R1800 Horrors

Aiki Frank

Hi All,

I'm new and figured I'd start out my life as a DGrinner by crying for help. :bow

I've been using an Epson R1800 for a few years. When it works, it's fabulous. I just installed a new CIS system (my old one bit the dust) and it delivers ink just fine. The new system uses the same ink as the old system. When I do a nozzle check, it looks excellent.

The problem is that now that I've installed the new CIS all of my prints look like they've been colorized. They all seem to have completely the wrong profile -- except for plain paper. Some part of a print -- for instance, a fancy border -- can be beautiful, but the rest of the print will be horrid.

I'm using a new computer with Windows 7. I've got the latest drivers and have tried every type of combination of profiles and paper I can think of, even those I know are wrong. They all come out the same -- awful (except for plain paper).

I'm using Adobe PS, Illus. and InDesign CS3. All return the same results.

When I print, I go through the usual routine. Go to color management, have the computer control color management, select the proper profile, select the printer, select the correct paper there and turn off printer color management.

I am completely at a loss about what's going on. I really need the printer to work! Anyone? Please?

Deacon

Try turning off color management completely. I was having a similar problem. Make SURE you have the most current Epson driver.

Deacon

Aiki Frank

Deacon wrote:

Try turning off color management completely. I was having a similar problem. Make SURE you have the most current Epson driver.

Deacon

Deacon,

Thanks for the suggestion. I'll try that when I'm with the printer tomorrow. I know that I can turn color management off in PS, I'm not sure about Illus. or InDesign.

I just reinstalled my drivers today from the Epson site. I'll check again to make sure I've got the right ones.

ziggy53

What happens if you print to PDF and then from PDF to the R1800? (Use the PDF to proof, in other words.)

Are you saying that the problems started with the new continuous ink system or with the new computer?

Aiki Frank

ziggy53 wrote:

What happens if you print to PDF and then from PDF to the R1800? (Use the PDF to proof, in other words.)

Are you saying that the problems started with the new continuous ink system or with the new computer?

I'll be with the printer again tomorrow and I'll find out about printing from a PDF.

As to whether the problem started after the new computer or the new CIS, 'tis a good question. But, unfortunately, for all intents and purposes, they're simultaneous. But right now, I'm thinking that the ink system is working OK. I can print on plain paper and the nozzle checks look fine.

ziggy53

Borrow a laptop/desktop that has an earlier operating system and drivers and the Adobe applications you have. Test the same image files on the printer to test the ink delivery system.

If you tried to use the original print drivers, that came with the printer, on Windows 7, and then updated to the latest drivers, that may be causing some of the problem. Epson has very explicit directions about "not" installing older drivers on Windows 7. You may have to remove the drivers and software first, then revert the computer to an earlier date (before installing the old drivers and software) and then follow the instructions here:

http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/support/SupportWindows7.jsp

You may even have to reformat the system drive and reinstall Windows 7 to get rid of all interactions from older drivers.

How are you connecting to the printer? Direct? (USB, Firewire) Network?

Aiki Frank

Ziggy and Deacon,

To answer your and questions and respond to your suggestions --

Ziggy, I couldn't make that Epson link work -- it said that my session had expired and gave me a 404 error.

I printed using my old laptop that I have printed successfully from many times. Same problems.

On my new computer, I printed to PDF and turned off all color management. No improvement.

The new computer has never had old drivers. I installed the Windows 7 64-bit driver set directly from the Epson site. I am connecting to the printer via USB.

One little bit more of information: When I use a profile for glossy paper, the printer puts far too much ink onto the paper.

This really seems like a driver problem to me, but I just can't figure it out. I think I'm going to uninstall the drivers (again) and reinstall. I'll see what that does.

This is really driving me nutty!

Aiki Frank

I Uninstalled the Drivers
and reinstalled them. Doing so made no difference whatsoever.

Sigh.

ziggy53

It sounds like you are doing everything correctly. Have you tried printing an old image that has worked properly in the past?

Aiki Frank

ziggy53 wrote:

It sounds like you are doing everything correctly. Have you tried printing an old image that has worked properly in the past?

I have printed an old file on the same paper with the same profiles that I have been successful with. The results are uniformly terrible. That's on my new and old computers.

