Very disappointed with Bay Photo shipping

Redneck

It has been the second time that my prints arrive in a cardboard envelope bent to fit into my small mailbox.
Why can't Bay Photo put a sticker on the envelope saying "DO NOT BEND" or "PHOTOGRAPHS INSIDE" or "HANDLE WITH CARE" or anything like it? Of course you can blame the mailman for bending the envelope but how is he supposed to know there are valuable photographs inside?

I really don't get it. I don't think it is too hard to place a warning note on an envelope.
Shame on you, Bay Photo!

Andy

Hi Redneck, we've shipped zillions and billions of packages - it makes zero different if it says do not bend or not The delivery guys still shove and crush.

Bay Photo is renowned for bullet proof packaging, but I'm sorry yours got crushed! You're fully covered by the SmugMug Guarantee, so please write our Support Heroes with your order # and we'll get you a new set of prints asap.

I'm so sorry.

Redneck

I'm more worried about my customers. Most of'em don't give me feedback about how their prints arrived. I just don't want to lose customers due to poor shipping.
I still think it doesn't cost much to put a warning note on the envelope. If there is a warning note on it and the envelope is still bent, then we can really put the blame on the mailman.

RBrogen

Redneck wrote:

I'm more worried about my customers. Most of'em don't give me feedback about how their prints arrived. I just don't want to lose customers due to poor shipping.
I still think it doesn't cost much to put a warning note on the envelope. If there is a warning note on it and the envelope is still bent, then we can really put the blame on the mailman.

Hey Redneck,

For what it's worth, I ALWAYS contact my clients to verify they received their product and that they are fully satisfied. I don't wait for them to give me feedback. I think this is one of those areas where you have to be pro-active and I've never had a client complain about that level of service.

Randy

twincitiesphoto

I've ordered prints from Bay for myself and the cardboard box was stamped with red ink "Fragile - Photos Enclosed"

I think they do a great job of shipping - I agree the problem lies with the delivery person or someone else along the delivery chain.

Andy

Redneck wrote:

I'm more worried about my customers. Most of'em don't give me feedback about how their prints arrived. I just don't want to lose customers due to poor shipping.
I still think it doesn't cost much to put a warning note on the envelope. If there is a warning note on it and the envelope is still bent, then we can really put the blame on the mailman.

BTW, the envelopes from Bay should say this on them:



Still, even with this, the postal carriers sometimes shove, bend, stomp, etc.

Sparky

You may want to pass along to Bay that I also don't have any warning messages stamped on the mailers I receive. Never had a problem, just wanted to let you know it is not an isolated incident.

GJMPhoto

A matter of culpability
The issue is not whether it would make a difference or not, it's who is cupable for the crushed pictures (and reputations).

If the delivery folks ignore a warning, they are to blame - and you can take it up with their supervisors - and Bay can take it up with them on a larger scale.

But, if Bay does not mark the packages, they are solely responsible. On a small scale, this means having to reprint and resend at their expense. On a larger scale, they may one day have to answer to a class action suit. Regardless, there is some financial payback for a really SIMPLE fix now!

My local delivery folks are VERY good about reading the labels and taking care of the photo packages.

Delivery folks are not gorillas - give them a chance to do what's right!

- Gary.

Andy

GJMPhoto wrote:

On a small scale, this means having to reprint and resend at their expense. On a larger scale, they may one day have to answer to a class action suit. Regardless, there is some financial payback for a really SIMPLE fix now!

I've asked Larry to post here. It should say 'fragile' on the envelopes like my photo above shows

Art Scott

Folks it is the delivery persons responsibility to see that the packages are delivered in good condition.....whether stamped fragile or not.......it is also a proven fact that if packages are stamped fragile they receive harsher treatment than those not stamped........
Simply put this was a case of a Postal worker being too lazy to fill out a delivery attempt form and to have the OP pick up his photos at the P.O. .......most carriers know exactly what size mail box or slot (in my case) their clients have so their really is no reason for this to be happening.
I have over 20yrs in the shipping industry and have seen the training videos from Frd ex, UPS and also the Postal Service as to what happens when items are marked fragile, Glass handle with care, Magnetic media, EXPOSED FILM do not X-RAY......yeah they will bend it, shake it, bounce it off the floor and will X-RAY exposed film......just becasue the sticker and stamps said not tooo.....especially if there is no "INSURED" stamp there.........

