#31 C & C please

kds1 · August 15, 2009

Hi all,

I am still thinking and thinking of what I could do that would be creative for this challenge. Have thought of a few things, but they are probably beyond my execution.

In the meantime, I did shoot this this morning. It is not nearly as creative as I'd like to do for the challenge, but in case I don't come up with anything else, I'd really like c & c on these.

First one, original one, which I thought the whites were too yellow and it also has some black splotches on the petals:

So I whitened up the whites, made it a bit sharper and cleaned up the obvious blotches, as well as changed the light levels a bit:

And then I suddenly thought that the 'heart' of the photo may be in a closer crop, and then thought it also needed straightening to make the 'open' and the 'closed' more aligned:

Thoughts? Do you like the uncropped better than the cropped? I kind of miss the petals on the left in the cropped version, although I do think it makes the point better in the cropped one.

How could I improve on whichever one you like the best?

Thanks!

Kara

Halite · August 15, 2009

Definitely prefer the cropped version, because it gets the graphic quality of the flower shapes right in your face and puts less emphasis on the saggy quality of the open blossom. I really like the high key boldness of this image. And it definitely plays nicely with the theme concept. Is it a winner? Who knows, but you have a solid image to enter while you explore other concepts before the deadline.

whiterice · August 15, 2009

Halite wrote:

Definitely prefer the cropped version, because it gets the graphic quality of the flower shapes right in your face and puts less emphasis on the saggy quality of the open blossom. I really like the high key boldness of this image. And it definitely plays nicely with the theme concept. Is it a winner? Who knows, but you have a solid image to enter while you explore other concepts before the deadline.

I much prefer the cropped version. My only other thought, IMO the cropped version is oversharpened.

MrMagoo · August 15, 2009

Spooky
The third version is in my opinion wonderfully surreal/spooky with an other world quality. This could be a great challenge.

kds1 wrote:

Hi all,

I am still thinking and thinking of what I could do that would be creative for this challenge. Have thought of a few things, but they are probably beyond my execution.

In the meantime, I did shoot this this morning. It is not nearly as creative as I'd like to do for the challenge, but in case I don't come up with anything else, I'd really like c & c on these.

First one, original one, which I thought the whites were too yellow and it also has some black splotches on the petals:

So I whitened up the whites, made it a bit sharper and cleaned up the obvious blotches, as well as changed the light levels a bit:

And then I suddenly thought that the 'heart' of the photo may be in a closer crop, and then thought it also needed straightening to make the 'open' and the 'closed' more aligned:

Thoughts? Do you like the uncropped better than the cropped? I kind of miss the petals on the left in the cropped version, although I do think it makes the point better in the cropped one.

How could I improve on whichever one you like the best?

Thanks!

Kara

kds1 · August 15, 2009

Thanks for the comments, everyone! Whiterice, I completely agree - it is oversharpened. I went back to the drawing board and played with the cropped version based on everyone's comments. so here is Version 4:

Version 4:

Further c & c MUCH appreciated and welcomed.

Thanks!

Kara

whiterice · August 15, 2009

I think you've done a great job Kara.

I'll sit back now and see what others have to say. :lurk

The Curious Camel · August 15, 2009

Ok, I have to be different.

I like the crop you did but I think the whites look to white especially towards the edge of the petal.
What about somewhere in between. Strictly my opinion and you know how that goes. I really liked
when I seen it earlier but now you give me choices. I hope helped.

Peace, gail

Katmitchell · August 15, 2009

Hi Kara,

I love high key lighting, especially on portraits....

This is a great shot, and I love your take on the open closed theme..

However, I do agree with Gail... Because the tips of the petals are white themselves, they do tend to bleed on the very top petals.. and the contrast of the pink upper left bleeds some too.. You nailed the highlights / shadows and exposure perfectly on the lower petals...

Do you still have this flower? Have you considered using a colored background to set-off the flower? Perhaps a nice blue? The white background is great too and works, if you can adjust your lighting to give you the effect you achieved on the lower petals.. Did you diffuse your light? That may help you to strike a balance with the shadows..

Would love to hear your other ideas too..

Kat

DsrtVW · August 16, 2009

Very good on the theme, I like the tighter crop too. Nice on sharpness and exposure

kds1 · August 16, 2009

Kat and Gail,

I see what you are saying on the lighting. I keep going back and forth on it. I like the high key lighting on lots of stuff, but I see your point. I shot this on a white table on my front porch with natural light. I think I would have to find another suitable blossom and do something else (not sure what) while shooting it to get the light the same on the top and bottom of the blossom. Somehow make a colored background as kat said maybe? Rig up some sort of light diffuser (although I'd have no idea where to even start)? not sure.

