Facebook as a business tool?

mercphoto

Anyone using Facebook as a business tool? I know the race track I photographed at last month uses it and they said its been great for them. I know a few of my competitors do the same. So I finally got a page up at www.facebook.com/mercuryphotography but I guess the really big question is how to best advertise this, get people to pay attention to my site, sign up as friends, etc. I've already got the link in the signature I use on most the forums I visit. And I plan to email existing clients.

Currently I'm thinking of using the place as a defacto blog, putting up information about recents events I photograph, or advertising any specials I'm doing or making of requests, etc. Is Facebook a good place to do stuff like this?

Thanks for educating the clueless...

Mox

I use it. I'm new to the business, so new to using fb as a business tool, but I think it does help to generate excitement after a shoot. I don't have a real blog, so I'm using it as you describe - to update recent shoots, blog a bit, and post teasers. I also just posted a coupon there.

It's fun to see people interact around the photos.

The page you've created is a standard profile page. If you create a business page, people won't have to wait for you to accept friend requests in order to see your content. Of course, you may want to keep it more private, but if you want an openly accessible blog-type business page, you can create the business profile in addition to your personal profile. Or, you can change the privacy settings on your personal profile...

I hope that's not too confusing!

Good luck!

As to getting the word out - in addition to what you're already doing, you can search facebook for your email contacts to send friend requests or invitations to become "fans" depending on your page type. I also have it linked on my website.

mercphoto

Thanks for the feedback. I just opened up much of the page to "everyone", which I think will help matters. Also didn't realize there was a distinction to a business account.

du8die

It's not so much a separate account, per-se. You'll still be you - you just create a page for your business.

Here's a link to get you started...

http://www.facebook.com/pages/create.php

run_kmc

Can people who aren't Facebook members see Facebook pages, and will Google find these? I have no idea, but if not, you might want to start an actual blog and either link to that through your facebook page, or just duplicate the content so everyone can find it.

ShepsMom

People can see and read Fan pages (business pages) without being a member of FB, but in order for them to become a fan or make a comment they will need to create an account.

Advertising with FB might help as well, you can target by age/demographics/etc....

TW0R

The thing that sucks about facebook though is that it wrecks pictures. I always post a link to my flickr under pictures I put on fb.

ColoradoSkier

ShepsMom wrote:

People can see and read Fan pages (business pages) without being a member of FB, but in order for them to become a fan or make a comment they will need to create an account.

Advertising with FB might help as well, you can target by age/demographics/etc....

All of my tests for FB advertising so far have proved it to be a waste of money. These were for non-photography related ads, but it is enough to make me wonder. I think you would be better served by just putting things in your status update and hoping your friends share them with their friends, etc. One of the big research firms (Forrester I think) says that a mention on one persons FB status is worth 150 "impressions" as the average FB user has that many friends. If you can get just a couple of people to comment on it, "like" it, or share it, you have extended your reach significantly.

juddpainter

Facebook
I just booked an engagement shoot as a result of a facebook pay-per-click ad - they loved the pics and have confirmed they want to use me for the wedding. Although I have spent $250 so far in two months and only gotten 1 booking from it, facebook has given me FAR better results than a profile on some of the more famous wedding vendor websites! I get about 10 hits a day from this ad, at about $0.80 a hit. One of THE best things about facebook paid advertising as Shepsmom says is that you can target demographics - so I can have my 'wedding engagement photography' ad set to display in the facebook page of women who are engaged, aged 25 or over, living within 25 miles of Los Angeles (there are about 10,000 of them I think)

ColoradoSkier I like your point about spreading the word organically through friends - will be trying that approach in the next few weeks.

Judd Watts
Venice Beach, Los Angeles
www.jingerstudios.com

marikris

I started a fb fan page coz I didn't have a blog and I pretty much suck at blogging. The cool part is I can pretty much embed my website on the page: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Houston-TX/Kris-Fulk-Photography/346455440180?v=app_4949752878&ref=ts If you click on the picture it goes real time. I used FBML app and Nick Haskins made a code for people who use showit. I don't know how this would work with non-showit members - surely it would, I just don't know coding.

Anyway, I was convinced by others to make a blog too since that helps with SEO, whereas fb does not.

toddb

very nice Kris
Facebook user just to catch up with friends and know it could be a useful tool for business, but did not know you could embed your site in that way -- looks great and I would imagine could be very useful. Any special considerations in doing this? lessons learned in setting it up? Upside? Downside?

kpmedia

ColoradoSkier wrote:

All of my tests for FB advertising so far have proved it to be a waste of money. These were for non-photography related ads, but it is enough to make me wonder. I think you would be better served by just putting things in your status update and hoping your friends share them with their friends, etc. One of the big research firms (Forrester I think) says that a mention on one persons FB status is worth 150 "impressions" as the average FB user has that many friends. If you can get just a couple of people to comment on it, "like" it, or share it, you have extended your reach significantly.

