Please read this thread - Advice needed! SCAM

JohnBiggs

Ok, So I agreed to do a TFCD today for some 'agency'. A lot of things seemed suspect about this photoshoot. But I decided I would do it. Well while doing the shoot with the model (her first time) she said something like she paid for half and the agency paid for the other half.

We'll I'm assuming she paid the agency for 'half' of the photography. But I'm doing a TFCD. So I really wonder if this place is just taking this girl's money.

Should I do anything? Should I just deliver the photos as agreed and not say anything? I feel bad for her and I wonder what other money they are going to con out of her.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding the whole thing she said... I don't know.

Thansk all.

ChatKat

You got conned....
She paid for the shoot but you are the one who got conned.

They paid the price you agreed to be paid - nothing.
When we make our work worthless, we get paid what we deserve to get - nothing. It costs you the equipment, the time and we as photographers all get no respect in the process because so many of us are willing to devalue our knowledge and our time.

catspaw

(TFCD = ? )

marikris

catspaw wrote:

(TFCD = ? ) <img src="https://us.v-cdn.net/6029383/emoji/headscratch.gif&quot; border="0" alt="" >

<table id="entries"><tbody><tr><td class="index">1. </td> <td class="word"> tfcd </td> <td class="tools" id="tools_2232924"> </td> </tr> <tr> <td>
</td> <td class="text" colspan="2"> TFCD - Time for CD of digital images

A model, or would-be model agrees to give up her time and pose for a photographer who agrees to provide her/him with a selection of images for her/his portfolio.

For a model just starting out it can be a good way to pick up modelling experience and some images to start her/his book. For the photographer it gives him/her experience of trying different things and working with various models.

Jill got her start in modeling by using TFCD arrangements with various photogrpahers.
</td></tr></tbody></table>

from http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tfcd

Matt S

marikris wrote:

from http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tfcd

Yeah they took her for a ride. And you too for that matter. She paid half of your fee, they "paid" half of your fee. And they pocketed all of it. Scam maybe not, unethical as hell........ Yes. I would imagine telling the model that you charged no fee, would get her asking questions of the agency.

KyleMc569

I would make sure she knows about www.ModelMayhem.com next time. Eliminate the agency middle-man. She sounds pretty naive. Hopefully, that agency doesn't take her for an expensive ride.

JohnBiggs

ChatKat wrote:

She paid for the shoot but you are the one who got conned.

They paid the price you agreed to be paid - nothing.
When we make our work worthless, we get paid what we deserve to get - nothing. It costs you the equipment, the time and we as photographers all get no respect in the process because so many of us are willing to devalue our knowledge and our time.

They did not scam me. I agreed to do a TFCD shoot. They agreed to send a model. For me thats the end of the deal.

But for her, They charged her for the photoshoot ($150 she sent me an email). But they had a fake photography company send her the bill for the $150. So now it's a little more involved then just an unethical treatment.

So should I just tell the model I did not charge for the shoot and let her go at it with the 'agency'. I really think they are going to scam her for more money.

The Mack

JohnBiggs wrote:

They did not scam me. I agreed to do a TFCD shoot. They agreed to send a model. For me thats the end of the deal.

But for her, They charged her for the photoshoot ($150 she sent me an email). But they had a fake photography company send her the bill for the $150. So now it's a little more involved then just an unethical treatment.

So should I just tell the model I did not charge for the shoot and let her go at it with the 'agency'. I really think they are going to scam her for more money.

Sure, why not? You're thinking too far into this lol

Flutist

Yes.

Art Scott

JohnBiggs wrote:

They did not scam me. I agreed to do a TFCD shoot. They agreed to send a model. For me thats the end of the deal.

But for her, They charged her for the photoshoot ($150 she sent me an email). But they had a fake photography company send her the bill for the $150. So now it's a little more involved then just an unethical treatment.

So should I just tell the model I did not charge for the shoot and let her go at it with the 'agency'. I really think they are going to scam her for more money.

I would tell that you shot it for tfcd and explain that to her, as she may be so green as to not understand waht it is......also I would have her turn them into the BBB and ask for a full refund from them ...... If she was worth shooting and if you need to build a portfolio, then make her an offer to shoot 1 more session for tfcd and give her a break on future sessions.....also tell her of places like Model Mayhem and One Model Place for her to get exposure.................and for international exposure she should look at www.missonline.cz ......

catspaw

Art Scott wrote:

I would tell that you shot it for tfcd and explain that to her, as she may be so green as to not understand waht it is......also I would have her turn them into the BBB and ask for a full refund from them ...... If she was worth shooting and if you need to build a portfolio, then make her an offer to shoot 1 more session for tfcd and give her a break on future sessions.....also tell her of places like Model Mayhem and One Model Place for her to get exposure.................and for international exposure she should look at www.missonline.cz ......

I wouldn't suggest the BBB unless she starts ranting about them ripping her off. I'd be careful of accusing them of anything unless she starts in on it first. I'd simply lay out the facts, include information on alternative avenues she has and let her piece it together.