If I attempted to change the lighting in processing on this shot that already exists, perhaps I could hand select areas to tone down at the top?

Hmmmm. . .. not sure how to proceed . . . let me think on this over coffee (always helps - as do your thoughts)!

Kara

The Curious Camel · August 16, 2009

kds1 wrote:

Kat and Gail,

I see what you are saying on the lighting. I keep going back and forth on it. I like the high key lighting on lots of stuff, but I see your point. I shot this on a white table on my front porch with natural light. I think I would have to find another suitable blossom and do something else (not sure what) while shooting it to get the light the same on the top and bottom of the blossom. Somehow make a colored background as kat said maybe? Rig up some sort of light diffuser (although I'd have no idea where to even start)? not sure.

If I attempted to change the lighting in processing on this shot that already exists, perhaps I could hand select areas to tone down at the top?
Hmmmm. . .. not sure how to proceed . . . let me think on this over coffee (always helps - as do your thoughts)!

Kara

Hand selecting the area I think that's a good place to start but make sure you do it on a seperate layer. . You could even try adjusting it with curves.

Hope that helps, can't wait to see what you do.

kds1 · August 16, 2009

The Curious Camel wrote:

Hand selecting the area I think that's a good place to start but make sure you do it on a seperate layer. . You could even try adjusting it with curves.

Gail, I don't even know how to manipulate layers yet. :cry It's killing me and I need to do some online tutorials or something for my software. I've tried just messing with it a few times to see if I can just figure it out as I go along, but noooooooo . . ..

The Curious Camel · August 16, 2009

kds1 wrote:

Gail, I don't even know how to manipulate layers yet. :cry It's killing me and I need to do some online tutorials or something for my software. I've tried just messing with it a few times to see if I can just figure it out as I go along, but noooooooo . . ..

I struggle to learn all that stuff to.

Down on the right hand side where you see your image that you have, just pull that down to the icon left of the trash can and that will give you a new layer to work with. After you've done a few adjustments you can click on and off with the little eye on and see what a difference your work made.
I hope I haven't confused you.

If you need a picture of what I am referring to just give me a message.

peace, g

kds1 · August 16, 2009

The Curious Camel wrote:

I struggle to learn all that stuff to.

Down on the right hand side where you see your image that you have, just pull that down to the icon left of the trash can and that will give you a new layer to work with. After you've done a few adjustments you can click on and off with the little eye on and see what a difference your work made.
I hope I haven't confused you.

If you need a picture of what I am referring to just give me a message.

peace, g

Gail - I use Corel Paint Shop Pro Photo X2 and not all things in it are the same as in ps. But I think what you are talking about is the same, or very similar. I can get the separate layer and I can switch back and forth between them, but I get stuck on how to blend layers. Say, if you have an image of one thing on one layer and an image of another thing on another layer, I can't figure out how to drag one image on top of the other so that it looks like one image with two things on it. Can't seem to combine the layers or something.

Now who's confusing who?!?

The Curious Camel · August 16, 2009

kds1 wrote:

Gail - I use Corel Paint Shop Pro Photo X2 and not all things in it are the same as in ps. But I think what you are talking about is the same, or very similar. I can get the separate layer and I can switch back and forth between them, but I get stuck on how to blend layers. Say, if you have an image of one thing on one layer and an image of another thing on another layer, I can't figure out how to drag one image on top of the other so that it looks like one image with two things on it. Can't seem to combine the layers or something.

Now who's confusing who?!?

lol

In photoshop your layer is your new layer you can actually save the image with both being visible just make sure you are have it turned on. Or you can flatten just before you save it. I usually make a PSD file first but you don't have to that's just me. In ps to flatten you go under layer so you might have something similar. Hopefully someone that is familiar with your Corell Painter will chime in and let us know if there is and if I am steering you in the right direction. Hope that helps.

kds1 · August 16, 2009

The Curious Camel wrote:

lol

Hope that helps.

YES! I just need to find the time to really get into this and figure it out. Thanks so much for your help! On my 'discouraged' days, I keep telling myself I'm not doing too badly for not knowing my a*& from a hole in the ground, photographically/software-ically speaking!

