Assistant with Flash and Softbox

lifeinfocus

I attended a wedding as a guest last Saturday. The wedding photographer is an outstanding local studio photographer. Her work is very artistic.

I watched her work using an assistant holding a flash with a Lite Dome softbox. It was used during the procession in the church and after the wedding ceremony and exclusively during the reception. The only time she used natural light was during the ceremony from the balcony because of flash restrictions.

So, I was wondering:

1) How many if any on this forum use that type of setup - flash on photographer's camera and a second flash with a softbox (interested specifically in the use of a softbox),

2) What the preference is for artistic artificial light versus journalistic natural light wedding photography,

3)Now that more cameras have expanded ISO range is the use of natural light becoming more common and flash much less necessary?

Any comments are appreciated,
Phil

Blurmore

In general this is a pretty old school technique. When I started as an assistant I was a "light man" I carried a Vivitar 283 around held over head about 7-10 feet to the left of the photographer. The photographer had FOC as well but my light was dialed to be main and his as fill. The technique was popular in the film days because most people used one type/speed of film throughout the job and the extra flash helped open up shadows. Now we did not use it during the processional handheld. We would set a back light cutting across the back of the church (usually with barn doors), a 283 on a stand at the front left (bride's side) pointing toward the isle and FOC. During the recessional the light man would spin the 283 as a back light, and the original backlight would be spun to be a second light. I know people who shoot digital currently that use this set-up, but fewer and fewer every year. It creates a unique look that can not be achieved any other way, no matter how good high ISO capabilities get with new DSLRs. I'd say the STYLE is dying rather than the equipment's capabilities are rendering it obsolete.

lifeinfocus

Blurmore wrote:

In general this is a pretty old school technique. When I started as an assistant I was a "light man" I carried a Vivitar 283 around held over head about 7-10 feet to the left of the photographer. The photographer had FOC as well but my light was dialed to be main and his as fill. The technique was popular in the film days because most people used one type/speed of film throughout the job and the extra flash helped open up shadows. Now we did not use it during the processional handheld. We would set a back light cutting across the back of the church (usually with barn doors), a 283 on a stand at the front left (bride's side) pointing toward the isle and FOC. During the recessional the light man would spin the 283 as a back light, and the original backlight would be spun to be a second light. I know people who shoot digital currently that use this set-up, but fewer and fewer every year. It creates a unique look that can not be achieved any other way, no matter how good high ISO capabilities get with new DSLRs. I'd say the STYLE is dying rather than the equipment's capabilities are rendering it obsolete.

Thanks for your response.

If you could elaborate a little on what the current style or styles are that have replaced it?

1. No assistant with flash for main and fill?
2. A flash on a monopod?
3. No flash?
4. Mostly natural light?
5. All natural light?
6. Portable strobe?
7. Some combination?

Thanks again, Phil

Blurmore

lifeinfocus wrote:

Thanks for your response.

If you could elaborate a little on what the current style or styles are that have replaced it?

1. No assistant with flash for main and fill?
2. A flash on a monopod?
3. No flash?
4. Mostly natural light?
5. All natural light?
6. Portable strobe?
7. Some combination?

Thanks again, Phil

Well I'd say there are 2 different situations in play. I'd say for photos of people in motion the style has moved to single FOC with omni-directional on camera bounce light ie. GF sphere. If there is directional light being used it is most likely wireless TTL flash either hand held or light on a stick style. When I was an assistant we used auto thyristors "auto mode" flash, so blue was f8, red f11, yellow f5.6 and so on. People that are using light on a stick OCF are usually using it as an accent and exposing close to ambient which makes it very hard to do if not TTL controlled.

For portraits I see people mounting their cameras on tripods and using a GF sphere. Off camera speed lights, and off camera strobes in a variety of light modifiers and combinations there of. I use on camera flash (as fill and to set WB) and an off camera strobe in a brolly box as a key. Sometimes I "foof" the on camera flash off of the side wall or ceiling bounce. Most of the time I dial back the on camera flash -2/3 to -1 stop to get the right fill effect. I don't use a tripod. I DOUBT there are many people who have an assistant running around all day with a flash in a soft box but I have seen a few photographers who use light on a stick and the assistant holds the stick. I'd also venture to say that the person you saw was using a TTL speed light in a softbox rather than a manual strobe which would involve a lot of trial and error setting or moving in and out to get the light output right.

Blurmore

Just re'read your OP about the softbox. I'd be interested to see her results if she was exclusively using the off camera flash in soft box and no FOC. I could see potential for this arrangement really missing the mark unless she was exposing very close to ambient and only using the OCF for a little pop. If this was the case I'm not sure how effective having the flash in a soft box really is as a softbox allows shadows to be softer, but an exposure very close to ambient wouldn't have much in the way of shadows anyway.

lifeinfocus

I hope to see the results too. If I do, I will come back with some answers to your questions.

