Book graphic design

rutt

Thoth wrote:

The font is Myriad Pro and the font color is #343334. Personally, I'd love to see a color like this used for text throughout the book. It is much easier on the eyes on very white paper in my opinion.

I used Avant Garde throughout and thought it looked pretty good. No?

I don't think I have control over the font color with booksmart. Anyone know for sure?

rutt

Oh, and I like the triptych a lot, but what about those drop shadows? I didn't use those in the book and in fact I removed some frames...

thoth

rutt wrote:

I used Avant Garde throughout and thought it looked pretty good. No?

I don't think I have control over the font color with booksmart. Anyone know for sure?

I think Avant Garde looks just fine. I used Myriad Pro because A) I like it and I wasn't sure what you were using.

As for the color, this document claims that you can change the font color by selecting it after you have entered it. That's all the verification I can do at the moment, though.

thoth

rutt wrote:

Oh, and I like the triptych a lot, but what about those drop shadows? I didn't use those in the book and in fact I removed some frames...

Hmm, good question. I like drop shadows but understand that not everyone feels that way. The cover is a work of art in itself so we could certainly get away with using them there but nowhere else. Do you dislike them or are you just concerned with continuity?

rutt

thoth wrote:

As for the color, this document claims that you can change the font color by selecting it after you have entered it. That's all the verification I can do at the moment, though.

Oh you're right. Thanks. I'll play around. Kind of a lot of dog work to change it all. Or do you know of a better way than changing every page?

rutt

thoth wrote:

Hmm, good question. I like drop shadows but understand that not everyone feels that way. The cover is a work of art in itself so we could certainly get away with using them there but nowhere else. Do you dislike them or are you just concerned with continuity?

I'm not enough of a graphic designer to handle much complexity, so I try to be very very consistent and keep it very very simple. I welcome higher knowledge in this.

I have kept it very stark, I think. Shouldn't the cover reflect that? ?????

thoth

rutt wrote:

Oh you're right. Thanks. I'll play around. Kind of a lot of dog work to change it all. Or do you know of a better way than changing every page?

This blog mentions a Global Text feature which may allow just that. I can't get the software running right now so I can't confirm, however.

thoth

rutt wrote:

I'm not enough of a graphic designer to handle much complexity, so I try to be very very consistent and keep it very very simple. I welcome higher knowledge in this.

I have kept it very stark, I think. Shouldn't the cover reflect that? ?????

I'm no graphic artist either but I'm forced into the field for web work on occasion. Hopefully someone who knows a little more about the subject chimes in to keep us from hurting ourselves.

I don't think the cover, necessarily, needs to match the content precisely. Of course, we don't want to throw color all over it and have bare white pages in side. The cover should be inviting enough to make you want to look inside so we don't want it too stark.

I'll remove the drop shadows and post both versions side by side. Perhaps that will help.

thoth

With drop shadows...



Without drop shadows...

thoth

The drop shadows do give it a bit of "pop" but I think it would work just fine without.

damonff

Both look great, but I think Rutt is right as far as consistency.

rutt

This is what I got to fit given the aspect ratio of what Thoth gave me. Haven't tried colored text yet.

A little wider slices would mean we could use the horizontal space up and still have a little more space for text. Not sure if that would be a good thing.

thoth

rutt wrote:

This is what I got to fit given the aspect ratio of what Thoth gave me. Haven't tried colored text yet.

A little wider slices would mean we could use the horizontal space up and still have a little more space for text. Not sure if that would be a good thing.

I agree that the aspect ratio is a little unforgiving. I thought about that after the fact, unfortunately. Widening the slices would work ok on the 2nd and 3rd shots but Damon's can only get a bit wider before it starts looking like wasted space. What if we took a little off the top and bottom to broaden the ratio?

thoth

Perhaps we should start with how much space we'd like top and bottom. From there figuring out an appropriate ratio will be easy.

rutt

thoth wrote:

Perhaps we should start with how much space we'd like top and bottom. From there figuring out an appropriate ratio will be easy.

Go for it. You have the aspect ratio and sizes.

thoth

Or, better yet, how about shrinking the image horizontally (maintaining the aspect ratio, of course) by about 15-20%? I think more white space left and right would do it some good. It will also give us more room top and bottom.

rutt

thoth wrote:

Or, better yet, how about shrinking the image horizontally (maintaining the aspect ratio, of course) by about 15-20%? I think more white space left and right would do it some good. It will also give us more room top and bottom.

That's kind of where I started out, but didn't like it and it looked less like your mock-up than what I did. I'll try to reproduce and show you.

I can directly use 300 dpi png of the right size full bleed, so use Avant Garde and you can make the whole cover and I can just use directly. We'll probably need both large and standard landscape sizes.

thoth

rutt wrote:

That's kind of where I started out, but didn't like it and it looked less like your mock-up than what I did. I'll try to reproduce and show you.

