Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 2: Questions...Answers

Candid Arts · May 14, 2009

*Mods...Can you possibly combine the last few threads I've started (All start with LR2: ...) all into this one to create a general discussion thread (Maybe a Sticky?) for all questions LR2 related? [if so, then delete this message and start with the following... Thank you]

So this thread is for all your Lightroom 2 Questions and answers. Anything you got, put it here.

Anyways...now onto my next question. I'll read the text out of the book (Scott Kelby's LR2 for Digital Photographers) and I can not make sense of it or figure out how to do the process. It's in the section on Spot Removal. Here is the text:

"To remove more spots, either click directly over them, or if they're in trickiers locations, move the Spot Removal tool over the spot, click, hold, and drag out your sampler, and when you release the mouse button, the fix is in! I used that trick from the previous tutorial to make sure I didn't miss any spots in my image, and look how many little repair circles you see here (I've really got to get that sensor cleaned!)."

Basically, it seems to me that he used the spot to to select one spot, and then did something (this is where I get lost), and LR2 finds all the other spots in the photo and puts the little Spot Removal tool circle thing over all of them. I can't figure out what exactly to do to automate that process. Nothing I have tried works.

Any ideas? Thank you.

Mike J · May 14, 2009

Unless I'm missing something, there is no way to automate this. You need find and nuke them all.

Thunder Rabbit · May 14, 2009

Howdy.

I don't think there is an automated spot removal function. What he is describing is how to control the sample area. When he refers to trickier locations, he is referring to spots that are near the edge of an object. Say, you are taking spots out of the sky. As you work nearer the horizon, the spot tool may actually sample a part of the image that has the horizon, and instead of sampling the sky , it will sample a part of the horizon, and instead of clear sky you will get a piece of the horizon cloned into the sky. He's saying in this situation, instead of just clicking and hoping Lr samples clear sky, you actually click and drag the sample area away from the horizon, into clear sky, so this doesn't happen.

The spot tool, while very effective, seems a little stupid. So far, I haven't been able to figure out the logic in how Lr selects the sample area after you have clicked on the spot to be removed. It seems random. So, if you have two spots close together, and click on one of them, it is likely that the sample area will contain the other spot, and will simply clone the new spot where the old one was. But this is no big deal. You just click on the sample, and drag it into a section of sky with no spots. And the fix is in.

Also, when working near the horizon, make sure the spot tool is set to clone, not heal. If set to heal, even if the sample is in clear sky, if the spot you selected to remove is too close to the horizon, Lr also samples nearby pixels and will blend the horizon into the correction zone, the spot will be gone, but the horizon will be blended into the clone area. When set to clone, Lr does not sample pixels near the clone area, and will clone only pixels in the sample area without blending them with nearby pixels in the area being repaired.

I used that trick from the previous tutorial to make sure I didn't miss any spots in my image, and look how many little repair circles you see here...

I'm not sure what trick from the previous tutorial is. I'm not sure he is saying that the many repair spots he refers to were done automatically. Just that he did a lot of them. One at a time, using the described technique. But, without knowing what was in the prevous tutorial he is referring to, I can't be sure.

If you think in terms of automation, you've got to realize that Lr has no way of distinguishing between a spot, a small bird flying by, or any other small item that was actually in the scene. Technically, automated spot removal is very problematic. And I don't think Lr can do it. The Lr help files make no mention of automatic spot removal, and a general search for Lr automatic spot removal yields no results.

I'm sure the author knows what he is talking about, but when it comes to explaining himself clearly, maybe not so much. He already put you in the weeds regarding Collections, and this explanation seems just as confusing.

Candid Arts · May 14, 2009

That's the way it seems to me as well. The reason I thought that there might be an automated process that I just wasn't seeing was he went straight from spotting like three or four spots on the bottom section of his demo photo, to he did what he did (the paragraph I previously wrote) and now there were a few more spots circled in the sky. No mention of actually clicking each one individually. I know how to do the click and drag technique to sample from your own determined location, as well as once you've spotted, making the spot circle a larger diameter, I just thought he was talking about something else here. I think his wording in this part was un clear to me because all I've been doing for the past three days is importing files from folders, moving them around, renaming them, keywording them, and reading his book, along with finals in school, and moving into a new apartment. My brain might have been just dead. I'm gonna give the book a break tonight, and continue tomorrow.

