Best wireless flash setup?

bike21

Ok, so I am wanting to get into using more off camera flash without the limitations of relying on my Nikon strobe's infrared systems. I have began looking at Alienbees Cybersync and of course Pocket Wizards. I am admittedly a bit confused on where to go next and what exactly to purchase. Here are my thoughts/needs...

- need to shoot wireless behind walls and longer distances at times
- use to up 2 off camera flashes
- prefer a portable system as possible without carrying around battery packs

I shoot with Nikon and currently have two SB-600s and one SB-900. I currently don't plan on much studio type stuff, but more outdoor creative light use with athletes/sports/weddings/engagements. So portability is key with any setup I go for. I think as I grow I will look more into bigger/better lighting, but for now I will stick with my SBs. So the question remains, what is the best way to wirelessly control them?

adbsgicom

Manual control on the flash or iTTL? If the later, include RadioPopper in the mix. I have them for my Canon and I believe they now support Nikon. www.radiopopper.com to see if it fits your need. I went this route because the PW eTTL was having a lot of issues with the RF generated by the Canon system, and the RP system was not. I don't know of anyone who as done a side-by-side on them.

Art Scott

I use THESE and have had no problems but mine is normally out doors or in same room....not sure why I would ever need to be in 1 room with flash & trigger in another .....but hey I can sure give it a try tomorrow at my studio....today is a day off.........but tomorrow I will try to replicate what you need as in other rooms............please describe as I have a whole floor with several rooms to lace flash in and trigger camera wirelessly to see what happens.

Tallboy

Art Scott wrote:

I use THESE and have had no problems but mine is normally out doors or in same room....not sure why I would ever need to be in 1 room with flash & trigger in another .....but hey I can sure give it a try tomorrow at my studio....today is a day off.........but tomorrow I will try to replicate what you need as in other rooms............please describe as I have a whole floor with several rooms to lace flash in and trigger camera wirelessly to see what happens.

I am very interested in your results - this is something I've became interested in as of late. One idea would have been for this shot:



I think it would have been fun to put a couple remote flash units inside the building to illuminate through the open door and cracks in the barnwood siding planks.

nickeverett

I have a Canon 400D (XTi), which doesn't have a PC sync cord input. Does this affect which wireless flash systems I can use?

I have a broken 580 EX (as well as my 580EX II) that will only cost about £80 to fix. Now I have two flashes, I'm interested in remote triggering them. However, my budget is rather small.

adbsgicom

The one's Art showed come with hotshoe adapters. Basically a PC->hotshoe interface for such strobes. You would need this with most remotes. The RP system talks to the IR port on the flash (you strap or velcro it on to the front) and doesn't require the PC port.

InsuredDisaster

Tallboy wrote:

I am very interested in your results - this is something I've became interested in as of late. One idea would have been for this shot:



I think it would have been fun to put a couple remote flash units inside the building to illuminate through the open door and cracks in the barnwood siding planks.

I wonder if you've considered using your flashes to trigger each other. For example, my Nikon SB-800 has a slave mode though you can get slave triggers as well. But have one flash catch your commander unit and then fire towards another flash. A relay if you will. The middle flash isn't really used as any sort of illumination flash, but is just used to trigger some other flash.

time2smile

I use RF602 from ebay, check out the youtube reviews. You can even fire your shutter with it, but will need to transmitters to fire shutter and flash together.

mercphoto

Art Scott wrote:

I use THESE and have had no problems but mine is normally out doors or in same room

Wow that's cheap! Does that do TTL or is it just a trigger?

pathfinder

bike21 wrote:

Ok, so I am wanting to get into using more off camera flash without the limitations of relying on my Nikon strobe's infrared systems. I have began looking at Alienbees Cybersync and of course Pocket Wizards. I am admittedly a bit confused on where to go next and what exactly to purchase. Here are my thoughts/needs...