Thanks again for your informative response.
Phil

mmmatt

Yeah... the flash holding assistant is getting to be a lost technique but it is still done. Less often done with manual strobes and more often with ETTL these days. the fact that she is primarily a studio shooter is very telling here as this is a similar technique to studio photography. Back in the day, when you were shooting only 10 or 12 rolls of 36, the manual lighting techniques were better if done properly and since you were saving each shot for a keeper the setup time wasn't such a big deal. In today's world where people are looking for more of the creative "in the moment" type photography, the setup involved makes using manual studio style flash techniques a dying art. For good reason though! Technology has given us other methods that allow for more focus on shooting and less on lighting. ETTL, chimping, unlimited shots, RAW processing, endlessly variable iso, quality high-iso, and Digital darkrooms being the obvious ones.

There are still people who insist that ambient light is better than strobes, but those guys are fading too. Ambient light is easier to use but harder to find... REALLY good ambient light work is an art in itself. I prefer the BEST light and usually that is the light I make but in varying combinations with available light. Ideal conditions like a big bright church or a nice diffused sky scream for ambient though, and I'll hapily turn the flash off for that! The ideal in many or even most situations is a blend of ambient and flash. Tenoverthenose is VERY good at achieving this and will hopefully chime in with his opinions. He also shoots in a more glamor style than I or many so his views on all of this will be no doubt far different than mine. Studio lighting techniques are key to achieving his look. Zoomer also is a master at both the studio techniques and finding great available light. Matt Seville is one of those guys that shoots almost everything ambient and he would have far different (and no doubt strong) opinions contrary to what I'm saying!

Jason mentioned "fooshing" and that is a term coined by the awesome Dennis Reggie for side wall bouncing. Dennis is a $50K per gig wedding photographer and is also a Canon "Seeker of Light" which means he is sponsored by Canon and gets to test a lot of their new products and often speaks on their behalf. I personally feel that side wall bouncing is THE way to light almost anything. Sometimes an off camera ETTL flash is better, and sometimes you need to break out the studio strobes, but I personally have gotten to the point to where I side wall bounce about 90% of the indoor stuff I shoot. Because of high iso, ettl, raw, and the digital darkroom you can do things with an on-camera flash that simply could not be done even just a few years ago. I preach this method every chance I get and probably sound like a broken record, but that is my $.02 on the matter.

Matt

Swartzy

For outdoor stuff, time permitting, I drag my Vagabond, an AB800 and beauty dish. I love the look and affords so many variables mixing with ambient. Indoors for formals, yes, I set up the AB's but for the creative stuff, I'm typically bouncing the light in ETTL...side walls, ceiling, my hand, whatever....sometimes the floor for unique lighting looks.

zoomer

I use the softbox with assistant a lot outside but never indoors.

Indoors I use a bracket with diffuser and bounce off the ceiling mainly, at high iso.

I use the softbox indoor for group shots but don't need anyone to hold it for that.

However a guy named Ed Pingol in Ca does amazing things with the light on a stick and assistant, I don't even think he uses diffusers.
If you have not seen his flash work, take a look, it is amazing.

VayCayMom

I was a guest at a wedding that took place in the main church at Notre Dame, Indiana. I was surprised that flash was allowed during the ceremony.

At the reception in a country club ,I asked one of the 2 photographers about their lighting set up. They had on camera flash no diffuser. I could barely hear him over the band but they had I believe 2 lights set up in the main dance area/bride and groom table, up on the walls somewhere. And he used the on camera flash without a diffuser in order to get catch lights. Aperture was about 5, shutter speed 60. There were huge, huge windows all along one side. He told me how to expose for that in order to not get a pure black background, but I couldn't hear every word.
Ho do you do that? Any comments on the lighting set up they used, no diffuser.

AND I am getting ready to shoot my first wedding in July. The reception will be in a home, that I not yet visited. Could I do the whole reception using on camera flash, a gary fong sphere and bounce the light off walls, ceiling?

The rehearsal dinner was in a on campus building with a high dark blue ceiling in places, but lot's of white walls too. I shot that just for fun, with the bride's permission, no photographers were present. I used my Nikon d 700 and my 50mm 1.4 lens. They turned out pretty decent, I'll post a few when they are finished.

this is a great topic right now!!

tenoverthenose

VayCayMom wrote:

...Ho do you do that? Any comments on the lighting set up they used, no diffuser.

Shooting with a diffuser sends light all over the place, wether or not that place is in the frame of your photo. In other words, it sends light back behind you when you are not shooting behind you. Hopefully, using a diffuser (as planned) there is something back there to bounce off of.

In the case of these photographers, they exposed for ambient or outside the windows with the camera and set the flashes to expose for the interior. If you set your on camera flash to be a stop or two below the "room" flashes, it will only provide a little fill light and reflect off of the eyes.

JohnBiggs

For weddings I use shoot through umbrellas and speedlights for the formals only. For reception I place speedlights on stands in opposite corners of the room. I aim the flash toward the ceiling pointed at the center of the room and I place gobos on them to keep the light from directly entering my lens. I do this because most receptions are very dark and I don't want to go to Iso 3200. During key moments, I'll grab one of the light stands and reposition it, such as cake cutting.

For everything I keep a flash on the camera for fill.