Other than the collections thing, which honestly I think he did the way he did because he structures his folders (on his ext. hd, the originals) differently than I do, I was just crossing ideas, from mine to his, and they seems redundent, which they were. Otherwise this book is freaking phenomenal. I cannot believe how much I've learned and I'm only half way through the book. I honestly have no need for PS any more other than stiching pano's together. This is like my new PP and photo managing bible...

Candid Arts · May 30, 2009

Alright, new question...

Is there a way to have LR auto back up what you are currently working on live? Ex: I have my photos on my computer HD, and I'm working on them in LR, as I make edits, it is writing the .xmp file live to the file on my computer, however, I have my little HD in and my big HD plugged it, is there a way to, while making the edits, have it not only write the .xmp file to my computer (the file i'm working off of), but also to the back up files on each (or at least one) of my ext. HD's?

If not, this would be a TOTALLY SLICK feature to put in the next update...

Candid Arts · June 28, 2009

Anyone?

Candid Arts · November 26, 2009

Anybody know if there is a way to auto apply a color label upon import?

Thunder Rabbit · November 26, 2009

Howdy.

Bottom left of Import Photos dialog box is there is the Metadata field. Select "Edit Presets". Dialog box opens." "Label" option is near top. Type in your color.

Save as new preset or edit an old one.

CatOne · November 26, 2009

Candid Arts wrote:

Alright, new question...

Is there a way to have LR auto back up what you are currently working on live? Ex: I have my photos on my computer HD, and I'm working on them in LR, as I make edits, it is writing the .xmp file live to the file on my computer, however, I have my little HD in and my big HD plugged it, is there a way to, while making the edits, have it not only write the .xmp file to my computer (the file i'm working off of), but also to the back up files on each (or at least one) of my ext. HD's?

If not, this would be a TOTALLY SLICK feature to put in the next update...

I disagree. If it's backing it up live, it's going to slow things down. These are just edits; they're not THAT hard to replicate if you lose power or something: You'd lose the amount of time you spent on ONE photo (assuming you had "automatically write changes to XMP files" turned on). Not really worth it for that, IMO, as again the changes in LR do not generally take THAT much time to replicate if you need to do it again once every few years when you lose power (get a UPS or use a laptop ;-) or your computer blows up.

Candid Arts · November 26, 2009

Thunder Rabbit wrote:

Howdy.

Bottom left of Import Photos dialog box is there is the Metadata field. Select "Edit Presets". Dialog box opens." "Label" option is near top. Type in your color.

Save as new preset or edit an old one.

Perfect. Thank you.

Candid Arts · December 10, 2009

Has anyone noticed that a photo looks different in the Develop Module from the Library Module in Loupe View?

Anyone know why this is?

I used to have my .CR2 files, edit them, then make a jpeg for upload. Since I found the LR plugin for SM, I went back through and re-edited all my .CR2's and deleted the JPEGs to save space. There have been a few photos though that I just could not get to look right (the same-ish). I was just working on one, and couldn't get it to look right, however got it to a point where I really liked it, maybe even better (in the Develop Module). I was scanning through my photos in the Loupe View and came across these two. They almost looked identical. I was like WTF?, switched to Develop and they looked different again. Back to Loupe and they looked the same.

Any ideas on why LR does this? Which version is correct?

Thanks for the help.

Miguel Delinquento · December 10, 2009

In Library view you are only seeing the embedded jpeg. In Develop view, you are seeing LR's interpretation of the RAW data, or the larger jpeg file if you are not processing a RAW file.

The Develop view, especially at 100%, will be the most accurate representation of the image that reflects your post-processing choices.