- need to shoot wireless behind walls and longer distances at times
- use to up 2 off camera flashes
- prefer a portable system as possible without carrying around battery packs

I shoot with Nikon and currently have two SB-600s and one SB-900. I currently don't plan on much studio type stuff, but more outdoor creative light use with athletes/sports/weddings/engagements. So portability is key with any setup I go for. I think as I grow I will look more into bigger/better lighting, but for now I will stick with my SBs. So the question remains, what is the best way to wirelessly control them?

I like and use the Canon remote wireless IR triggers, BUT they will not work reliably outdoors over 30 feet away, and I would doubt they would work with your flash inside a building like in the photograph on this thread.

I have the Ebay triggers, mine works to ~ 25 feet, usually, AND I had lengthened the antenna as directed on the web. It takes special batteries, that I CAN find at Bateries are us, but not at the drugstore late at night. PWs take AA batteries found anywhere, and they last a very long time. The MiniTT does not take a AA battery, as it is too small for AAs.

If you want dead reliable, never fail triggering - indoors, outdoors, behind walls, in closets, it really is hard to beat the basic Pocket Wizards. They even play well with the MiniTT and the Flex TT versions of PWs. Mine have been dropped, walked on, stuffed in bags, and generally mis treated, but they just never have failed me.

I have used optical triggers, IR triggers, eBay triggers, and still do. But the fact is, that the most consistent, most reliable mode I have ever used is the basic PWs. That is why they are so highly regarded in the marketplace, I'll bet.

Long after you have paid for a tool, the real question is do you still reach for it, because it works to your expectation. I'm just sayin'..........

To use Nikon flashes with basic PWs, you will need a PW to PC cord, or a hot shoe that accepts a PC connection. ( Most Canon EOS flashes to not have a PC connection so they need a hot shoe with a female PC connection too ) If you use the FlexTT receivers, they have a hot shoe on them for the flash, so you do not have to mess with an extra cord. That is kind of handy at times. And the FlexTT receivers, in combination with a MiniTT transmitter, offer off camera iTTL/eTTL control of the flash if that is important to you.

But if you are using manual flash, you can buy three Vivitar 285HVs for the price of one Nikon or Canon OEM flash.... Might help pay for PWs.....

kdog

Does anybody know if PW completely fixed the RF problems with the MiniTT and the Flex TT Wjth Canon 580EXII flashes (and 5DMII bodies if that makes a difference)? It seems like such a compelling system, but all the reviews were awful. I've heard mixed feedback on whether they work properly now.

pathfinder

kdog wrote:

Does anybody know if PW completely fixed the RF problems with the MiniTT and the Flex TT Wjth Canon 580EXII flashes (and 5DMII bodies if that makes a difference)? It seems like such a compelling system, but all the reviews were awful. I've heard mixed feedback on whether they work properly now.

Joel, I can verify that the 580exII on a FLex TT with a MiniTT on 5DMkII is not reliable as originally shipped. I think my firmware in the FLex and Mini are up to date also. I do not have the RF shield installed that they are making available.

The standard 580ex seems to work pretty good indoors. Since there is a foot of snow outdoors and it is 25 degrees with the wind at 14 knots, I did not test them out of doors right now. It is on my list for this spring.

The 430EX II was kind of in between - I suspect that it is not always reliable also. I did not test with another camera.

The basic PWs always seem to work just fine - never miss.

adbsgicom

pathfinder wrote:

Joel, I can verify that the 580exII on a FLex TT with a MiniTT on 5DMkII is not reliable as originally shipped. I think my firmware in the FLex and Mini are up to date also. I do not have the RF shield installed that they are making available.

The standard 580ex seems to work pretty good indoors. Since there is a foot of snow outdoors and it is 25 degrees with the wind at 14 knots, I did not test them out of doors right now. It is on my list for this spring.

The 430EX II was kind of in between - I suspect that it is not always reliable also. I did not test with another camera.

The basic PWs always seem to work just fine - never miss.