This is very interesting. I've been wondering how well this works. I think I'll save my money.

Thanks.

lilmomma

just a side note, in case it helps anyone- you can sell your photos from facebook as well with this storefront app. Check it out.

http://www.payvment.com/

ColoradoSkier

lilmomma wrote:

just a side note, in case it helps anyone- you can sell your photos from facebook as well with this storefront app. Check it out.

http://www.payvment.com/

Do you have an example of this in action?

lilmomma

I don't personally...I have nothing to sell My brother-in-law and his wife developed it.

you can find the payvment facebook page for more info
www.facebook.com/payvment

also this article.
http://www.techcrunch.com/2009/10/14/payvment-enables-retail-storefronts-on-facebook-via-paypals-adaptive-payments-api/

samgwatts

Facebook Advertising
I use Facebook all the time and rely on it as my main channel of advertising. As my business is focused on wedding photography, like Judd, I can target exactly who I want where I want. Although I don't find that having a facebook page does me any good.

fredjclaus

I do use Facebook. Both as a personal "social networking" site as well as a marketing tool. There are a couple books out there I'm trying to find that talk about how to use Facebook and Twitter for business marketing. My business page on facebook is very heavily read by my fans. One thing I've learned is not to do strictly marketing on your business page that will just turn people off they say. Interacting with your fans is a great way to keep them and help build your fan list. On specific holidays I post a "Happy whatever to my fans" I've posted about Haiti, and reposted articles on Haiti news on my business site.

As a commercial photographer, I do just about everything form of photography, but mostly I market my event services. My Facebook page posts local events that are happening around, and even the events I will be photographing. Sort of like a teaser for where I will be, as well as a way for people to find out the local happenings. I also post when I'm leaving for an event just as a reminder. Once the event is over I come home, edit the photos and upload them to my SmugMug page. If the event coordinators allow me to, I also post a comment on my facebook page with a link to the event photos on my Smugmug page. It's a great way to show that I'm still out there, and also show potential clients what I can do.

Hope that helps a little.

ColoradoSkier

fredjclaus wrote:

I do use Facebook.

Do you have a link to your business page there?

fredjclaus

Here is my fan page.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Grand-Island-NY/Fred-J-Claus-Commerical-Photographer/93763295868?filter=3

Kevin Kramer

I found that my facebook page gains a little buzz after an event that I shoot. as far as advertising, i haven't done any of that. I find that I post the photos in two places rather than one (Website and Facebook) therefore doing double work. I know that I can just create the blog post, and then share it to facebook, but i'm a stats whore and want to see who is clicking what.. On my main website, I do have the option to become a fan of the photography page.

The Pavement looks very intriguing and I might look into that also.

vegaguy

marikris wrote:

I started a fb fan page coz I didn't have a blog and I pretty much suck at blogging. The cool part is I can pretty much embed my website on the page: http://www.facebook.com/pages/Houston-TX/Kris-Fulk-Photography/346455440180?v=app_4949752878&ref=ts If you click on the picture it goes real time. I used FBML app and Nick Haskins made a code for people who use showit. I don't know how this would work with non-showit members - surely it would, I just don't know coding.

Anyway, I was convinced by others to make a blog too since that helps with SEO, whereas fb does not.

I'm curious to hear more from everyone on this topic as I am new to Facebook and could really pass on the whole thing. I like what 'Marikris' did with the clickable link tho. Is there a good way to get people turned on to your facebook page and gain popularity as well as drive people to your website?

BeachBill

I just downloaded this today and haven't had a chance to read it, but just glancing at it, this might be just what you need to get started:

http://www.digitalweddingforum.com/blog/free-social-media-guide-for-photographers

Gary Peterson Photography

Works well..
Facebook is an amazing tool if used correctly.

http://www.facebook.com/pages/Gary-Peterson/122341401203

vegaguy

BeachBill wrote:

I just downloaded this today and haven't had a chance to read it, but just glancing at it, this might be just what you need to get started:

http://www.digitalweddingforum.com/blog/free-social-media-guide-for-photographers

ha, funny, it is a good read. quite interesting on a few topics actually.