I just use the Library view to cull and sort images into different collections, and to input metadata.

M

Candid Arts wrote:

Has anyone noticed that a photo looks different in the Develop Module from the Library Module in Loupe View?

Anyone know why this is?

I used to have my .CR2 files, edit them, then make a jpeg for upload. Since I found the LR plugin for SM, I went back through and re-edited all my .CR2's and deleted the JPEGs to save space. There have been a few photos though that I just could not get to look right (the same-ish). I was just working on one, and couldn't get it to look right, however got it to a point where I really liked it, maybe even better (in the Develop Module). I was scanning through my photos in the Loupe View and came across these two. They almost looked identical. I was like WTF?, switched to Develop and they looked different again. Back to Loupe and they looked the same.

Any ideas on why LR does this? Which version is correct?

Thanks for the help.

Candid Arts · December 10, 2009

Perfect. Thank you.

colourbox · December 10, 2009

Miguel Delinquento wrote:

In Library view you are only seeing the embedded jpeg.

More precisely, you're seeing the last updated preview, as it changes after you do some Develop edits. It doesn't stay as the original embedded JPEG for very long, especially if any preset is applied on import, even the default.

If you switch straight from Develop to Library, Lightroom might not have updated the Library large preview yet from your last round of Develop changes and I think that is why it can be different. Forcing a regeneration of the preview should make them the same.

Candid Arts · December 12, 2009

Ok. So I have came across this several times now (cleaning out my LR photos). I have one picture, two files (.CR2 and JPG). On my hard drive, it's obviously two separate files. However in LR it is only showing one file. In the file name it says name-1 with the extension of CR2 + JPEG. How can I separate those two files in LR w/o removing them from LR and re importing them? How do they even get combined like this?

Thanks.

Miguel Delinquento · December 13, 2009

Preferences>Import>checkbox Treat JPEG files next to raw files as separate photos.

M

Candid Arts wrote:

Ok. So I have came across this several times now (cleaning out my LR photos). I have one picture, two files (.CR2 and JPG). On my hard drive, it's obviously two separate files. However in LR it is only showing one file. In the file name it says name-1 with the extension of CR2 + JPEG. How can I separate those two files in LR w/o removing them from LR and re importing them? How do they even get combined like this?

Thanks.

Candid Arts · December 13, 2009

Miguel Delinquento wrote:

Preferences>Import>checkbox Treat JPEG files next to raw files as separate photos.

M

I've already got that checked. That is for import only though correct?

Once the files are already in LR and combined into one thumbnail, how can I separate them at that point?

BradfordBenn · December 13, 2009

Different Keywords on virtual copies?
Howdy-

So I did some browsing and attempting, and I could not figure out how to do the following. I want to take the images that are straight out of camera and put the keyword on them of SOOC and then on the virtual copies do the touch ups and cropping, and remove the SOOC. Is that possible?

Thanks

Miguel Delinquento · December 13, 2009

Sure,
File>Auto Import>Auto Import Settings>Information box>Keywords.

RE: "remove the SOOC" I don't understand what you are trying to achieve. Are you working on RAW images? If you are trying to undo jpeg renderings that the camera imparted without a corresponding RAW file (as in RAW+jpeg), well, you cannot. Jpeg has lots of data doping baked in.
I use virtual copies to work on alternate versions and experiments.
Lightroom is non-destructive, so you can always go back in history. You can also use the excellent Snapshot function to capture an image of a certain rendering that you may want to replicate or return to from another processing approach.

M

BradfordBenn wrote:

Howdy-

So I did some browsing and attempting, and I could not figure out how to do the following. I want to take the images that are straight out of camera and put the keyword on them of SOOC and then on the virtual copies do the touch ups and cropping, and remove the SOOC. Is that possible?

Thanks

BradfordBenn · December 14, 2009

You are right, I should better explain what I am trying to do. I want to have the original contain the keyword SOOC as well as all the other ones I assign, then the virtual copies to not have SOOC. So that I can A/B the SOOC and processed images.

