just wondering what ya'll think...

e mari ad terrame mari ad terram Registered Users Posts: 54 Big grins
edited May 11, 2010 in Weddings
I apologize if this has come up in the forum before...

I shot a wedding as a second with a friend, and her deal with the couple was that they got all their images on a DVD. Now before we get into if one should or shouldn't give out full images... Here's the rub.

The bride received a DVD of finished, edited, complete images. She has taken that DVD and proceeded to edit further with her own sub-par PS skills, and only posts or shares her edits...

Whattup with that? :scratch
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Comments

  • MalteMalte Registered Users Posts: 1,181 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    As long as she no longer passes it off as being your or your friend's work, I see no problem for this customer. It would compare to further cropping a print, or putting it in a collage.

    Malte
  • LeeHowellLeeHowell Registered Users Posts: 99 Big grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    I'm assuming the contract (if one existed) did not contain a limited copyright? If that's the case, then there's really not much you or he can do except learn a lesson.

    Heck - I wouldn't mind giving my clients the original RAW files, but that's because it clearly stats in my contract that any/all editing needs to come through me first. They can crop/print/post the images I provide them, but I don't want someone else running my photos through 50 photoshop filters and 20 actions and then submitting it in some contest and calling it my work.

    I would put the files on a disc, hand them off and then just make sure everyone reads the fine print next time...deal.gif
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  • Darren Troy CDarren Troy C Registered Users Posts: 1,927 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    Malte wrote: »
    As long as she no longer passes it off as being your or your friend's work, I see no problem for this customer. It would compare to further cropping a print, or putting it in a collage.

    Malte

    TOTALLY agree with this!! If you're going to do it and you feel the need to post your work, you better make sure to credit YOURSELF, not me!!!! My edits are precisely that. Further "refinement" is a choice that you make as a client and has zero creative input on my behalf. In fact, any further tweeking usually results in an image that has less than desirable consequences. Noise, Composition, etc. The product I deliver is the final decision from bride and/or groom only after they have seen preliminaries. That way, any constructive, or maybe in this case...DEstructive...editing is the sole responsibility of the client. Period.

    And as a side note, I always inform them that any of their images I deem necessary can/will be used by me for portfolio building and subsequent dual postings could/will occur on social media sites such as Facebook, Twitter, etc. So, if differing images appear, my watermarked image will always contain the original edit that they received as a final product.
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  • SamSam Registered Users Posts: 7,419 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    e mari ad terram wrote: »
    I apologize if this has come up in the forum before...

    I shot a wedding as a second with a friend, and her deal with the couple was that they got all their images on a DVD. Now before we get into if one should or shouldn't give out full images... Here's the rub.

    The bride received a DVD of finished, edited, complete images. She has taken that DVD and proceeded to edit further with her own sub-par PS skills, and only posts or shares her edits...

    Whattup with that? headscratch.gif

    Is there a question here?

    Sam
    www.samlinvillephotography.com
  • ian408ian408 Administrators Posts: 21,939 moderator
    edited May 3, 2010
    Sam wrote: »
    Is there a question here?

    Sam

    There was. Apparently others have offered their opinion in response.
    Moderator Journeys/Sports/Big Picture :: Need some help with dgrin?
  • smurfysmurfy Registered Users Posts: 343 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    I expressly forbid any further edits beyond cropping in my contract, not even text to say "thank you" is permitted unless it is not overlayed on the image, but placed beyond the border of it. To me, a client or anyone else doing further edits to my work is not at all like cropping or making a collage.
  • QarikQarik Registered Users Posts: 4,959 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    e mari ad terram wrote: »
    I apologize if this has come up in the forum before...

    I shot a wedding as a second with a friend, and her deal with the couple was that they got all their images on a DVD. Now before we get into if one should or shouldn't give out full images... Here's the rub.

    The bride received a DVD of finished, edited, complete images. She has taken that DVD and proceeded to edit further with her own sub-par PS skills, and only posts or shares her edits...

    Whattup with that? headscratch.gif

    I can't comment aesthitically until I see the before/after shots. As far altering the images..depends on what is in the contract I suppose.
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  • MalteMalte Registered Users Posts: 1,181 Major grins
    edited May 4, 2010
    smurfy wrote: »
    I expressly forbid any further edits beyond cropping in my contract, not even text to say "thank you" is permitted unless it is not overlayed on the image, but placed beyond the border of it. To me, a client or anyone else doing further edits to my work is not at all like cropping or making a collage.

    You don't think that cropping, in some way, is recomposing the image? I for one think that the same image, cropped in two different ways, can look very different.

    Malte
  • smurfysmurfy Registered Users Posts: 343 Major grins
    edited May 4, 2010
    You don't think that cropping, in some way, is recomposing the image? I for one think that the same image, cropped in two different ways, can look very different.

    Yes, you're right. But it's fine with me if they crop their family photo to print it as an 8 by 10 instead of an 8 by 12.
  • WachelWachel Registered Users Posts: 448 Major grins
    edited May 6, 2010
    There are different forms of rights management. You need to expressly state what can and can't be done with your photos. This needs to be explained when the contract is signed.

    You can easily state that no derivative works are allowed and only cropping for framing is okay.
    Michael

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    Michael Wachel Photography

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  • mutti_wilsonmutti_wilson Registered Users Posts: 33 Big grins
    edited May 10, 2010
    While I generally don't like the typical "edits" people do, I think it's something we have to live with being in the digital age. Saying your images can't be played with is like telling someone after you've done a remodel on their home that they can never repaint the walls.

    If the people are happy and have paid and don't use the images to "market" your name, who cares what they do?
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  • PrettyKittyPrettyKitty Registered Users Posts: 57 Big grins
    edited May 11, 2010
    Contract Language
    e mari ad terram wrote: »
    I apologize if this has come up in the forum before...

    The bride received a DVD of finished, edited, complete images. She has taken that DVD and proceeded to edit further with her own sub-par PS skills, and only posts or shares her edits...

    Whattup with that? headscratch.gif

    I got married last month, and I haven't received my wedding photos back, but I already know what the contract states. Under the photographer's signature it said "With this signature, I (PHOTOGRAPHER) is releasing shared rights to the client above for personal printing only." During our engagement session, I clarified this. She had taken a picture of my blackberry and I was curious if she minded if I photoshop one of the engagement photos into the blackberry screen of this photo. She didn't want me to do it, but she did the work for me! :)

    So I'd recommend some clause similar to that if it really bothers you. But I'd probably make it even more clear by specifically stating that no further edits can be made to the file (unless you want to specifiy conditions, etc.?)
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