Capture NX2 vs. LR2

J.T.

Anyone shooting Nikon (and use their NEF file format) and have any experience using Nikon's Capture NX2 and LR2 for the Mac?

I have downloaded the trial version on LR2 and am trying to learn as much as I can before I make a decision. The cost isn't an issue with either one right now.

I am not too familiar with Capture NX2 but a few people at Apple Discussions mentioned that NX2 might be a good option compared to LR2.

I guess my main concerns are the way the software organizies the files, options/ease of editing tools, and ease of workflow.

Thanks.

slipkid

LR2 all the way, I never warmed up to NX2. LR2 handles RAW just fine and has a much better database.

Kyle D

I've been a Capture NX user since I first started shooting RAW and have loved the program. The same goes for NX2. When I first started using it I was at a complete loss as to how to use NX and therefor kind of stuck with Photoshop. That was until I was told about an e-book written by Jason Odell called The Photographer's Guide to Capture NX2. It is a well written e-book and has helped me tremendosly, I also bought his book on Capture NX and then when NX2 was released purchased his newest book. It's like night and day between how I was fumbling around in NX and getting frustrated to how I've developed a workflow that is centred round NX, which handles 95% of my work.

Unfortunately, a big draw back of NX is it's lack of a database capability. It only comes with a rudimentary file browser that you can tag and rate the photos in and sort them, but other than that you can't do much. With that in mind I've been thinking about seriously trying out lightroom for it's database and organizational aspects because manually organizing over 15k images is a royal pain in the butt, especially if you have to find a specific image and you don't remember when exactly it was taken or what the file name is. So, I may give lightroom a go but I'll probably stick with NX2 for the editing, it just makes sense to me.

I hope that helps!

viewfinder

NX2 and Lightroom are really very different.

NX2 is one of the best RAW convertors for NEF files, Capture One is also reported to be very good, possibly slightly better in detail extraction than NX2. But NX2 is somewhat chunky in interface which puts a lot of folk off, though it does work OK.

NX2 will also read all the in camera settings that you chose regarding Dlight, sharpening, WB etc. Lightroom won't. And if you edit in NX2 and then open as a RAW in Lightroom all your work will not show in Lightroom. (well not for long as the preview replaces the jpg thumb)

In my opinion NX2 is far Better for RAW conversion than Lightroom and the upix technology is excellent.

Saying that I do the majority of my work within Lightroom because for most images the quality that it provides is fine. (family pix, general conversions, proofs etc.) Lightroom has some clever technology too - but I find there are more technical image shortfalls in LR than NX2. Lightroom is an excellent database, but you need to set it up correctly with at least some basic keywords or meta information.

As for another option - DXO, excellent too!

atb
Steven

J.T.

great info from all, thanks
Thanks for all the input from your replies.

I think I am leaning towards LR anyways but the info in NX2 was very helpful.

John

Drazick

J.T. wrote:

Anyone shooting Nikon (and use their NEF file format) and have any experience using Nikon's Capture NX2 and LR2 for the Mac?

I have downloaded the trial version on LR2 and am trying to learn as much as I can before I make a decision. The cost isn't an issue with either one right now.

I am not too familiar with Capture NX2 but a few people at Apple Discussions mentioned that NX2 might be a good option compared to LR2.

I guess my main concerns are the way the software organizies the files, options/ease of editing tools, and ease of workflow.

Thanks.

Quality wise, ACR / Lightroom isn't even close to Capture NX 2.
Yet I think it has its advantages on managing archive and the UI.

ifocus

Drazick wrote:

Quality wise, ACR / Lightroom isn't even close to Capture NX 2.
Yet I think it has its advantages on managing archive and the UI.

I do agree, CNX2 is amazing to edit NEF files. I use color EFEX Pro 3 plug in as well, never a need of anything else. You could easily use another DAM for your image management needs.

Quantum3

NX for NEF, the rest can be done in LR
Hi,

I have done a comparisson between both programs at the same time in the same picture.

LR don't represent the same colors than NX, nor the same sharpness, nor the same quality about noise.

LR generates too much noise/posterization and colors are quite different and the contrast and luminance is quite different from NX, which shows the image as it was captured.

Both programs have been tested with the original defaults, excepts LR, I tryed different camera caibrations, but still the same bad quality for NEF's editings.

NX has a good advantaje, which are the selection point controls and the possibility to blend steps (like in Photoshop) and divide the workflow into some kind of L*a*b* and RGB. I usually don't have the need to go into Photoshop after editing my NEF's in NX.

LR is good to preview the images very fast, catalog them and it's quite intuitive, but for editing NEF's is really bad.

NX needs to be learnt before use and the interface is very twisted, not good for catalogs, nor browsing.

bandgeekndb

Well, now this has me thinking.

