7D, 580EXII and 2d curtain?

Nikolai

I'm still playing with the various settings on the new gear. Most of them are already "on my fingertips", but one thing kinda gets me stuck:
Is it possible to achieve 2d curtain on the external flash if using it wirelessly from 7D?
I've been trying various modes (and searched various sites), but I only seem to be able to get 1st curtain enabled in wireless configuration...:dunno
Anybody knows any different? :scratch

ziggy53

Nikolai wrote:

I'm still playing with the various settings on the new gear. Most of them are already "on my fingertips", but one thing kinda gets me stuck:
Is it possible to achieve 2d curtain on the external flash if using it wirelessly from 7D?
I've been trying various modes (and searched various sites), but I only seem to be able to get 1st curtain enabled in wireless configuration...
Anybody knows any different?

I think you can do it with a simple optical slaved or radio slaved flash, but not with E-TTL wireless automation.

What is your application?

Nikolai

ziggy53 wrote:

I think you can do it with a simple optical slaved or radio slaved flash, but not with E-TTL wireless automation.

What is your application?

Ziggy, thanks for the prompt response.
As you know, I'm not a big speedlight user, my forte is in the studio lights...
However, occasionally I do party candids/red carpets, and the idea of not having to carry/attach ST-E2 brings a certain amount of joy to my heart. Having said that, I do believe 2d curtain creates a more pleasant view. Hence, my question - can it be done wirelessly? I know I can do it by placing the 580 into the hotshoe, or using the cord, but... come on... Why have all these nice wireless capabilities of 7D and not being able to use them?

ziggy53

Here is the "official" Canon information:

"The sole thing you cannot do in wireless that you can with a single flash on-camera is 2nd curtain flash sync."

http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=2966

I did find this DIY approach:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/climberhunt/3888963763/

I'll bet that the Poppers or Flex/Mini devices could help too.

Nikolai

Ziggy, you never cease to amaze me!
Thanks a lot, great links!

AlbertZeroK

ziggy53 wrote:

Here is the "official" Canon information:

"The sole thing you cannot do in wireless that you can with a single flash on-camera is 2nd curtain flash sync."

http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=2966

I did find this DIY approach:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/climberhunt/3888963763/

I'll bet that the Poppers or Flex/Mini devices could help too.

I've been playing with my Mini and pair of Flex's (and an ST-e2), I don't see any 2nd curtain flash settings in the config for the mini/flex. I wonder though if it will inherit the setting from the camera or on my 580ex II? (Of course, if you are liking not needing the ST-e2, then I don't think a Mini with a 580ex II attached is exactly the solution you want.)

I will say though that for off camera flash, the MINI/Flex is great, I can't wait for the Zone Controller to come out, then I can control 3 groups of flashes manually from the camera - those will be good days!

puzzledpaul

Be interested to learn whether the 7D when connected to a flash - either h/shoe or corded has to be used @ 1/25s or slower to obtain 2nd curtain.

I've no idea about the 50D, but it's certainly the case with 20 / 40D.
(been using a 550ex btw ... but doubt that's the issue?)

pp

divamum

Canon flash won't work in 2nd synch when fired using ettl wireless - same problem using the STE2 (I know, because I asked the question a while back. I can't find the thread, but if I do I'll come back and edit it into this response).

jeffreaux2

divamum wrote:

Canon flash won't work in 2nd synch when fired using ettl wireless - same problem using the STE2 (I know, because I asked the question a while back. I can't find the thread, but if I do I'll come back and edit it into this response).

This is correct.


The STE2 wont allow for SCS.

...also...it cannot be done using a 580 as master.....and another as slave.


IOW there is no solution from Canon for wireless SCS.

....and THAT pretty much sucks.


If you find a way Nik....please share!

Jeremy Winterberg

wow... I've been out of the loop for a month and I miss out on a new camera release??

the 7D?
Is it nice?

It sounds like its a mix between the 5D MkII and the T1I (From what I read on a different site (not much) I got the impression that its not full frame, but it has HD video)

rwells

Nikolai wrote:

Ziggy, thanks for the prompt response.
As you know, I'm not a big speedlight user, my forte is in the studio lights...
However, occasionally I do party candids/red carpets, and the idea of not having to carry/attach ST-E2 brings a certain amount of joy to my heart. Having said that, I do believe 2d curtain creates a more pleasant view. Hence, my question - can it be done wirelessly? I know I can do it by placing the 580 into the hotshoe, or using the cord, but... come on... Why have all these nice wireless capabilities of 7D and not being able to use them?

Hey Nik,

I'm interested in hearing why for candids/red carpets, you believe that 2nd curtain creates a more pleasant view?

In my experience, it has not worked out well with people shots in general. Depending on your shutter speed, when you take a shot here's what happens. The pre-flash still fires before the shutter opens to get the E-TTL exposure info. Now, again depending on your shutter speed, (if your using SCS, it's probably a fairly slow speed), your subjects will either subconsciously react (blink) or if the speed is slow enough, will consciously react. (turn their eyes or head thinking that the image has already been taken), then the main flash fires, freezing either of those I just mentioned. Both are not good and will lead most times (for me) to images that I can't use.

