Magic Wand Tool

canon400d

I am having great difficulty in commencing with the Magic Wand tool. I am wanting to replace a partially blown out sky in a landscape. When I click on the sky I find the marching ants will only do a complete perimeter if the sky is totally blown out and I can carry on. If there is any colouring in the sky I find the marching ants appear all over the place. I have tried using the Shift key and clicking on the outside of the ants but this does no good as the ants just manoeuvre to another position and I just cannot get them all around the border to allow me to continue with the rest of the sequence to change the sky. It can be quite frustrating not being able to get the marching ants in the right place. Please help.
Regards
Bob

jjbong

Check out this thread [thread]116223[/thread]. It contains an excellent tutorial by Pathfinder on how to select a sky (or anything else, for that matter).

canon400d

jjbong wrote:

Check out this thread [thread]116223[/thread]. It contains an excellent tutorial by Pathfinder on how to select a sky (or anything else, for that matter).

Hi John,
I have seen that tutorial and although Pathfinder helped me I still kept having problems. I have since found another sequence which is really easy and very succesful I got it out of this months PhotoPlus magazine. As I say the only problem is starting off with the Magic Wand tool and getting the border of the skyline with the marching ants. I have done and completed a few images with replacement skies and had no problem because the sky was all the same colour and the marching ants went all around the border of the sky. It is only if there are any slight variations in colours in the sky that causes the problem and confuses the marching ants. As I have said I have clicked holding down the shift key on the area that should be included but it does no good it just makes it worse. As I say so frustrating.
Regards
Bob
Regards
Bob

Ric Grupe

canon400d wrote:

Hi John,
I have seen that tutorial and although Pathfinder helped me I still kept having problems. I have since found another sequence which is really easy and very succesful I got it out of this months PhotoPlus magazine. As I say the only problem is starting off with the Magic Wand tool and getting the border of the skyline with the marching ants. I have done and completed a few images with replacement skies and had no problem because the sky was all the same colour and the marching ants went all around the border of the sky. It is only if there are any slight variations in colours in the sky that causes the problem and confuses the marching ants. As I have said I have clicked holding down the shift key on the area that should be included but it does no good it just makes it worse. As I say so frustrating.
Regards
Bob
Regards
Bob

Once you have made your initial selection with the magic wand...you can then select the quick selection tool (stored with the MW) position it INSIDE of the borders of the ants...press shift and the left mouse button and drive those little buggers away! Don't worry if some of the borders over run where you want them. If they do, just position the QST outside of the border and press only the left mouse button and move them back where you want them. Making the size of the tool smaller will give you more fine tuning abilities. Once you have the mask near where you want it...remember you can always press Q and paint to ultra fine tune the borders of the mask. It is really very easy once you get your mind around it.:D

If you really want to do a perfect mask, learn how to use "refine edges" command. There are tutorials online, that's how I learned.

Good luck, Bob.

Here is a video on the masks panel.

pathfinder

Bob, before the advent of CS3 and CS4, the Magic Wand was my primary tool.

But once I learned how to drive it, the Quick Selection in conjunction with the Quick Mask, means that I have not used the Magic Wand hardly at all.

Skies are very easy to select with the Color Select tool ( or the Magic Wand ) with a supplement of Quick Selection tool and Refine Edges, and you are good to go.

Candid Arts

I prefer the Quick Mask Mode (square box with circle in the center at the bottom of the tool palette) and the paint brush/eraser.

Basically, enter Quick Mask Mode, select the opacity (I prefer about 50%, depending on what I'm selecting), select the brush tool (adjust size and hardness), and start painting the area to be selected. If you've gone to far, that's where the eraser comes in. Basically it is putting a red layer over what you want to be selecting, so you'll be painting in the red, and erasing the red accordingly. Once you're done, de-select the Quick Mask Mode tool, the red goes away, and the perimeter is replaced with the marching ants. Done. It's pretty awesome.

Brendan

In my opinion, the easiest way to replace a blown-out sky is with layer masks, not selections. Just add the new sky over the original photo as a separate layer, click the layer mask button, and paint black where you want to erase the top layer. (Or fill with black and paint white where you want it to show.) May be worth a shot.

Of course you can also use a selection and fill with black/white, so you can combine these two methods. I just rarely find making selections terribly useful. My two cents.

—Brendan

pathfinder

Can you demonstrate your masking technique with this image, which was the basis for this thread about replacing backgrounds or skies?

Brendan

pathfinder wrote:

Can you demonstrate your masking technique with this image, which was the basis for this thread about replacing backgrounds or skies?

There's no special technique involved -- just painting with hard or soft-edged brushes as the situation calls for. I like layer masks because they allow a lot of flexibility in blending the two layers, but they don't work so well with examples like yours.

I generally only try to do this kind of image manipulation to simulate a GND filter, which generally means the 'border area' is more of a horizon than a complicated twig. I'm also generally working from two exposures of the same file, not trying to drop in something that wasn't there originally. The original post about replacing a blown out sky in a landscape made me think of this technique, but sorry if my comment is more confusing than helpful.