Currently, I just pop my card into Lightroom and tell it convert to DNG and copy to my computer.

Then I edit from there, occasionally going to TIFF when working with PS CS4 or Noise Ninja.

Can someone describe (maybe a few pics?) this massive difference between performance of NX2 over LR2? I did not think my pictures were bad by any means after running through ACR, doing a pretty faithful representation of what I saw on shoot.

If NX2 is so much better, is there a nice way to work it in WITH Lightroom? I absolutely LOVE LR at this point, and live by the features included, so I can't very well up and leave, especially if people are saying NX2 has bad file management tools.

Thanks!

Kyle D

bandgeekndb wrote:

If NX2 is so much better, is there a nice way to work it in WITH Lightroom? I absolutely LOVE LR at this point, and live by the features included, so I can't very well up and leave, especially if people are saying NX2 has bad file management tools.

Thanks!

That's what I've been trying to investigate. I've been a long time user of NX and now NX2 and swear by its output. It does a great job on the NEFs from my D50 that I don't even hesitate to shoot at iso1600.

Unfortunately, a huge downside of NX is it's file browser/organization features. It pretty much doesn't have any. That is why I've started looking at using LR2 along with NX2. Unfortunately, I've been unable to find anyway to smoothly use LR2 with NX2. What I wanted to do was use LR2 for ingest/organization/tagging and then use NX2 for the editing of the NEFs and finally uploading to SmugMug with LR2 (hoping that LR2 can see the updated jpg imbedded in the NEF file and then creating the jpg when uploading).

I've yet to be able to figure out how to do this, since LR2 writes metadata to xmp files and NX2 doesn't read xmp files. So in order to get the metadata from LR2 into the NEFs, I needed to use Photo Mechanic to imbed the data from the xmp files into the NEFs. That solved one problem. Now about the problem of LR2 seeing the updated jpg inside an NEF. I opened the NEF with NX2 did a b&w conversion on it (to make it obvious to see that something had changed) and then saved the nef. The changes instantly showed up in Nikon's ViewNX which I was happy about. I then restarted LR2 and checked, it gave me a message "updating file changes", so I was hopeful. Unfortunately, the image didn't change from colour to b&w. So, I'm at a loss right now. Besides, it's not very efficient to tag in LR2 then have to open Photo Mechanic to imbed the info in the NEF and then open in NX2.

I may have to get used to using ViewNX instead of LR2 and the Upload to SmugMug app. But from what my experience and research shows, there isn't a way to make LR2 and NX2 play nicely together.

ifocus

bandgeekndb wrote:

Well, now this has me thinking.

Currently, I just pop my card into Lightroom and tell it convert to DNG and copy to my computer.

Then I edit from there, occasionally going to TIFF when working with PS CS4 or Noise Ninja.

Can someone describe (maybe a few pics?) this massive difference between performance of NX2 over LR2? I did not think my pictures were bad by any means after running through ACR, doing a pretty faithful representation of what I saw on shoot.

If NX2 is so much better, is there a nice way to work it in WITH Lightroom? I absolutely LOVE LR at this point, and live by the features included, so I can't very well up and leave, especially if people are saying NX2 has bad file management tools.

Thanks!

Feel free to visit my Smugmug Galleries.All the pictures post-processed with CNX2 and Color EFEX Pro 3 plug-in.

Tuna

ifocus wrote:

Feel free to visit my Smugmug Galleries.All the pictures post-processed with CNX2 and Color EFEX Pro 3 plug-in.

After reading this thread I went back to NX2 to play around with some stuff now that I've become more familiar with LR2. It definitely isn't as user friendly as LR, but I'm willing to learn if it means better quality images. I'm curious, though, how to make some of the adjustments beyond the basics. In Lightroom 2, I'm very fond of the Recovery, Clarity, and Vibrance sliders. Is there anything similar in NX2? If there is, I haven't found it yet.

Kyle D

Tuna wrote:

After reading this thread I went back to NX2 to play around with some stuff now that I've become more familiar with LR2. It definitely isn't as user friendly as LR, but I'm willing to learn if it means better quality images. I'm curious, though, how to make some of the adjustments beyond the basics. In Lightroom 2, I'm very fond of the Recovery, Clarity, and Vibrance sliders. Is there anything similar in NX2? If there is, I haven't found it yet.

I'm not sure what the clarity and vibrance sliders do. But for the equivalent to the recovery, check out the d-lighting tool under adjust->light->d-lighting.

I hope that helps.

