Team Sports and studio lights- help please?
Penquin
Registered Users Posts: 42 Big grins
I would appreciate some help from someone with some experience with studio lights.
For several years now I have been taking photos of youth sports teams and individuals and making picture day packets. I have only done a team here and there, never a league. I recently scheduled a softball league and will be taking pictures of these players outside if weather permits and inside if it rains. Up until today I have relied on my 580 canon flash. I want to purchase some studio lights and have been looking at the Alien Bees with umbrellas. In the future I want to be able to use the same lights for prom type dances to take photos of couples and groups who are standing in front of a set such as pillars and decorative background.
My question is:
How many lights do I need to purchase and what size?
I also need to learn how to set the lights in relation to the camera and the subject. If someone could point me in the right direction I would much appreciate your help.
I want to purchase the lights as soon as possible so I have time to practice before the league photos.
I use canon 1d mark lll with 17-40 4.0 and 70-200 2.8. second camera is canon 30D. Thanks.
For several years now I have been taking photos of youth sports teams and individuals and making picture day packets. I have only done a team here and there, never a league. I recently scheduled a softball league and will be taking pictures of these players outside if weather permits and inside if it rains. Up until today I have relied on my 580 canon flash. I want to purchase some studio lights and have been looking at the Alien Bees with umbrellas. In the future I want to be able to use the same lights for prom type dances to take photos of couples and groups who are standing in front of a set such as pillars and decorative background.
My question is:
How many lights do I need to purchase and what size?
I also need to learn how to set the lights in relation to the camera and the subject. If someone could point me in the right direction I would much appreciate your help.
I want to purchase the lights as soon as possible so I have time to practice before the league photos.
I use canon 1d mark lll with 17-40 4.0 and 70-200 2.8. second camera is canon 30D. Thanks.
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Comments
Alien Bees are are a good choice....made in Nashville or at least the White Lighniings from Paul Buff are so I just figured he kept it all with the city limits os to speak .....
This book is very informative and used starting at just over $5 ( I paid approx 20 for mine new)
Peter Gowlands' New Glamour Handbook of Glamour Photography ...........the reason I am pointing you to this book is the diagrams he gives for his lighting.......this information is very good for all phases of photography, whether it is team packets, weddings or products, even though it was intended for glamour photogrphy.
Mr. Gowland told me to start with 3 lights and move up from there.....his suggestion was 1 main (key) light and 2 background lights (my studio was in my front room and I needed to change the color of the bg rather than having dozens of bg's I had one almost black that I used colored lights on)......I still use shoot thru umbrellas (now I use Paul Buffs [Alien Bee] brolly boxes)......Mr. Gowland also emphasised keeping all with one brand, model and power out put.......example Alien Bees{brand} 800 (model and output 800watt second).....his reasoning for this especially for the beginner is that if you go on location (a prom) and you set up 2 lights (which for prom pics you can get awa with just a key light) and then during your shoot the strobe to your right dies, if all are the same model and brand all you have to do is grab one out of the carrier and get going.....if you have 3 different brands, models and out put powers then you have to start calculating lighting ratios and that causes undo sress and screwed up photos.
HTH
I will check out these web sites and purchase the book tomorrow. I am leaning towards three alien bees 800 lights with stands. While I am waiting for the lights to arrive I can be learning from the book and websites. Thanks again for your help. Thanks much.
I was hoping for more of your advice.
My question is if I were to purchase profoto lights do I need to purchse the compact 600R or will the compact 300R suffice.
I will be shooting Sports Picture Packets (memory mates), sometimes outside ands somtimes inside, and prom type dances.
I posted above that I was thinking about purchasing Alien Bees and Art thought this was a good choice.
Here is my situation:
I live in a smaller town of about 12,000 and we have a real nice local camera store that people from out of town actually drive to. The next closest camera store is about 2 hours away. I would like to support local business.
This camera store sells Profoto and the owner thinks I should purchse the compact 300R with pocket wizards. I know I can purchase the 600R else where for less money than I will be paying for the 300R locally.
I would like to purcase locally but my cash is limited. If I purchase locally I will already be paying more, and if I decide to upgrade to the 600R against the advise of the local store owner, I will be paying even more.
Please give me your thoughts.