One file I just tried printing is actually for VIP cards. They have print along with some simple graphics. They have a little red print along with black print and a blue gradient in the background. The red print looks perfect. The rest is blurry and there's puddling throughout the black print.

ziggy53

Aiki Frank wrote:

I have printed an old file on the same paper with the same profiles that I have been successful with. The results are uniformly terrible. That's on my new and old computers.

One file I just tried printing is actually for VIP cards. They have print along with some simple graphics. They have a little red print along with black print and a blue gradient in the background. The red print looks perfect. The rest is blurry and there's puddling throughout the black print.

Unfortunately, I think you have isolated the problem to the printer itself as the most likely culprit.

Aiki Frank

ziggy53 wrote:

Unfortunately, I think you have isolated the problem to the printer itself as the most likely culprit.

Either the printer or the ink system. I'll be on the phone to the CIS manufacturer first thing Monday. I might just go out and purchase a set of cartridges and try the printer with the originals and see what happens. But, first I'll call the CIS folks.

dbd

Aiki Frank wrote:

Ziggy and Deacon,
...
One little bit more of information: When I use a profile for glossy paper, the printer puts far too much ink onto the paper.
...

I've used a R1800 for years, but without formal color management. I've always set the paper type (glossy/matte/plain for ink quantity) in the driver "properties" menu. Does a color profile set this in the printer driver so I can stop doing that when I learn to use color profiles?

Dale B. Dalrymple
http://dbdimages.com

Aiki Frank

dbd wrote:

I've used a R1800 for years, but without formal color management. I've always set the paper type (glossy/matte/plain for ink quantity) in the driver "properties" menu. Does a color profile set this in the printer driver so I can stop doing that when I learn to use color profiles?

DBD,

As you know, I'm new to all of this, so I'm not the best person to answer questions.

I'm really not sure where the "properties" menu is that you're referring to. Precisely where is it? PC/Mac?

dbd

Aiki Frank wrote:

DBD,

As you know, I'm new to all of this, so I'm not the best person to answer questions.

I'm really not sure where the "properties" menu is that you're referring to. Precisely where is it? PC/Mac?

On a PC, when I select Print in an application, a Print window comes up to allow me to select which printer. When I have selected a printer, I can select the Preferences button on the Print window to display printing options. The options I use select paper size, paper type (gloss,matte,plain,etc) and print function (text,text with image, photo, best photo). Differnt levels of printer have different sets of the print functions The paper type function seems to be what tells the print driver about how much ink to use, or at least that has been my interpretation. If I print film with the matte paper type setting, I get gobs of ink in puddles.

Dale B. Dalrymple

Aiki Frank

Color Management & the R1800
Dale,

I understand what you’re saying. Being a relative beginner, I hope actually experienced folks chime in and correct any of my mistakes. In other words, heed my instruction at your own risk! Though I haven’t looked, there must be more than a few threads on DG that discuss color management issues.

For ease of discussion, let’s assume that we’re talking about a recent version of Photoshop. When you open a print dialogue box in Photoshop, you’ll be able to select whether the dialogue box is for output or color management. If you select color management, you’ll be given a bunch of options, including “Color Handling” and “Printer Profile.”

Under Color Handling, you can select whether Photoshop or your printer performs color management. You can also select no color management. If you select Photoshop to handle color management, you can then select the printer profile which Photoshop applies. Take a look at this list, it has a lot of choices.

If you go here, you will be able to download Epson’s ICC profiles for its paper and the R1800. Epson says, “In most cases, these custom ICC profiles will provide more accurate color and black and white print quality than with the standard profiles already shipping with every printer.” Many professional paper companies have ICC profiles available on the net for free. Ink companies also provide ICC profiles for their ink and different combinations of papers and printers.

When you have Photoshop handle color management, you need to turn off color management in the printer. To do that, while in the Photoshop print dialogue, select “Page Setup.” This will take you go to the printer preference dialogue you have been using. In the advanced dialogue box, you will see a box entitled “Color Management.” Select ICM and off (no color management). In the printer dialogue box, you still need to select the correct paper.

Of course, if you want the printer to perform color management, then select “Printer Manages Color” in Photoshop. You would then select whichever settings you want the printer to use.

What I am wondering is whether you have been turning off color management in Photoshop in all the time you’ve been using your R1800. If not, you’ve been dealing with all sorts of conflicts when the printer and program are both thinking they are managing color. Doing so will give you all sorts of bad results, including puddling in your prints, making the process of printing even more “interesting” than it usually is.

I hope this has been useful or, at the very least, coherent.