BradfordBenn

Be sure you are familiar with the Terms of Use
I did not see this mentioned, but figured I would share the reason I don't use Facebook. This quote is directly from their terms of use http://www.facebook.com/terms.php. I am not an attorney and I try not to play one on the Internet, but this seems specious and onerous to me:

Sharing Your Content and Information
You own all of the content and information you post on Facebook, and you can control how it is shared through your privacy and application settings. In addition:

For content that is covered by intellectual property rights, like photos and videos ("IP content"), you specifically give us the following permission, subject to your privacy and application settings: you grant us a non-exclusive, transferable, sub-licensable, royalty-free, worldwide license to use any IP content that you post on or in connection with Facebook ("IP License"). This IP License ends when you delete your IP content or your account unless your content has been shared with others, and they have not deleted it.
When you delete IP content, it is deleted in a manner similar to emptying the recycle bin on a computer. However, you understand that removed content may persist in backup copies for a reasonable period of time (but will not be available to others).
When you add an application and use Platform, your content and information is shared with the application. We require applications to respect your privacy settings, but your agreement with that application will control how the application can use the content and information you share. (To learn more about Platform, read our About Platform page.)
When you publish content or information using the "everyone" setting, it means that everyone, including people off of Facebook, will have access to that information and we may not have control over what they do with it.
We always appreciate your feedback or other suggestions about Facebook, but you understand that we may use them without any obligation to compensate you for them (just as you have no obligation to offer them).

A few other comments on their Terms of Use can be found at http://www.photoattorney.com/2009/02/facebooks-terms-of-use-go-from-bad-to.html who does play a lawyer on the Internet.

vegaguy

BradfordBenn wrote:

I did not see this mentioned, but figured I would share the reason I don't use Facebook. This quote is directly from their terms of use http://www.facebook.com/terms.php. I am not an attorney and I try not to play one on the Internet, but this seems specious and onerous to me:


A few other comments on their Terms of Use can be found at http://www.photoattorney.com/2009/02/facebooks-terms-of-use-go-from-bad-to.html who does play a lawyer on the Internet.

just watermark images with ur logo so if displayed it is visible. they do not own them, they just get to use and display them.

colourbox

BradfordBenn wrote:

I am not an attorney and I try not to play one on the Internet, but this seems specious and onerous to me

I'm not a lawyer either, but be aware that 98% of the Facebook terms of service are the same as the terms of service for most sites that involve shared user content, including Smugmug. This is because a service must have your permission to copy, store, transmit, etc. your files to multiple servers internationally and distribute them to others' screens on your behalf. "Create derivative works" is a short way of saying "Legally, we need your permission to resize and crop your photos to make little square thumbnails, medium size versions, etc."

The current Facebook TOS dated Dec 21, 2009 is different and better than what is quoted in the photoattorney.com website, probably revised as a result of all the controversy. The only onerous passage I see now is: "you grant us a non-exclusive, transferable, sub-licensable, royalty-free, worldwide license to use any IP content that you post on or in connection with Facebook ("IP License")." This is vague and even the definition of "use" further down isn't specific about how they can and can't use it.

The "irrevocable, perpetual, royalty-free" language, which Smugmug also uses, means, I think, that the company can't afford to have individual users all negotiating different terms for the use of their images on the service: every user has to agree to the same terms. "Royalty-free" means you can't ask Smugmug or Facebook to pay you for the right to use your images in the normal business of copying your images to servers and displaying them with the company's software. In other words, a lot of it is there for legal CYA.

I'm not saying Facebook TOS is not a problem. It still has more questionable passages than other services. We do need to watermark photos posted on it to help make them unsuitable for unwanted reuse. It is also a problem that Facebook doesn't preserve any metadata at all, so that your copyright won't be inside the images. But the deletion of copyright metadata is (for now) also a problem on photos we put on Smugmug, for all display sizes except Original.

DigitalMom

I use Facebook and a blog for marketing. On my Facebook page, I use it as a marketing took to show off recent sessions or my personal work. I've gained a few clients from it because it's easier to share. I interact it with my blog, offering specials or what not, even advertising seniors, couples, etc. "Become a fan on Facebook and get 10% off prints" or something along that line.

I use my blog for more of my pricing, set up shots...things of that nature. That is my main contact page and usually try and gear people towards there.

HoofClix

My main use for Facebook has been to keep up with old college friends, and I have not had any problem with the copyright laws applications as I don't up any stuff that I really care about.

I have felt it rather vain to start a fan page like many of my competitors have, but I talked to a friendly one this afternoon, and he explained that he doesn't care about the friendship so much as how it helps him control the screen capturing of his images.

Basically, when he sells digital images, he makes the buyer maintain an open friendship with his fan page so he can monitor if they are screen capping his proofs.

I'm about to get a little bit more vain!

ColoradoSkier

Good article on what to do with your Facebook fans - http://www.socialmediaexaminer.com/13-ways-to-move-your-facebook-fans-to-action/

marikris

ColoradoSkier wrote:

Good article on what to do with your Facebook fans - http://www.socialmediaexaminer.com/13-ways-to-move-your-facebook-fans-to-action/

Totally, good read! I've just recently begun to actively work on my facebook fan page. I've been updating more and trying to get a call to action going - check it out: Houston Portrait Photographer