—Brendan

Ric Grupe

I see your thread explains how to isolate the twig...how 'bout the sky?

On this image I think I would try the Color Range to select a mask of the sky. Maybe a channel mask would be better...but, I don't really understand them yet.

jjbong

Biarien wrote:

In my opinion, the easiest way to replace a blown-out sky is with layer masks, not selections.

From one perspective they're equivalent, in the sense that either one is easily converted into the other. The issue is how you get a good one (of either). And it will be image dependent. I've seen some nice "quick and dirty" methods to isolate skies (from Dan Margulis) - hacking individual channels in various ways. They work nicely when you don't have blue in the image parts you want to remain that border on the sky.

Your approach is entirely manual, and it should work for any image, given enough time. The thing I like about Pathfinder's approach is that it saves a lot of labor by using PS's intelligence and tuning it with some relatively gross knobs. It's impressive what it can with a fairly complex image, such as the one in his post. And if it doesn't do the job completely, you can always fix it manually (in a selection or in a layer mask).

pathfinder

Ric Grupe wrote:

I see your thread explains how to isolate the twig...how 'bout the sky?

On this image I think I would try the Color Range to select a mask of the sky. Maybe a channel mask would be better...but, I don't really understand them yet.

Color Select won't work with the image of the twig, because you have the same reds and brown in the twig that are also in the brick building in the background.


To get the sky,Ric, once you have the twig selected, you can simply invert your selection with Select > Invert. You may then decide to run through Refine Edges again if you need to enlarge your selection by a few pixels, or once you have a rough selection go to Quick Mask and use a soft brush to soften the edges of your mask. You can even enlarge your selection with the Transform command as well, but that is another discussion.

The real issue in compositing is whether you want a selection with a very precise edge down to the pixel level - as done with a Pen tool, or a Polygonal Lasso, or the Quick Selection tool. If you want a selection with a very soft, diffuse edge that fades over 50-100 pixels, it really is hard to beat using Quick Mask and a large soft brush with black ink as Marc teaches.

If your goal is to create a gradient in the sky, that does not reach the trees and detail in the horizon, then a Quick Mask with a soft brush is very fast and easy - less than 30 seconds.... But if you goal is to pick a precise, sharply edged mask for the organic, multi colored twig that I posted above ( again courtesy of rutt ) then it is very tedious to select it with a Magic wand or Magnetic Lasso, or a Pen tool. You will tear your hair out. The Quick Select tool will do it nicely, in just 5 or 10 minutes almost down to the pixel level, by simply clicking areas to add, and clicking with the alt key held down to select areas not desired. And once you have some marching ants you can add or subtract from the selection with any of your other desired selection tools - magnetic lasso, polygonal lasso, or go into Quick Mask and paint on the displayed mask itself.

canon400d

pathfinder wrote:

Color Select won't work with the image of the twig, because you have the same reds and brown in the twig that are also in the brick building in the background.


To get the sky,Ric, once you have the twig selected, you can simply invert your selection with Select > Invert. You may then decide to run through Refine Edges again if you need to enlarge your selection by a few pixels, or once you have a rough selection go to Quick Mask and use a soft brush to soften the edges of your mask. You can even enlarge your selection with the Transform command as well, but that is another discussion.

The real issue in compositing is whether you want a selection with a very precise edge down to the pixel level - as done with a Pen tool, or a Polygonal Lasso, or the Quick Selection tool. If you want a selection with a very soft, diffuse edge that fades over 50-100 pixels, it really is hard to beat using Quick Mask and a large soft brush with black ink as Marc teaches.

If your goal is to create a gradient in the sky, that does not reach the trees and detail in the horizon, then a Quick Mask with a soft brush is very fast and easy - less than 30 seconds.... But if you goal is to pick a precise, sharply edged mask for the organic, multi colored twig that I posted above ( again courtesy of rutt ) then it is very tedious to select it with a Magic wand or Magnetic Lasso, or a Pen tool. You will tear your hair out. The Quick Select tool will do it nicely, in just 5 or 10 minutes almost down to the pixel level, by simply clicking areas to add, and clicking with the alt key held down to select areas not desired. And once you have some marching ants you can add or subtract from the selection with any of your other desired selection tools - magnetic lasso, polygonal lasso, or go into Quick Mask and paint on the displayed mask itself.

Thanks to everyone and you have all given me something to think about. I think I need time to work it all out. I know at the end of the day it is always easy when you know how.
Regards to everyone,
Bob

Ric Grupe

pathfinder wrote:

Color Select won't work with the image of the twig, because you have the same reds and brown in the twig that are also in the brick building in the background.

Thanks for the detailed reply...I actually get what you are saying.:D

I meant using the Color Range for just the sky.

canon400d

Ric Grupe wrote:

Thanks for the detailed reply...I actually get what you are saying.:D

I meant using the Color Range for just the sky.

Thanks again Ric for all your kind help.
Regards
Bob