The Curious Camel · August 16, 2009

kds1 wrote:

YES! I just need to find the time to really get into this and figure it out. Thanks so much for your help! On my 'discouraged' days, I keep telling myself I'm not doing too badly for not knowing my a*& from a hole in the ground, photographically/software-ically speaking!

, I feel the same way about me to. Just baby steps or on a need to know basis it seems.

Glad it helped.

g

Katmitchell · August 16, 2009

Oh Boy,

You guys really started rolling .. lol

rofl

Kara,

I am surprised you said only window light here.. It is either a huge window or the settings on your camera or you really worked it up in Corel to achieve the high key effect? Usually high key work takes added light..

Did you also use your flash?

As far as the diffuser goes, I know this sounds funny, but a while back when I was without one, Mark suggested using fabric softener sheets.. Now don't laugh...

it works.. take about 3 of them and wash them under hot water with dish soap really well. Then dry them out and walla, you have diffusion. I just layered them on top of each other and then used a rubber band to attach them to the onboard flash in a fairly loose fashion and you can add more as you need them for a stronger effect.. Here is a shot I did using this method for example..

http://katmitchell.smugmug.com/gallery/8688766_G78UF#571418181_usdaX

notice that it kept the light from smacking the gun too hard and creating a glare or hot spots on the bullets.. The diffusion allowed the light to wrap around the metal and bullets and illuminate it evenly. It does work..

Also, keep in mind that your photo is not bad at all, and is perfectly fine to enter.. We are just being critical in order to help you learn and improve. So don't be too hard on yourself or get too stressed out over it..
Just shoot and reshoot and practice and have fun with it, but shoot for perfection as time allows..

I only use CS3 PS.. However, I have owned corel a while back..

Here is a tutorial that will help you to learn layers..

hope this helps..

Kat

Tutorial on layers and masking and blend modes..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VHq6efGrwmE

whiterice · August 16, 2009

Hi Kara -

I've taken a look at your entry again. I agree with Kat - don't stress too much - realize that everyone here nitpicks to help you learn. I don't know that a reshoot is necessary, but if you have a chance it would be a good learning experience. If it were me, I think I'd stick with this shot. I love the high-key look.

My only other suggestion, and take it for what it's worth because I'm not on a calibrated monitor, I think that your image is slightly too blue - specifically on the leaf area. The green is just not yellow enough IMO.

kds1 · August 17, 2009

Hi Kat and Christopher,

I don't mind the 'nitpicks' at all. I LIKE to know these things, so that I can consider them. Whether or not I agree with them or whether or not I will have the time to implement if I do agree with them, well, that's another story!

But being/feeling so new to all of this, I really like hearing the nitpicks. I find it much more helpful than blanket compliments.

Love the idea on the dryer sheets as diffusers for my on-board flash. I didn't use flash for this shot - I took it on my front porch in mid-day, so lots of light there. You can see from my orig. photo the amount of light before I bumped it up in Corel.

Kat's link on layers tutorial is the kind of stuff I really need. Corel has tutorials and online training, too, but the more the better. I seem to be having difficulty with the layers stuff. Too, it has to do with time. Time for photo learning gets pushed to the backburner out of necessity sometimes, so I'll watch a tutorial, think I understand it and then several weeks later when I have time to attempt it, I've lost it. So I never quite get there.

Kat your link to your diffuser lighting shot is ...ummmm. ... a little scary.

But a nice 'shot'!

About the blue v yellow and calibrated monitor, Christopher, I have a calibrated monitor and the shot doesn't look too blue to my eye. On the first image I posted, the petals look waaaaay too yellow to me, but they look alright to me (as does the green) on the last one I posted. Now is my calibrated monitor correct? Am I calibrating correctly?

And lastly, not sure if I will even use this photo as an entry in Open/Closed since I had really hoped to find something more interesting and less trite as a subject. But who know? I may not find anything else.

And whether or not I use this one for this challenge, I find it invaluable to have the eyes of so many of you on it and have your input, insight, thoughts, comments, suggestions. It really helps me think about and see my images more clearly.

So THANK YOU, all!

travelways · August 17, 2009

Hi Kara,

I like your closer crop with Gail comments on adjusting it.

However, if it's about "OPEN" I'm wondering what's in the middle of the flower (s)
- I would try to lighten up that middle a little, to let some details come through...

kds1 · August 18, 2009

Sigh. I went ahead and entered this with the changes suggested. but now I pretty much don't like it. Is this normal? After angsting over it and getting suggestions, input, changing some stuff, trying to do things that I am not sure how to do yet, fussing over it - I don't like the image much. Especially when loading it next to the other entries. I know this is how we learn, but yuck.