Miguel Delinquento · December 14, 2009

Thanks for the background.

I suggest you review every aspect of your workflow and determine what the objective of each step is. And then match the best capability of LR to the task.

With what you just outlined, I think you'd be creating too much hassle for yourself.

I'd assign the imported image whatever functional keywords you want and assume that they are all SOOC. Let keywords be keywords.

Designating the image as SOOC is a different task. You can append the title with SOOC and make it a custom name routine. Or just assume everything starts SOOC.

It is easy to A/B without creating virtual copies by taking snapshots along the way. Do the A/B screen and then click on one of the snapshots--it will become B or C or D to the import (your SOOC) being A.
You can assign descriptive or version titles to the snapshots. Easier than dealing with file name limitations with virtual copies.

LR's virtual copy capability is wonderful, but the snapshot is a usability improvement.

M

BradfordBenn wrote:

You are right, I should better explain what I am trying to do. I want to have the original contain the keyword SOOC as well as all the other ones I assign, then the virtual copies to not have SOOC. So that I can A/B the SOOC and processed images.

BradfordBenn · December 15, 2009

I am wanting that when I put the images up on Smugmug, if they are Straight Out of Camera that is in the keyword. Then if I process and replace them that that not be there anymore. I think I might be trying to automate something too much.

Miguel Delinquento · December 15, 2009

I create my Smugmug titles by customizing LR to automatically create SM captions from the LR Caption field text on export. You can do the same by substituting keyword text, or having a default set that assumes it is SOOC from the start. This allows virtual copies to still be worked and titled.

Out of curiosity, why does it matter if an image is labeled SOOC or not? You should be able to ascertain that from looking at your LR library or history.

M

BradfordBenn wrote:

I am wanting that when I put the images up on Smugmug, if they are Straight Out of Camera that is in the keyword. Then if I process and replace them that that not be there anymore. I think I might be trying to automate something too much.

BradfordBenn · December 16, 2009

Part of it is just to have an easy way to have to find all my SOOC and those that I have retouched, as well as also having the ability to have the same image name in a gallery side by side and know which one is which. I might be tilting at windmills.

Part of it is also to keep track in LR using the metadata to find the ones that I need to review and possibly touch up. I could use flags or stars or colors but was thinking this would be a good way to do both at the same time.

Candid Arts · December 17, 2009

BradfordBenn wrote:

Part of it is just to have an easy way to have to find all my SOOC and those that I have retouched, as well as also having the ability to have the same image name in a gallery side by side and know which one is which. I might be tilting at windmills.

Part of it is also to keep track in LR using the metadata to find the ones that I need to review and possibly touch up. I could use flags or stars or colors but was thinking this would be a good way to do both at the same time.

This is how I do what I think you're trying to do.

Upon import, I have it apply a color label (blue in my case). This way I always know that if a picture is labeled blue, it is SOOC and I haven't edited yet, or have started to edit it but not finished. Once I'm done with a photo, I label it green (as it GO) and that means it's ready to be uploaded. At this point once I'm done with that entire shoot, I'll re-name all the photos in a numerical order (1, 2, ...) and put them in the correct storage location. This way, if I forget to upload, or edit photos, all I have to do is select all photos, and sort by a certain color. If I click blue and there are photos labeled blue, then they show up. I know to edit them and get them online. I use the number shortcuts to label (6, 7, 8, 9), so it only takes one keystroke to label a photo.

Hope that helps...

Candid Arts · December 17, 2009

Question: and this kind of relates to my previous post...

When a photo is ready to be uploaded to SM, I label it green. Once It's done uploading, I take the color label away.

Is there a way to, upon export, as the photo is finished uploading, LR automatically takes away the green color label and puts it back to the default...gray?

This way, if I select 40 photos to upload, and there is an error or something during the upload, the ones that were finished uploading will not be green anymore, and the ones that haven't finished are still green?