Thanks
In a community of 12,000 I suggest that the volume of work may not require the Profoto line of flashes. The Alien Bee, White Lightning and Flashpoint II flashes are probably sufficient.
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
Ziggy,
I agree with you, the white lightning or Alien Bee will surely do the job. However, because it is a small community and we have a local camera store it complicates things. I know nearly everybody and I know after I purchase these lights I will get alot of work because the community has been hiring from outside the community. Alot of work to me is probably relative, I have a full time job already. When I retire I want to photograph.
I have done enough picture packets locally that I understand I have to have good prices, have to be flexible, and I have to have a good product. (Afterall I am going to see everybody the next day
If I decide to purchase local I just dont know if the Compact 300R is enough power, or do I need the Compact 600R????
I have never had a set of lights.
/.
I do suggest that you will want 3 to 4 monolights for greatest flexibility. In the Profoto line that's a lot of money up front. (I use 2 monolights and supplement with speedlights, but it's more difficult that way and someday I will purchase additional lights.)
For many lighting situations I suspect that the Profoto ComPact 300R (300 ws) is plenty, especially in an indoor controlled situation. Groups could be a little more challenging and in an unknown environment with flo lights or mercury vapor or ... whatever a school might be using, you need to overpower the ambient lighting. Softboxes are also really good at sucking up light so more is usually better than less. (You can generally throttle the light down if needed or even use absorbers to cut output.)
I am not clear whether Profoto uses "True" watt-seconds or "Effective" watt-seconds so I am not sure how they compare in output to the other flashes in question (who generally use the "effective" measure).
I can say that I used a pair of the FlashPoint II 1820A monolights to overpower daylight (mid-afternoon in August, cloudy bright) at about 75% power settings at around 15 feet with 2 white umbrellas in a "wall of light" configuration. Those lights are rated at 900 ws each "true" output and 1800 ws "effective".
Moderator of the Cameras and Accessories forums
Buy as much light as you can (I'm talking Watt Seconds)....or ask him to price match at least a little.....With the ProFoto's I would not go with less tahn the 600's.....if you can offord them, or go with the AB800's if they are less expensive.
even the 2 store owners here in 'wichita have known me for over 30 yrs and they know I buy in NY or Ebay or where the price is good for the product I am seeking.... they welcome me in to their store, not knowing if I am seeking info or if I will spend money.....they also know that if I am looking to buy....if it is not in stock I won't wait for them to make an order next week or month.....I am looking to buy now cause it is needed now.
What i am getting at is if he is true professional he won't let you buying else where offend him, it might make his feeling twinge a liitle but that is normal......similar to the fact that my oldest sister will recommend me to other people but I have yet had her come to me for portraits.....but we butt heads a lot at times.....I do have to do an insurance photo inventory of her household this next week so maybe she is coming around.
Thanks for your comments and thoughts. My concern was the 300R would not be enough power also. As far as price the profoto is about $300 more per light with a stand and umbrella than the AB (cost even more local). Part of my problem is I have been sort of self taught and this store guy is able to provide me a with lot of information, (when he is in a good mood that is). On Monday I will go in and ask him how much for the 600R??
Thanks
Originally I was going to buy 2 300W Elinchroms to save $$. After posting a thread on here and getting some good advice, which was if I was ever planning on taking those strobes onsite, they wouldnt be enough power pending the size of the venue.
So I forked over the $$ and bought 2 of the 600W instead. I love them, sure they are way to much power for my studio, but it means I can shoot them at low power so faster recycling, plus I have used them twice on location now for weddings and the extra power was definitely needed.
Good luck with the purchase.
Cheers
Dave
http://www.daveclee.com
Nikon D3 and a bunch of nikkor gear
that has added up over the years :wink
After reading all of your advice. I wanted to follow up with a thank you. I went ahead and purchased three compact 600R Profoto lights, from the local shop. No regrets. The local guy has helped me since the purchase in figuring it all out. And Art is absolutely right, now I have Dgrin to learn from also. I have to say this adventure is starting to remind me of buying my boat, the equipment needs (or wants) never ends:cry . Ordered my back drops after doing a search for past posts on Dgrin on where to purchse. I am planning on learing how to use the pocket wizards today. A week and a half before I shot the softball league picture packets. I hope it all works out
Thanks again for all of your assistance. I am sure I will be asking for more help. I hope I will have somthing to offer also.