300m

Tuna, I have not not found them either and I have looked at Aperature also. Been using LR since ver 1.2, so you can say I am engrained with the system. Vibrance is in CS4 but recovery, (highlight recovery) Clarity (midtone sharpening) I have not found. Vibrance From Adobe "Vibrance adds colour saturation into the colours that need it whilst leaving other colours alone"
There is another sied effect that I noticed in that the adjustment area is forced circual and the adjustments spill over. View the tutorial on CaptureNX site, the sky spills over into the water and watch the new video from Scott Kelby and Matt K on Nikon D town http://www.nikondtown.com/
The adjustment they make to the house spills over to the bridge and the bridge is not 2 different colors of white. In LR I use the adjustment brush and conotrol where I want my adjustments. I also use lightroom for database managment and printing
I looked into Aperature, to much work to use and Capture one Pro, but that was not worth $400 to do what I already owned and did not have the vibrance and clarity and a few others I use

Kyle, Dlighting only works if your camera supports it and my D200 does not.
John

Kyle D

300m wrote:

Kyle, Dlighting only works if your camera supports it and my D200 does not.
John

That's not true, in NX2 there are two types of d-lighting. I have a D50 and use d-lighting on practically every shot I process in NX2. The one I described (adjust menu -> light sub-menu -> d-lighting) is available to anyone, even if their processing tiff or jpgs. The d-lighting you're referring to I believe is located in the develop section where you can alter the in camera recorded settings (white balance, tone/contrast/sharpening settings). If you're camera doesn't support in camera d-lighting like the D50 doesn't, then the option for d-lighting in that area will be grayed out.

Tuna

I found this nice comparison between the quality of Lightroom and Capture NX RAW conversions today.

http://textblog.anands.net/2008/04/15/processing-nikon-d300-images-with-capture-nx-and-adobe-lightroom/

Kyle D

Tuna wrote:

I found this nice comparison between the quality of Lightroom and Capture NX RAW conversions today.

http://textblog.anands.net/2008/04/15/processing-nikon-d300-images-with-capture-nx-and-adobe-lightroom/

Thanks for posting that, now if only someone could find one comparing NX2 to LR2.

Tuna

Kyle D wrote:

Thanks for posting that, now if only someone could find one comparing NX2 to LR2.

Yeah, I have looked for one. No such luck so far, but if I find one, I'll definitely post it up here.

Kyle D

Tuna wrote:

Yeah, I have looked for one. No such luck so far, but if I find one, I'll definitely post it up here.

It would be interesting to see one because from my experience NX2 is much better than NX and I would assume that Adobe made a large amount of improvements with LR2 as well.

Tuna

I have a question about RAW processing in NX2. When I make changes to a RAW file, if I go to close NX2, it asks me if I'd like to save the changes. I always hit "Yes", but when I go back into NX2 later on, I don't see the changes saved. It goes back to my original version. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong here, but it'd suck to have to redo everything every time I want to make a small change. I've also noticed that it creates massive TIFF files every time with the new changes. It doesn't overwrite the old TIFF files either. It makes a new one each time I save changes. I'm sure this is all intertwined somehow, but I'm not sure how to fix it. Creating so many TIFFs, sometimes upward of 50mb each, will start filling up space pretty quickly I think, so I'd like to get this "problem" fixed now if at all possible.

Kyle D

Tuna wrote:

I have a question about RAW processing in NX2. When I make changes to a RAW file, if I go to close NX2, it asks me if I'd like to save the changes. I always hit "Yes", but when I go back into NX2 later on, I don't see the changes saved. It goes back to my original version. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong here, but it'd suck to have to redo everything every time I want to make a small change. I've also noticed that it creates massive TIFF files every time with the new changes. It doesn't overwrite the old TIFF files either. It makes a new one each time I save changes. I'm sure this is all intertwined somehow, but I'm not sure how to fix it. Creating so many TIFFs, sometimes upward of 50mb each, will start filling up space pretty quickly I think, so I'd like to get this "problem" fixed now if at all possible.

I'll take a look tomorrow sometime if I get a chance and maybe post some screenshots of how I have my NX2 set up. I don't have the issues you are describing. I'll also enlighten you of how you can save multiple versions of an image inside the same NEF file (ie. different crops, b&w, etc...). Unfortunately, I'm way too tired right now.

Tuna

Kyle D wrote:

I'll take a look tomorrow sometime if I get a chance and maybe post some screenshots of how I have my NX2 set up. I don't have the issues you are describing. I'll also enlighten you of how you can save multiple versions of an image inside the same NEF file (ie. different crops, b&w, etc...). Unfortunately, I'm way too tired right now.

I think I got it figured out, actually, but I'm still very interested to see how you have your NX2 set up! Thanks!

Kyle D

My Capture NX2 Settings
Here's screen shots of my Capture NX2 settings. If a menu doesn't appear that means I've left it at the default settings and know for a fact that I did.

