Removing complex reflections when shooting through glass

michswiss

First time coming to Finishing School and looking for some help. Here is my recent entry into DSS #28. I've included the B&W conversion as well as the colour master with only the cropping, one area of cloning and straightening left. Everything else is SooC.

My question is how best to get rid of the intersecting reflection cutting across the arm of the woman in the foreground. I don't want to remove the remainder of the reflections as it's part of the shot. But the comments in the submissions gallery indicated that particular reflection was distracting. I think I agree.

I'll do the occasional dodge & burn and a little cloning or repair. I use Aperture for most things and have Photoshop Elements 4.0 that I've toyed with. I'm interested in:

1) Techniques to reduce the distraction of the reflection it with the tools I have
2) Better tools to get the job done (I could be convinced to get CS4, but I'm not an artist!)
3) Wholesale improvements to the shot including the PP to B&W

Help me learn.

RalphAdam

michswiss wrote:

First time coming to Finishing School and looking for some help. Here is my recent entry into DSS #28. I've included the B&W conversion as well as the colour master with only the cropping, one area of cloning and straightening left. Everything else is SooC.

My question is how best to get rid of the intersecting reflection cutting across the arm of the woman in the foreground. I don't want to remove the remainder of the reflections as it's part of the shot. But the comments in the submissions gallery indicated that particular reflection was distracting. I think I agree.

I'll do the occasional dodge & burn and a little cloning or repair. I use Aperture for most things and have Photoshop Elements 4.0 that I've toyed with. I'm interested in:

1) Techniques to reduce the distraction of the reflection it with the tools I have
2) Better tools to get the job done (I could be convinced to get CS4, but I'm not an artist!)
3) Wholesale improvements to the shot including the PP to B&W

Help me learn.

A common mistake that I made in the beginning of my learning curve (I use PS CS4, and have been using PS since CS), is that I tried to deal with reflections in the image as I would in life--darkening the light. I learned, after some experimentation, that reflections should be dealt with as are any extraneous elements in an image: cloning them out. Yes, it requires a bit of work, but if you zoom in and use a small brush and, perhaps, edge selections created with the lasso or pen tool to prevent bleed-over, the reflections will be gone! That said, it may mean that you will need PS--I have no familiarity with Elements or any other image manipulation program.

BinaryFx

As a professional retoucher, my advice to all photographers who wish to work magic in post processing is to get the shot right in-camera first! Almost anything is possible in Photoshop given the time/budget/operator skill and knowledge.

Perhaps easier said than done, but there it is...

I will get back with advice on the image if there is a simple fix (I use the full version, not Elements).


Sincerely,

Stephen Marsh

http://members.ozemail.com.au/~binaryfx/
http://prepression.blogspot.com/

Wil Davis

BinaryFx wrote:

…snip
get the shot right in-camera first! Almost anything is possible in Photoshop given the time/budget/operator skill and knowledge
snip…

Amen to that!

As a professional sound engineer/recordist I can't tell you the number of times I hear "…oh, we'll just fix it later 'in the mix'…"

Yup, dead right! It can be done, but often only at great expense and effort, and don't forget you can polish a turd, but you still end up with a turd…

- Wil

michswiss

BinaryFx wrote:

As a professional retoucher, my advice to all photographers who wish to work magic in post processing is to get the shot right in-camera first! Almost anything is possible in Photoshop given the time/budget/operator skill and knowledge.

Perhaps easier said than done, but there it is...

I will get back with advice on the image if there is a simple fix (I use the full version, not Elements).

Thanks Stephen. I'm a strong believer in getting it right in the camera as well. Basically everything I do is close to SooC. But sometimes there aren't many options if you want the shot. Given time and patience, I'm pretty sure I could do a Clone-job, but just looking at the way that one reflection spans multiple textures, colours and light, it looks intimidating.

Wil Davis wrote:

Amen to that!

As a professional sound engineer/recordist I can't tell you the number of times I hear "…oh, we'll just fix it later 'in the mix'…"

Yup, dead right! It can be done, but often only at great expense and effort, and don't forget you can polish a turd, but you still end up with a turd…

- Wil

Are you calling my image a turd!

I've done a fair amount of live and recorded audio work as a sound engineer in an earlier life, including restoration work on old recordings. It is painstaking!

I guess at the end of the day, I'd like to know if there are some "tricks" that can be used to make the clean up process easier. Thanks again!

pathfinder

Shoot this shot with a polarizing filter, perhaps?

Wil Davis

michswiss wrote:

snip…
Are you calling my image a turd!

…snip

Of course not!

…and just to prove it, here's what 10 mins of polishing will do:

michswiss

pathfinder wrote:

Shoot this shot with a polarizing filter, perhaps?

I want / wanted the reflections in the rest of the image, just not the one in question. But, I really should add a polarizing filter to my collection. I've already got the Coker set-up.

michswiss

Wil Davis wrote:

Of course not!

…and just to prove it, here's what 10 mins of polishing will do:

IMHO, that makes a huge difference in the shot. Really opens up the center area and creates a better connection with the subjects. I also like how you saw the related reflections slightly left and above heading to the bulb. I can appreciate Divamum's comment in the Challenge gallery more now.

Was this 10 minutes with a cloning or repair brush, or something fancier? I'll give the same thing a go this weekend. I think I'm beginning to prefer the color version as well. Thanks.

BinaryFx

michswiss wrote:

Thanks Stephen. I'm a strong believer in getting it right in the camera as well. Basically everything I do is close to SooC. But sometimes there aren't many options if you want the shot. Given time and patience, I'm pretty sure I could do a Clone-job, but just looking at the way that one reflection spans multiple textures, colours and light, it looks intimidating.

I did not read the OP correctly, I thought the request was for more extensive retouching. Just the forearm is not a big or hard job. The basic approach in Photoshop would be to use the clone tool or the healing tools on a new blank layer. Better results would be obtained from combining the use of both clone and healing tools. Another way is to make selections from "good" areas and copy the selection to a new layer, then move the layer over the affected areas, layer mask, clone, heal etc. The woman's head and shoulder would be more of a challenge.


Stephen Marsh

http://members.ozemail.com.au/~binaryfx/
http://prepression.blogspot.com/

Wil Davis

BinaryFx wrote:

snip…
Just the forearm is not a big or hard job.
…snip

Well, you know how it is, just ask anyone who knows me; I always go for the easy shots… …'specially when I'm not getting paid my normal rate :cry

…I just takes me little rag, and polish, polish, polish away…

- Wil