Question about lighting for you all

ckasparckaspar Registered Users Posts: 154 Major grins
edited May 10, 2010 in Accessories
Let me preface this by saying I know nothing about studio lighting other than when you press the shutter the strobes go off. LOL

With that said, I am thinking of getting something small to start with just so I can play around. I saw this on ebay and wanted to get opinions:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360255813349&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

I am not expecting this to be a great setup considering the price but I thought it would be a good starting point for me to get acquainted with studio lighting or at least an example you guys could use to point me in the right direction.

I look forward to your thoughts.

Thanks in advance.
http://www.rncfoto.com/

Comments

  • Art ScottArt Scott Registered Users Posts: 8,959 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    I would not want to rely on those for any paid work. I will not recommend anything less than Alien Bees from Paul Buff in Nashville Tn.........I know Ziggy uses Flash Points from Adorama and it is their house brand.....however i see them as generic flashes because you have no idea who makes them and knowing something about the manufacturer is something I like to do........another deal with the ebay ones you linked to........180 wS is very little.....I have sunpak 622 flash units (off camera battery operated) that are lots more powerful ........

    I suggest that you hold off until you can buy something that if you decide that studio work or that photography is not for you, that you can resell and get a good portion of your investment back, these flash units have no resell value down the road.
    "Genuine Fractals was, is and will always be the best solution for enlarging digital photos." ....Vincent Versace ... ... COPYRIGHT YOUR WORK ONLINE ... ... My Website

  • ckasparckaspar Registered Users Posts: 154 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    Sounds good, thanks for the feedback.

    What would you suggest as a starter kit to get rolling?
    http://www.rncfoto.com/
  • Art ScottArt Scott Registered Users Posts: 8,959 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    ckaspar wrote: »
    Sounds good, thanks for the feedback.

    What would you suggest as a starter kit to get rolling?


    That depends on how serious you and what your goals are......personally I donot like starter kits......I always suggest buying the best you can afford.....so I will offer this:

    1- no less than 2 lights same brand same model and when you add to it keep it same brand and model.

    2- the most power you can possibly afford (AB 800's or 1600 if you can...)

    3- the reason for #1 is that if you are on a location shoot you do not waste time trying to find the 2 back lights and that 1 super powerful main and the other 2not so powerful fills.......if everything is the same you can grab and go.....the more you have to decide which light goes where makes you look less profession.......this was advice give n to me by Peter Gowland back in around 1982 ................

    4- light modifiers - Paul Buff / Alien Bee PLM System....some have been on back order for months but....you'll not bet better customer service form any other company....maybe equal from B&H .........

    If you just cannot swing the PLM system then some less expensive stuff off ebay.....as a matter of fact that set you linked to above the stands and modiefiers would be a good set to start with and d sell all the lights and gels (anything that justs fits the flashes) on ebay to recoup a bit.
    "Genuine Fractals was, is and will always be the best solution for enlarging digital photos." ....Vincent Versace ... ... COPYRIGHT YOUR WORK ONLINE ... ... My Website

  • ckasparckaspar Registered Users Posts: 154 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    Ya, by starter kit I meant what do I need as opposed to buying cheap then moving up. I am all for buying the best, believe me, but sometimes wifey says no. Laughing.gif My thought was to get a simple set and take shots of friends and family just for fun, see how much I like it then decide if stepping up to the bigger stuff made more sense for me. It would also help wifey if she saw that it was worth it.

    My thought was kind of what you suggested, buy the cheapo setup and get better lights. It appears I will have most everything else in that kit. Even if I have to wait for a few months to get the better lights at least I can get used to setting up lighting and get an idea of what does what.

    Thanks for the info.
    http://www.rncfoto.com/
  • Art ScottArt Scott Registered Users Posts: 8,959 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    Sounds like a plan.......with that or any set up you need 2 more items.....I good (not expensive) incident flash meter and also a RF flash trigger so you are not tied to the lights by pc cables.....

    The flash meters on ebay i would recommend are: Wein, Minolta, Sekonic, Polaris, Gossen, shepard......I am not sure if all these brands are at the link I gave....it is just the brands I have used and trust....ask any seller if you can return if it does not work properly....if no return do not buy...............

    Good Luck
    "Genuine Fractals was, is and will always be the best solution for enlarging digital photos." ....Vincent Versace ... ... COPYRIGHT YOUR WORK ONLINE ... ... My Website

  • angevin1angevin1 Registered Users Posts: 3,403 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    Thread where this question was asked before I think: Here
    tom wise
  • angevin1angevin1 Registered Users Posts: 3,403 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2010
    ckaspar wrote: »
    Ya, by starter kit I meant what do I need as opposed to buying cheap then moving up. I am all for buying the best, believe me, but sometimes wifey says no. Laughing.gif My thought was to get a simple set and take shots of friends and family just for fun, see how much I like it then decide if stepping up to the bigger stuff made more sense for me. It would also help wifey if she saw that it was worth it.

    My thought was kind of what you suggested, buy the cheapo setup and get better lights. It appears I will have most everything else in that kit. Even if I have to wait for a few months to get the better lights at least I can get used to setting up lighting and get an idea of what does what.

    Thanks for the info.

    I see where you are coming from completely, as I have traveled a near similar road in these past two years....retrospect: buy the best you can buy first! Even if it is just one light and one modifier. if it is a Good to great system, it'll hold it's value enough to sell if the wife demands that. And if you keep it, it'll serve you well on into the future as you add.

