy MLU!
Moderator of the Technique Forum and Finishing School on Dgrin
I always had wondered if there was any real difference between Nikon and Canon that would make it worth switching to one or the other.
At any rate, I quite like my Nikon D50, and the only thing that is currently at all potentially tempting-to-the-point-of-switching is that crazy 5:1 macro lens canon has.
I am looking to upgrade within the next few years though...
I'm no megapixel fiend, but 6 megapixels can be a bit low for larger prints.
The D50 fares terribly with moderate-ISOs as well
And it was the entry level SLR they had when I got it... I'd love to get my hands on something higher end.
At the same time, I wouldn't mind trying out a Canon for a while, just to see what it was like (and if I was missing out on anything :P)
I think the fact of the "system" is the biggest shame in all this.
www.tednghiem.com
Renting the 14-24 this week. It was love from the first look through the finder. It's also HEAVY and HUGE. Truly amazing.
A major difference in the LiveView features is that the D700 is maybe 6-10 fps whereas the Canon is easily 30fps, since it has to be for video. On a tripod, or in regular use, this isn't a concern on the D700, but the smooth, latency-free playback on the Canon is really nice, and the performance is more or less the same through the HDMI port for both cameras.
The video mode, when live, plays through the TV with no latency or delay, which I found really impressive. The image was good, though again, I'm not sure the real resolution. I wonder if an up-scaled 720x480 was at work here. Will report after more tests.
You would have ordered one of the harder-to-get lenses currently out there
Have a blast with it!!
Nikon's idea was to give you the same focus options but when you hold the shutter button down half-way on your way to take the picture, the mirror drops and you take a picture from regular non-live view mode, causing the mirror to flip down then up then down again. There is all this unnecessary mirror flipping. Why can't the Nikon take your photo with the mirror already up? it's as though you wanted to do some last-minute check in the viewfinder before popping the photo off. I don't get it.
After a couple months of comparative use, I've revised my thoughts on this. I prefer the softer, quiet dials. The clicky Canon dials could scare a skittish subject away. Are the 1D dials as noisy? I somehow doubt it.
Again, I wrestle with the Nikon Live View. Boy it really is idiotic. The 5DmkII Live View is just transparent and totally intuitive.
I gotta say—really liking having two cameras, whatever the make. Having one with a 50 and another with something longer on you (R-Strap, people!) is fantastic for people photography. The 50mm f/1.4G is so far a really great lens, but I'm beginning to understand why the 50L sells. The 50G doesn't shine in sharpness until f/2.8, but is rather good at f/2. Because of the overall feel, I just pick up the D700 75% of the time if I have to grab a quick shot. With only one lens, I think that says a lot. Having said that, I have been making peace with the 5DmkII's AI Servo, which, for all the bitching, isn't quite as slow (or inaccurate) as it was on the 5D. Perhaps that Digic 4 really is making a little difference. The change—I find—is in the slower shutter speeds. In other words, at equal exposure and focal length (say 50mm @ 1/60s), the D700 yields me more in-focus shots. Go up to 1/1000s and the gap narrows and it may be the lens choice. The Canon 135 f/2 is the best focusing lens I own and with that on, focus just flies, albeit with some duds.
More, live from the scene, as it happens.
When you set exposure compensation in AP or SP mode, then switch to M, the EC you've set biases the meter so your manual exposure will match what you'd get in the automated modes. It's not that it's difficult to under- or over-compensate your settings in manual, it's simply a nice touch. Come to think of it, it IS difficult to compensate manually more than 3 stops, since the Nikon's meter only shows 3 stops. I've never needed more than 3 to date, but, again, this is well thought out.
Do you get vignetting (black, from the edge of the lens itself) with the 50mm f/1.4G? I do and yet feel like I'm the only one...
ps. keep with the updates, love them!
I haven't noticed much, but I'm almost always stopping down to f/2 or f/2.8. I'm not crazy about the IQ at f/1.4-1.8. A little disappointing. Above f/2, it's pretty darn good.
Excellent point. I'll have to see what I had it on with my D3. I believe I was doing indoor horse shots (aka low light speed), so I was stopped down as far as I could. And I definitely got vingetting on those images
see?
(at work, so can't access the camera exif data)
I've been experimenting with astrophotography and have found that 2.8 is really the sweet spot for this lens. As you say, it's not bad at f/2, but it really sharpens up by 2.8 and the coma is gone. Besides, the ISO performance on the D700 is so good that I don't even think about it -- I just set Auto ISO and forget.