I now feel like this

: about this image, although I kind of liked it when I first did it.

Again, is this normal????

sniff.

Kara

whiterice · August 18, 2009

kds1 wrote:

Sigh. I went ahead and entered this with the changes suggested. but now I pretty much don't like it. Is this normal? After angsting over it and getting suggestions, input, changing some stuff, trying to do things that I am not sure how to do yet, fussing over it - I don't like the image much. Especially when loading it next to the other entries. I know this is how we learn, but yuck.

I now feel like this : about this image, although I kind of liked it when I first did it.

Again, is this normal????

sniff.

Kara

Yes, this is very normal...one of the first signs of Dgrin addiction!

You will sometimes very quickly begin to hate an image after working on it so much - this is normal, for me anyway. I usually find this happens though when I work on an image that I'm not 100% certain of to begin with. So I am trying to strive to avoid massive pp work.

Also, the learning curve is so so so steep. You have to just focus on a few things at a time. Otherwise, you'll quickly go insane!!!

It's all about learning. If you've got time.....go and take some more pics...not necessarily for the challenge, but for experience.

Remind yourself - this is supposed to be FUN!!!

kds1 · August 18, 2009

whiterice wrote:

Remind yourself - this is supposed to be FUN!!!

! I know! But I want to be GOOD at it like you guyses!

And now that school is back in, not much time to shoot or do any other photography stuff. I had 2 weeks off at the beginning of the summer and a few days off last week that I really enjoyed spending time shooting and processing. It was amazing how much better I got just in those few weeks when I could do it pretty much all day! It was awesome fun, too.

And hey - thanks for the reminder and words of wisdom. Needed that.

DsrtVW · August 19, 2009

Good to see some else uses Corel I mostly use Nikon Capture NX2 for editing, I have used Corel Photo Paint but not enough to be proficient. Mostly use Corel Draw X3 for graphics. They share a lot of features but just enough to be different from Photo Shop.

Katmitchell · August 19, 2009

kds1 wrote:

Sigh. I went ahead and entered this with the changes suggested. but now I pretty much don't like it. Is this normal? After angsting over it and getting suggestions, input, changing some stuff, trying to do things that I am not sure how to do yet, fussing over it - I don't like the image much. Especially when loading it next to the other entries. I know this is how we learn, but yuck.

I now feel like this : about this image, although I kind of liked it when I first did it.

Again, is this normal????

sniff.

Kara

====================================

Kara, :nono

Do not get discouraged.. You should have seen some of the entries I have put up and the fiasco and confusion that endured.. I would start with one and end up posting something completely different and against everyone's best advice.. It happens...

Sometimes, that bit me in the beeeehind and I learned a lesson, and other times, it just felt good to go with my "own" gut and enter what I felt good about.. I can say that these photogs on here are "amazing" and have helped me rework a shot for over a week until it sings... It can really help to push you to new heights..

Nobody here is going to take it personal if you "don't take our advice. We just throw it up there to help you in case you might miss things on the CC... It is only to help.. But please don't feel obligated in any way...

Keep shooting and keep learning and have fun... No matter what a person enjoys doing, once they strive for perfection at anything, it can sometimes suck the joy out of it, and make it feel like work.. It is just the nature of the beast.

Enter what you feel good about.. and I always say, in the end, go with your "own" gut feeling. We are here as friends and support to give our best advice and hope that in return you will give us yours..

ok, enough of my rambling..

D

By the way.. I really like the title you gave it.. I just love creative titles, they are like the frosting on a cake...

Kat

kds1 · August 19, 2009

Gotcha, Kat. Thanks!

Chris K - yes, good to know another Corel user! I do like it, just haven't had time to fully get into it. Bit by bit. I also got Painter 11 just recently, which is awesome, and I've just finished watching the tutorials for that (and then by the time I have time to use it, I'll forget it all . . .

).

Kinkajou · August 19, 2009

kds1 wrote:

Sigh. I went ahead and entered this with the changes suggested. but now I pretty much don't like it.

And now we all know why I don't enter anything until the last minute

I do like the high key and white background on this and think that a reshoot wouldn't hurt but isn't necessary. We're not pros competing for a sale here, we're just a bunch of folks having fun and trying to learn something along the way.

Best of luck!

#31 C & C please

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