GJMPhoto

Accountability
Art,
I don't disagree...but it isn't possible that all deliverers are this way...or nothing would arrive in one piece! As I stated, my local deliverers are excellent...I ship photos, even by USPS, locally without issue for the past 12 years (kenna hurrah)...and I stamp every envelope with 'Photos: Do Not Bend'. I just finished sending out more than 50 30x40 posters in tubes via UPS - some to Canada - and have not heard a single complaint of mishandling...one even came back from Toronto in one piece!

My point is, it makes no sense for a printer NOT to post a warning on the packaging...at least they cover their own butts...and in the unlikely event they come across the one 'deliverer with a conscience', we may just avoid a problem!

- Gary.

Tim Kamppinen

Hmm, every time I've gotten something from Bay Photo it was encased in 10 layers of cardboard and took me like five minutes to open. Never had a problem with damaged prints.

termina3

Bay Photo's packaging is just a few strands of kevlar away from stopping bullets. I'm not clear on how your postal worker even manages to bend the packages.

Granted, I usually am ordering from Bay directly (through their ROES tool) because I want Bay quality, Bay color correction, and pro foamboard backing.

The only damage I've ever seen from Bay was recently, when the mounting process didn't go quite right, and a small sliver of the photo was sliced away. Emailed Bay with the order number and some QC info, the new order's in the mail right now. This damage was clearly not a result of packaging.

With all that said, I have seen packaged that both do and don't have "photo enclosed" stamps. Either way, I don't see my UPS deliveryman or USPS worker being able to bend the packages if they wanted to. They just lay them up against my door.

Betz

I've ordered several times from Bay Photo (everything from single prints to a Thin Wrap) and the items have been in plastic sleeves, with sheets of foam padding, then sheets of cardboard over top of all of that, along with lots of tape and that's just what they do to the products BEFORE they stick them in the shipping box!

Haven't had any issues so far and I've received them through FedEx, UPS and USPS. It takes me 5-10 minutes just to get through their packaging to see my photos and everything has been clearly stamped that it's fragile and there is photographic materials inside.

termina3

BTW, was looking through some of my Bay packages today, definitely didn't see the warning stamp on it.

HarrisPhotographicArts

Got a package today from Bay. No markings on mine. Came in the cardboard envelope like the one Andy posted the photo of. Mine always arrive in good shape, but for the record, no markings.

kefkafloyd

Andy wrote:

BTW, the envelopes from Bay should say this on them:



Still, even with this, the postal carriers sometimes shove, bend, stomp, etc.

Andy, this is a bit OT, but is that you or someone you know wearing that Canyon Ranch shirt? I used to work for a company that did lots of printing for CR in the Berkshires. Very small world!

Andy

kefkafloyd wrote:

Andy, this is a bit OT, but is that you or someone you know wearing that Canyon Ranch shirt? I used to work for a company that did lots of printing for CR in the Berkshires. Very small world!

it's me and I love that shirt - I send my wife there whenever I can she loves it! Yes, small world!

kefkafloyd

Andy wrote:

it's me and I love that shirt - I send my wife there whenever I can she loves it! Yes, small world!

Pittsfield and the Berkshires are where I hail from originally, it's a great place to go photographically... don't be a stranger!

Redneck

It would be nice to have this "FRAGILE" stamp on the envelope, but this is not the reality.
Our USPS people are very understanding and friendly (small community) and they usually only bend an envelope when they think it is more convenient for me to have a bent envelope in the mailbox rather than going to the post office.
I mean isn't it pretty easy to let Bay Photo know the should put this stamp on every envelope again? That's all I'm asking for.

Andy

Redneck wrote:

I mean isn't it pretty easy

you would think so, but then there are negotiations between Bay Photo and the USPS that you aren't aware of

Stamping the envelopes means a whole different structure to the deal...

Ken K

Andy wrote:

you would think so, but then there are negotiations between Bay Photo and the USPS that you aren't aware of

Stamping the envelopes means a whole different structure to the deal...

Since they are negotiating, what I would expect the package to say is:

PHOTOS - DO NOT BEND

THis seems far more clear to me than using "Fragile". I have received phots from other labs in the past with the DO NOT BEND stamps and it seems to work. When I send prints myself, I put a do not bend sticker on the envelope.

Ken