Thanks for the help anyone.

colourbox · December 17, 2009

BradfordBenn wrote:

I want to take the images that are straight out of camera and put the keyword on them of SOOC and then on the virtual copies do the touch ups and cropping, and remove the SOOC. Is that possible?

Would this vastly simpler way work for you?

1) Make a Smart Collection
2) Set criteria to match the following rule:
"Has Adjustments" is "false" (or true)
3) Add additional rules to filter further, as needed.

If this works for you, you would not need to do any keywording, labeling, or anything. You would be using Lightroom's own adjustment tracking to show any images adjusted or SOOC. Images would automatically fall out of the SOOC list, or into the developed list, as soon as you alter them.

BradfordBenn · December 17, 2009

colourbox wrote:

Would this vastly simpler way work for you?

1) Make a Smart Collection
2) Set criteria to match the following rule:
"Has Adjustments" is "false" (or true)
3) Add additional rules to filter further, as needed.

If this works for you, you would not need to do any keywording, labeling, or anything. You would be using Lightroom's own adjustment tracking to show any images adjusted or SOOC. Images would automatically fall out of the SOOC list, or into the developed list, as soon as you alter them.

I think that would do it, combined with the keyword painter. Thanks. I realize that this is a weird thing, but one of the things I am trying to do is be able to compare SOOC and processed to make sure I didn't make it worse.

Thanks

colourbox · December 17, 2009

BradfordBenn wrote:

I think that would do it, combined with the keyword painter. Thanks. I realize that this is a weird thing, but one of the things I am trying to do is be able to compare SOOC and processed to make sure I didn't make it worse.

If that's the purpose, then have you used the Before/After feature? There are buttons and menu commands for it, but all I use is the shortcut, which is the backslash key when in Develop. As long as the Before state is set to the "Import" history state (which it is for all images by default), going to Before will show you SOOC. It's just a habit now to hit backslash when I want to see if I'm making it worse, which happens fairly often...

You can either tap or hold backslash. If you tap, it stays in Before view when you release. If you hold, it snaps back to After when you release.

Cindy · December 18, 2009

Bridge user w/ Lightroom ?'s
With everyone raving over lightroom & my desperate need to speed up workflow...

How does lightroom compare to adobe bridge?
Will lightroom recognise the keywords etc I've applied in bridge?
Will I be able to upload to smugmug from the beta 3 lightroom version?

My Major Concern:

My workflow for several years has been Nikon Capture to Photoshop Bridge &/or Photoshop. Back then Adobe did not see Nikon's custom camera settings (white balance, etc.) so that's why I used Nikon capture to process raw files. Am I correct in understanding that Nikon released the required info so that Adobe Lightroom, Camera Raw, etc can now see Nikon's custom raw camera settings? I see on the Adobe site that they support Nikon camera but there's some *conflicting info it seems. I've sadly not stayed up to date on this but If it's true that they do truly support now... yippie!

Thanks tons in advance!

colourbox · December 18, 2009

Cindy wrote:

How does lightroom compare to adobe bridge?

Bridge is mostly a window full of files. To edit raw, you have to open Camera Raw. To print, you have to open Photoshop. In Lightroom, that's all included in one program with no switching apps and almost no dialog boxes. Which means, while you can use Bridge to do almost everything you can do in Lightroom, you have to jump through a lot more hoops because of the separate programs being juggled constantly. You might be able to process more images faster with Lightroom, especially if you learn the single-key shortcuts.

In favor of Bridge, it comes with apps other than Photoshop, so it can organize video, Flash files, fonts, etc. Even though cameras can shoot video and record audio, Lightroom only deals with photos. Just photos. Only RGB. No Lab, no CMYK, no Illustrator files...Bridge does those.

Lightroom uses a database, so you can do things like keep track of images on disks that are not connected.

Cindy wrote:

Will lightroom recognise the keywords etc I've applied in bridge?

Yes, for raws if the photos are stored as DNG or you used Bridge to export XMP sidecar files, Lightroom will pick up all that info.

Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 2: Questions...Answers

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