Let's make a deal

Richard

Thanks for looking. C&C always welcome.

michswiss

After spending a few minutes studying them, there's a washed out, almost flat feeling to the processing on the first that is bothersome. Pushed the shadows too much? Not enough contrast or need to lift the black point?

But then again, I've spent a few minutes studying them because they are somehow compelling. The framing feels slightly off in the first with the space behind the merchant and severe placement of the customer on the right.

But, at the end for me. Enjoying them!

rutt

I agree with michswiss. Harsh lighting conditions make you work hard to get the exposure you wanted for your main subjects? If you show the originals or make the raw files available, I might be able to help.

bdcolen

rutt wrote:

I agree with michswiss. Harsh lighting conditions make you work hard to get the exposure you wanted for your main subjects? If you show the originals or make the raw files available, I might be able to help.

What they said... But let me add that, with better processing, and perhaps some cropping, I think you've got two strong images here.

Richard

Yeah, I wasn't very happy with either the color or converted vesions, but I liked the scenes. As Rutt said, the light was difficult--very bright sun with the subjects in the shade. Sure hope Canon comes up with a "Make it Cloudy" button someday. Here are the XL color versions, if someone want to take a crack at a better conversion:





Rutt: I'd be delighted to send you the RAWs. Can you recommend a free large file transfer service? They're probably too big to attach to an email.

Cheers,

thoth

Richard wrote:

Rutt: I'd be delighted to send you the RAWs. Can you recommend a free large file transfer service? They're probably too big to attach to an email.

Cheers,

www.yousendit.com has always worked well for me.

bdcolen

Richard wrote:

Yeah, I wasn't very happy with either the color or converted vesions, but I liked the scenes. As Rutt said, the light was difficult--very bright sun with the subjects in the shade. Sure hope Canon comes up with a "Make it Cloudy" button someday. Here are the XL color versions, if someone want to take a crack at a better conversion:





Rutt: I'd be delighted to send you the RAWs. Can you recommend a free large file transfer service? They're probably too big to attach to an email.

Cheers,

Well, I think this is closer, but Rutt is the real maven here....

kdog

I dunno, I'm a color kinda guy. I see in color, my camera shoots in color, why fight it? rofl

Good shooting there, Richard. Looks like a great place to shoot too.

-joel (Who used to develop his own B&W prints back in the day. )

rutt

Of course it depends what you are after. I took a stab at it using just the posted color jpeg and got this:



I only three steps to get this:

1. Used shadow/highlight with the following settings:
   1. Shadow: 59/16/30
   2. Highlight: 50/20/30
   I arrived at these by using Dan Margulis' suggested technique: Turn amount all the way up, adjust tonal width so the effect is where you want it and not too much in other places, adjust amount to taste. I did the highlights first because that light background is the biggest issue and then shadows to get a little more detail instead of big plugged areas. Play with this, you'll be amazed how much detail there is even in the apparently damaged jpegs.
2. Convert to B&W by just taking the green channel. I look a look at the other two channels, but everything I wanted was in the green channel and I was happy with how the colors mapped to gray in that channel. Faces are almost always best in green, so that's usually my starting point.
3. A little curve to add drama. I stole detail from the deep shadows for the highlights midtones, where I think it's most needed. You might not even need this. After the first two steps, the image looked pretty good to me. Here is the curve, though:
   
   Note, darkness to the right, not the usual photoshop default.

You could burn that background a little, but I think you'd do better to crop it a bit and leave it light.

black mamba

Hi Richard,

I've got to tell you. I like your color version of these two scenes immensely more than the B&W version. The colored ones show life and vibrancy.....in my eyes, characteristics completely void in the two B&W interpretations. I know such talk is tantamount to heresy on this forum and I'm sure not trying to stir that pot. I'm just stating a personal opinion as it applies to these shots.

Tom

rutt

I think there is a lot in this. The color versions would also benefit from some TLC in post. They have the same exposure issues as the B&W versions and also a blue cast in the foreground highlights.

black mamba wrote:

Hi Richard,

I've got to tell you. I like your color version of these two scenes immensely more than the B&W version. The colored ones show life and vibrancy.....in my eyes, characteristics completely void in the two B&W interpretations. I know such talk is tantamount to heresy on this forum and I'm sure not trying to stir that pot. I'm just stating a personal opinion as it applies to these shots.

Tom

Richard

Thanks for all the comments, and special thanks to BD and Rutt for the alternate conversions. They are both improvements over what I posted.

As some of you know, I play both sides of the fence on the color/BW question. The choice really depends on the individual image. Sometimes, the color is so bland that it is easier to add drama in B&W. More often on the street, the colors are vivid but ugly and may distract attention from the subject. I think this is what made me opt for B&W in the one with the woman customer--there is a guy in bright orange and a bit of bright magenta on either side of her, plus the intense blue of the display box. So she is surrounded by the strongest colors in the frame. Not good for focusing the viewer on her, which is what I wanted.

Regarding the other one, I originally liked the color version better, then the B&W, but now I'm thinking that color does work better. I just wish I could get people to coordinate their wardrobes a bit.