RadioPoppers (RP) have been solid. Main downside is you have to ship them back for firmware upgrades, of which I've had one to fix an odd issued with 580ex2 being used as C group with 580EX1 as the master (if I switched them, or did all ex2's it worked fine). I noted that it was a long weekend coming up (thanksgiving) and that the round trip of shipping and having new one's shipped out would make me miss my weekend time. They shipped new ones out (held a charge on my CC) and once they arrived, I returned the old ones and they cleared the charge. They paid for all shipping charges. Nice company. Other bit of a nit (don't know if the PW-Mini solves this) but on Canon you can't set just one PX receiver into a manual mode on the flashes, it demands a homogenous environment. If you have the PXjr receiver, you can put that in manual with the rest of the system in e-ttl. Full manual works fine on PX or PXjr systems.

I haven't drop-tested the units either, so can't say how solid the build is. They have fired 100% of the time (other than the bug noted above -- ex1 master, ex2's on a/b/c, ettl, ratio setup)

kdog

pathfinder wrote:

Joel, I can verify that the 580exII on a FLex TT with a MiniTT on 5DMkII is not reliable as originally shipped. I think my firmware in the FLex and Mini are up to date also. I do not have the RF shield installed that they are making available.

The standard 580ex seems to work pretty good indoors. Since there is a foot of snow outdoors and it is 25 degrees with the wind at 14 knots, I did not test them out of doors right now. It is on my list for this spring.

The 430EX II was kind of in between - I suspect that it is not always reliable also. I did not test with another camera.

The basic PWs always seem to work just fine - never miss.

Well, that's a shame. I don't think they would be worth hassling with at this point. Maybe the RadioPoppers if I wanted to go ETTL, but those are pretty expensive. Truth is, I have a set of RF602 for three flashes on order from Ebay for $70. They get great reviews and if they actually work as advertised, it would be hard to justify $600 worth of PWII's to do the same thing. (Unless I was a professional event shooter, then things would be different.) Meanwhile, as I've previously mentioned, my ultra-cheap Wein Peanut optical slave solution is working fine for me in the interim.

Cheers,
-joel

bike21

Wow, tons of good info here! Thanks for all the replies, I need to sit down soon and dig through them all. Been too busy to even read dgrin!

dmmattix

adbsgicom wrote:

I haven't drop-tested the units either, so can't say how solid the build is. They have fired 100% of the time (other than the bug noted above -- ex1 master, ex2's on a/b/c, ettl, ratio setup)

A guy I was shooting with the other night inadvertently did a drop test of a RadioPopper transmitter. It fell 2.5-3 ft onto a tiled concrete floor. The battery cover came off and the battery came out but the transmitter worked fine when re-assembled.

One of the problems with the RadioPopper transmitter that he had was that it did not cinch down on the flash shoe like the Pocket Wizards do (it just slid into the shoe) This most assuredly helped him set up the drop test of his unit.

Mike

nickeverett

Just bought a set of Cactus V4. Considering its £40 for a trigger and two receivers i'm happy with the performance so far.

No miss fires or miss syncs experienced yet.

I've done a few range tests. The flash triggers perfectly through several walls, doors obsticals etc. I'll be going to a park in a couple of days to do a range test (when it stops snowing), so i'll let you know more then.

The only limitation i've encountered is the sync speed. It is quoted at being capable of syncing up to 1/500. 1/200 is the highest sync speed I achieved with a 400d and 580 EXII. The flash still syncs right up to 1/800, however the shutter starts to creep into the frame from 1/200 (even when the flash is set to high sync mode).

GadgetInfinity.com

JohnBiggs

I love the alien bee cybersyncs. They work. Offer a repeater mode for longer distances, aren't very expensive, survive drops, and the transmtter is small and light.

No TTL, but I don't do TTL. I use them to trigger my alienbees, 580s and off brand flashes when I need lots of light. No problems triggering three different brands of light simultaneously.