I can directly use 300 dpi png of the right size full bleed, so use Avant Garde and you can make the whole cover and I can just use directly. We'll probably need both large and standard landscape sizes.

Alright, sounds good. I'll get it worked up as soon as I can.

CWSkopec

I don't post much in this forum, but I do graphic design for a living (how well I do it may be up for discussion though! ) and just wanted to throw my 2 cents in real quick on a couple things I see...

1. The text on the spine and cover differs (serif font on the spine and san serif on the cover). While folks probably won't be looking at both at the same time like it's displayed here, but it would have a more consistent feeling if the fonts matched (Probably look best using the san serif font on the spine rather than vice versa)
2. On the cover the title is "Unposed / 2009" and on the spine it's "Unposed 2009" These should match, either with or without the slash.
3. This is pure personal feeling, so take it with a grain of salt - The title on the cover almost lines up with the spaces between the photos. I tend to see "almosts" as errors and feel it should either line up or be clear that it isn't meant to line up.
4. Only other thing I see looks like it's been fixed in the latest cover revision, but on the previous two (shadow, no shadow examples) the images are way too close to the edge of the cover. No printer can guarantee 100% accurate cuting everytime, so it's best to give yourself about a quarter of an inch between the edge of the page and anything that's not bleeding off. That way, if the cut isn't perfect, it won't be so apparent. Like I said, latest version looks fine, just throwing that out as a just in case.

Hope that helps! Great looking images for the cover!

thoth

CWSkopec wrote:

I don't post much in this forum, but I do graphic design for a living (how well I do it may be up for discussion though! ) and just wanted to throw my 2 cents in real quick on a couple things I see...

1. The text on the spine and cover differs (serif font on the spine and san serif on the cover). While folks probably won't be looking at both at the same time like it's displayed here, but it would have a more consistent feeling if the fonts matched (Probably look best using the san serif font on the spine rather than vice versa)
2. On the cover the title is "Unposed / 2009" and on the spine it's "Unposed 2009" These should match, either with or without the slash.
3. This is pure personal feeling, so take it with a grain of salt - The title on the cover almost lines up with the spaces between the photos. I tend to see "almosts" as errors and feel it should either line up or be clear that it isn't meant to line up.
4. Only other thing I see looks like it's been fixed in the latest cover revision, but on the previous two (shadow, no shadow examples) the images are way too close to the edge of the cover. No printer can guarantee 100% accurate cuting everytime, so it's best to give yourself about a quarter of an inch between the edge of the page and anything that's not bleeding off. That way, if the cut isn't perfect, it won't be so apparent. Like I said, latest version looks fine, just throwing that out as a just in case.

Hope that helps! Great looking images for the cover!

Chris, thanks for the great response. I agree with all you have mentioned. Just a note about #4: the original examples were just that and I assume some additional whitespace would exist on the cover. Perhaps I should account for that in the actual image, though?

rutt

Thought I fixed the spine bug apparently not. I'll double check. Thanks.

thoth

Ok, one little catch. Avant Garde is not a standard Windows font. There's about a dozen different versions on the web and I'm not certain which I'm looking at. Can anyone point me to a freely available matching download?

Or, can we agree on another good looking font? If you're working on a Mac, Rutt, Myriad Pro is probably a good union (though I know this would require a little more dog work for you).

CWSkopec

thoth wrote:

Chris, thanks for the great response. I agree with all you have mentioned. Just a note about #4: the original examples were just that and I assume some additional whitespace would exist on the cover. Perhaps I should account for that in the actual image, though?

I would account for it in the actual image, that way it'll be much less likely to get screwed up once it's out of your hand!

thoth

CWSkopec wrote:

I would account for it in the actual image, that way it'll be much less likely to get screwed up once it's out of your hand!

I think he said you'd screw it up, Rutt! I'm kidding, of course.

Thanks, Chris. I'll put some extra space in the final copy.

CWSkopec

thoth wrote:

I think he said you'd screw it up, Rutt! I'm kidding, of course.

Thanks, Chris. I'll put some extra space in the final copy.

Sorry, Rutt! Didn't mean to point a finger at you, I haven't really been following along with how you folks are working together... I of course meant out of both of your hands and with the printers!

rutt

Don't worry. I understand about taking the blame for the guys downstream.

thoth

rutt wrote:

Don't worry. I understand about taking the blame for the guys downstream.

You get pissed on a lot when you're downstream but it washes off nicely...

thoth

Ok, here are a couple more markups using Myriad Pro until we get the font situation resolved.

8x10


11x13


Thoughts?

thoth

Haha, I just realized I wrote "Untitled" instead of "Unposed." Damn you, B.D.!!!!!!

rutt

I think this is where I got Avant Garde: http://www.fontyukle.com/en/1,Avant+Garde

I used CE Demi.

thoth

rutt wrote:

I think this is where I got Avant Garde: http://www.fontyukle.com/en/1,Avant+Garde

I used CE Demi.

Great, I'll install it and fix the markups. Thanks.