General Settings:


Colour Management Settings:


Levels and Samplings Settings:


Cache Settings:

Kyle D

How to save multiple versions of an image to a single NEF file.
For those that either didn't know that you could or know how to, there is a way that you can save multiple versions of an image to one NEF file.

Here's how:

1. Open the image you want to work on and do the edits.
2. Before you click save, go over to the edit list and click on the drop down menu where it says "Version".
   
3. Go down the list to "New Version" and click it.
   
4. A new window should pop up, enter in a meaningful name and then click ok.
   
5. You can now Ctrl+S or go to file save, to save the file. You now have your newest version along with the original saved in one NEF file.
   
   Now, if you want to rename or delete any of your versions then you just follow the next couple of instructions.
6. To rename or delete any of your versions, again go to the "Versions" menu in the edit list and drop down to "Edit Version" and click.
   
7. The edit versions window pops up.
   
8. Select the version from the list that you want to edit.
   
9. Then either click Rename or Delete.
   
   
   
10. Once you've edited the versions, click ok, and then save your NEF file.

Tuna

Thanks a lot, Kyle.

Kyle D

Tuna wrote:

Thanks a lot, Kyle.

It's no problem and I hope that helped!

ky1

re nx2 vs Ltr
I use nx2 for nikon raw files its way loads better for nef files lightroom just doesnt show the photos as they really are I also use a program called photo mechanic which works brilliantly with nx2 on a mac using the spotlight facility within photo mechanic Photos can be found easily.

Quantum3

bandgeekndb wrote:

Well, now this has me thinking.

Currently, I just pop my card into Lightroom and tell it convert to DNG and copy to my computer.

Then I edit from there, occasionally going to TIFF when working with PS CS4 or Noise Ninja.

Can someone describe (maybe a few pics?) this massive difference between performance of NX2 over LR2? I did not think my pictures were bad by any means after running through ACR, doing a pretty faithful representation of what I saw on shoot.

If NX2 is so much better, is there a nice way to work it in WITH Lightroom? I absolutely LOVE LR at this point, and live by the features included, so I can't very well up and leave, especially if people are saying NX2 has bad file management tools.

Thanks!

I also love Lightroom, in fact, some of the bad things about lightroom are okay except the amount of posterization. I like my pictures clean of posterization. If I would added fill light in lightroom, my hair would look extremely posterized, won't happen in NX.

Will upload a default settings comparisson here:

Quantum3

Tuna wrote:

After reading this thread I went back to NX2 to play around with some stuff now that I've become more familiar with LR2. It definitely isn't as user friendly as LR, but I'm willing to learn if it means better quality images. I'm curious, though, how to make some of the adjustments beyond the basics. In Lightroom 2, I'm very fond of the Recovery, Clarity, and Vibrance sliders. Is there anything similar in NX2? If there is, I haven't found it yet.

Well... There are some tricks in NX. I did this picture absolutely in NX 2.1, without plugins:

The clarity is more a HighPass filter than other thing. You can set a new step and under the focus section choose the HighPass and roll down the opacity panel and choose Overlay. I use that feature a lot. The recovery and fill light options are not present in NX. Well, they're but they don't work as good as in Lightroom. For that I suggest using some curve adjustments. You also have some contrast by color and the posibility to set up below opacity if you will blend only the chrominance, Luminance or both. If you choose not to work wioth chrominance, you're chosing a L*a*b* way to edit.
Anyway, with the control points you can do lot of recovery stuff and fill light as well. I didn'tm find a "linear" way to do the same like in LR but in NX. You know, the weird and cool effect of raising the shadows and lowering the highlights.

I'm sure all what it can be done in LR can be done in NX as well, but NX it's a hard to handle program...

Quantum3

Tuna wrote:

I have a question about RAW processing in NX2. When I make changes to a RAW file, if I go to close NX2, it asks me if I'd like to save the changes. I always hit "Yes", but when I go back into NX2 later on, I don't see the changes saved. It goes back to my original version. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong here, but it'd suck to have to redo everything every time I want to make a small change. I've also noticed that it creates massive TIFF files every time with the new changes. It doesn't overwrite the old TIFF files either. It makes a new one each time I save changes. I'm sure this is all intertwined somehow, but I'm not sure how to fix it. Creating so many TIFFs, sometimes upward of 50mb each, will start filling up space pretty quickly I think, so I'd like to get this "problem" fixed now if at all possible.

That's weird. Surely, in the preferences windows you can set up that. Cleaning the cache folder as well.

Here are my preferences, but in Spanish:

[IMG]file:///C:/DOCUME%7E1/UANTUM%7E1/CONFIG%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot.jpg[/IMG]