YMMV, and I'd be interested in the details.

Nikolai

rwells wrote:

Hey Nik,

I'm interested in hearing why for candids/red carpets, you believe that 2nd curtain creates a more pleasant view?

In my experience, it has not worked out well with people shots in general. Depending on your shutter speed, when you take a shot here's what happens. The pre-flash still fires before the shutter opens to get the E-TTL exposure info. Now, again depending on your shutter speed, (if your using SCS, it's probably a fairly slow speed), your subjects will either subconsciously react (blink) or if the speed is slow enough, will consciously react. (turn their eyes or head thinking that the image has already been taken), then the main flash fires, freezing either of those I just mentioned. Both are not good and will lead most times (for me) to images that I can't use.

YMMV, and I'd be interested in the details.

Randy,
regardles of the scenery, 2d curtain flash puts a movign subject in front of its ghostly trail, which I personally consider befeficial.
I only made references to red carpet/party candids becuase that's the only case where I can possible see myself using speedlight at all. I'm mostly trying to use bigger guns....

rwells

Nikolai wrote:

Randy,
regardles of the scenery, 2d curtain flash puts a movign subject in front of its ghostly trail, which I personally consider befeficial.
I only made references to red carpet/party candids becuase that's the only case where I can possible see myself using speedlight at all. I'm mostly trying to use bigger guns....

Well, whatever your motivation...

I don't think your interested in this, but others might be:

I just tested my 580EXIIs out with a pair of PW TT5 units. I had one TT5 mounted on camera's hot-shoe & a 580EXII on top of that. The remote 580EXII was mounted to a TT5. Both were set to ETTL. Note this is different than if you set the camera mounted flash (on top of the TT5 to "Master") The flash on the camera ONLY was physically set to enable SCS. You can then have off-camera, ETTL SCS. Even if you disable the on-camera/TT5 from contributing to the exposure, you will still get SCS with the off-camera flash mounted on the TT5 unit.

Hope that helps...

ziggy53

rwells wrote:

Well, whatever your motivation...

I don't think your interested in this, but others might be:

I just tested my 580EXIIs out with a pair of PW TT5 units. I had one TT5 mounted on camera's hot-shoe & a 580EXII on top of that. The remote 580EXII was mounted to a TT5. Both were set to ETTL. Note this is different than if you set the camera mounted flash (on top of the TT5 to "Master") The flash on the camera ONLY was physically set to enable SCS. You can then have off-camera, ETTL SCS. Even if you disable the on-camera/TT5 from contributing to the exposure, you will still get SCS with the off-camera flash mounted on the TT5 unit.

Hope that helps...

"Hope that helps..."

Absolutely. Thanks Randy.

puzzledpaul

<< "Hope that helps..." >>

Certainly does ... many thanks

Looking at the PW site (as I don't have any of this kit atm), I wondered if this page might be of interest to 580ex owners - I was trying to find out whether my 550exs would be compatible with TT5's.

Coming back to my original Q - has anyone established the shutter speed at which the 7D reverts to FCS, irrespective of the fact that it (and flash) are set to SCS?

pp


http://www.pocketwizard.com/inspirations/technology/range/

NeilL

rwells wrote:

Well, whatever your motivation...

I don't think your interested in this, but others might be:

I just tested my 580EXIIs out with a pair of PW TT5 units. I had one TT5 mounted on camera's hot-shoe & a 580EXII on top of that. The remote 580EXII was mounted to a TT5. Both were set to ETTL. Note this is different than if you set the camera mounted flash (on top of the TT5 to "Master") The flash on the camera ONLY was physically set to enable SCS. You can then have off-camera, ETTL SCS. Even if you disable the on-camera/TT5 from contributing to the exposure, you will still get SCS with the off-camera flash mounted on the TT5 unit.

Hope that helps...

Mighty tricky D

Randy, do you know of a site which comprehensively examines the potential applications of the PW gear?

Thanks.

Neil

rwells

NeilL wrote:

Mighty tricky D

Randy, do you know of a site which comprehensively examines the potential applications of the PW gear?

Thanks.

Neil

Neil,

Aside from the Pocket Wizard website, I'm not aware of a site that delves into all the "potential" applications of the new units.

Given the shortcomings of these units, I would think that PW would try and list every possible use that you could imagine for these units. But alas, that's not the case.

AlbertZeroK

NeilL wrote:

Mighty tricky D

Randy, do you know of a site which comprehensively examines the potential applications of the PW gear?

Thanks.

Neil

There is little information, but honestly, their feature set is small, and the RF interference issue is killing the devices. They have faster high speed sync, eTTL off camera via RF and compatibility with the other Pocketwizard devices. And later on, manual control via a device on the camera.

NeilL

@ Randy & Albert
Thanks guys for your kind replies - I check out what's there.

Neil