Scott McLeod Photo

If you don't mind pissing the agency off at you and are ready for the potentail repoccussions from this then you could tell the model. This is just me thinking, but I would do about 5 more TFCD throught the agency then, approach them and mention that a model had emailed you and wondered why the bill didn't have your name. Then you don't have just one example, but 5. Then you could get the agency to actually pay you, since you have a good bit proof of a habit of them doing questionable things.

This could possibly benefit both you and the agency (it may force them to clean up there act), and their future clientele.

Matt S

Scott McLeod Photo wrote:

If you don't mind pissing the agency off at you and are ready for the potentail repoccussions from this then you could tell the model. This is just me thinking, but I would do about 5 more TFCD throught the agency then, approach them and mention that a model had emailed you and wondered why the bill didn't have your name. Then you don't have just one example, but 5. Then you could get the agency to actually pay you, since you have a good bit proof of a habit of them doing questionable things.

This could possibly benefit both you and the agency (it may force them to clean up there act), and their future clientele.

Well any agency that would dupe up a phony bill to a model is not someone I would do business with. This goes a little beyond shady into just plain deceit and fraud. Also what is your liability if you continue to do work with them knowing what they are doing, it makes you an accomplice, in fact if you do nothing now with the knowledge you already have you may be aiding a fraud as it is.

To me this is a very serious matter and should be dealt with, if for no other reason than to cover your own behind.

Scott McLeod Photo

I know you are right, but my thinking was more along the lines if you had more evidence, then that can't claim a mistake, etc (whatever fake story they come up with) as well as having meet a few more models of theirs. Since you are doing TFCD sounds like you are wanting to expand your port, and meet and shoot a larger pool of models.

Just a different answer than everybody else, not that I could necessarily do it.

Quantum3

JohnBiggs wrote:

Ok, So I agreed to do a TFCD today for some 'agency'. A lot of things seemed suspect about this photoshoot. But I decided I would do it. Well while doing the shoot with the model (her first time) she said something like she paid for half and the agency paid for the other half.

We'll I'm assuming she paid the agency for 'half' of the photography. But I'm doing a TFCD. So I really wonder if this place is just taking this girl's money.

Should I do anything? Should I just deliver the photos as agreed and not say anything? I feel bad for her and I wonder what other money they are going to con out of her.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding the whole thing she said... I don't know.

Thansk all.

Hi, I live in Argentina and I'm very familiarized with scamming.

There are 2 possibilities:

1) The girl is scamming you.
2) The agency is scamming you and the girl.

Of course, maybe there is any scam.

1) How can she scam you? Will depend in if she already paid you the 50% or not. She may is suggesting that she will pay you after the photoshot or after the agency pays you. Both options are pure scam, no body pays after.

2) The agency could scam her by saying they will pay her after having the photos and then they just dissapear without payng to you and paying to the girl. And even, the girl could lie saying that the agency didn't paid her.

Considering the country where I live, I would ask a down payment of the 75% of the total amount before shooting.

Hope this help,

Mart

Quantum3

JohnBiggs wrote:

They did not scam me. I agreed to do a TFCD shoot. They agreed to send a model. For me thats the end of the deal.

But for her, They charged her for the photoshoot ($150 she sent me an email). But they had a fake photography company send her the bill for the $150. So now it's a little more involved then just an unethical treatment.

So should I just tell the model I did not charge for the shoot and let her go at it with the 'agency'. I really think they are going to scam her for more money.

All agencies pays the photoshots, it's quite abnormal the situation you describe. In fact, a novate model usually hires a photographer without intermediate agencies. Talking soon and with objetivity, I would take the money from her, do the photoshot and then, inquiry the agency for the other half. If they don't have a right behavior with that, starting some kind of law thing, of course, if you pay taxes for being a photographer and all that stuff. You have a personal contact with the model, so you can tell if she's scamming as well or not. But from my chair, I woulnd't think so nice about the model. I think you should talk with her or dealing. I would probably deal with her, asking the 75% and forget the agency, hire a photographer without intermediations. Agencies are not useful at this particular point.

JohnBiggs

Thanks All.

I told the model it was a scam and she should contact Paypal. I also told her to join popular model sites and start networking with other photographers as her best chance.

I initially googled the name of the model agency - nylamodelz (yes, the z in the name made me suspicious) but the name didn't result in much, that also made me suspicious.

After she sent me the bill, I googled the name of the photo agency she paid and BINGO.

http://selizabethphotography.blogspot.com/2009/01/scam-watch.html

This place just keeps buying new domains and scamming people.

The bits she told me are identical to similar stories in this article.

Scott_Quier

JohnBiggs wrote:

Thanks All.

I told the model it was a scam and she should contact Paypal. I also told her to join popular model sites and start networking with other photographers as her best chance.

I initially googled the name of the model agency - nylamodelz (yes, the z in the name made me suspicious) but the name didn't result in much, that also made me suspicious.

After she sent me the bill, I googled the name of the photo agency she paid and BINGO.

http://selizabethphotography.blogspot.com/2009/01/scam-watch.html

This place just keeps buying new domains and scamming people.

The bits she told me are identical to similar stories in this article.

And another man with real character comes to the fore! Good on you for helping her out as much as you could.

I hope the poor lady is able to get her $$$ back from PayPal - I don't have any clue what their policy might be in a situation like this.