    You can work with one light and a reflector and learn and shoot as much as you need to...with just one light!

    One Light
    735951587_DiGSR-M.jpg
    tom wise
  • henryphenryp Registered Users Posts: 144 Major grins
    edited May 4, 2010
    @ckaspar: Perhaps our Lighting Resources can help you get your feet under you. IMO @angevin1 makes a good point. The more you can learn with one light, which will become your "main" light when you add more, the better equipped you'll be.

    Most of us who do traditional portraiture use main and fill lights to illuminate the subject's face, moderate shadows vs highlights and create the impression the face is round even though photos are two-dimensional. The main light produces twice as much power as the fill and is set above the subject an at an angle. The fill is usually placed as close to the camera-subject axis as possible. Some areas are lit by the fill and main together (x light + 2x light = 3x light) and some by the fill alone (x light), so this is called 3:1 lighting. Then, depending on circumstances on adds a hair light and back light to separate the subject from his/her surroundings.

    While they concentrate on on-camera lights, there's much to be learned at Strobist.
    Henry Posner
    B&H Photo-Video
  • ckasparckaspar Registered Users Posts: 154 Major grins
    edited May 4, 2010
    Sounds good! I read through the link you gave me to your site and it opened my eyes to how the lights works. It makes sense now.

    So with that said, I guess I should look for an Alien Bees 800 on/with a stand and an umbrella to start. Plus a wireless trigger as in the link above. Now, is a PC necessary for that unit to work or would it work the same if I had just the transmitter mounted on the camera and the receiver plugged into the light?
    http://www.rncfoto.com/
  • angevin1angevin1 Registered Users Posts: 3,403 Major grins
    edited May 4, 2010
    ckaspar wrote: »
    Sounds good! I read through the link you gave me to your site and it opened my eyes to how the lights works. It makes sense now.

    So with that said, I guess I should look for an Alien Bees 800 on/with a stand and an umbrella to start. Plus a wireless trigger as in the link above. Now, is a PC necessary for that unit to work or would it work the same if I had just the transmitter mounted on the camera and the receiver plugged into the light?

    Depends. What kind of camera are you using and what type of work do you want to do?

    I think you mentioned in-house stuff, so yes, do the Bee thing. Personally I like Flash-guns for portability...

    And yes, the PB trans/recv set work with it as described. Though it'll also fire off of your flash in manual~
    tom wise
  • henryphenryp Registered Users Posts: 144 Major grins
    edited May 5, 2010
    ckaspar wrote: »
    So with that said, I guess I should look for an Alien Bees 800 on/with a stand and an umbrella to start. Plus a wireless trigger as in the link above. Now, is a PC necessary for that unit to work or would it work the same if I had just the transmitter mounted on the camera and the receiver plugged into the light?

    Umbrellas are very non-directional light modifiers. If I was doing one-light portraits I'd probably use one, but to learn to "see" light, particularly strobe, you should consider experimenting with an unmodified light.

    You can start by connecting the strobe's PC cord to the one on your camera, if it has one. If it does not, a Nikon AS-15 converts your camera's hot shoe tp a PC contact.
    Henry Posner
    B&H Photo-Video
  • ckasparckaspar Registered Users Posts: 154 Major grins
    edited May 5, 2010
    Sounds good. That will be put on the "nice to have" list for now. Laughing.gif

    Thanks again everyone.
    http://www.rncfoto.com/
  • Art ScottArt Scott Registered Users Posts: 8,959 Major grins
    edited May 5, 2010
    one thing to remeber is that some studio strobes have a huge sync voltage and can damage your camer...as do some of the older hotshoe and handlemount flashes.....if you decide to go with a pc cord connection then you need a SAFE SYNC ADAPTER to make sure that the sync voltage does not damage the camera......the reason I fist suggested the RF flash triggers I did was very simply they are around $30 less than Wein Safe Syncs.....and it makes the studio area safe by keeping the cords and cables on the floor to a minimum....(only your power cable).
    "Genuine Fractals was, is and will always be the best solution for enlarging digital photos." ....Vincent Versace ... ... COPYRIGHT YOUR WORK ONLINE ... ... My Website

  • ckasparckaspar Registered Users Posts: 154 Major grins
    edited May 5, 2010
    Ya, I like the wireless solution. That is definitely where I will be going on that front.
    http://www.rncfoto.com/
  • HeppehHeppeh Registered Users Posts: 8 Beginner grinner
    edited May 10, 2010
    Hey there,
    Some other suggestions that don't seem to be mentioned here yet is off camera flash units. I know that studio strobes are great (have several myself), but they bring with them all the necessary stuff to make them perform well (elinchrom skyport wireless, softboxes, umbrellas, backgrounds, flags, booms, stands, sand bags, wide open spaces, etc...).

    I don't think that you mentioned what type of system you are using. Canon, Nikon, other? Many of the TTL flash units will produce studio quality without as much initial cost or the need for extra items to make them work. They allow you to upgrade (buy more flashes) as necessary, and with a little training in technic (check out the Scott Kelby books) you can work wonders with just one or two units. A flash unit (off camera) in a small softbox with a fill reflector can work magic if you know how to work it. Flash units are much more portable for on-location shoots as well. Gels are a snap and adjusting your light intensity is as simple as pushing a button on the master flash unit. Just a thought. Of course, as you get further along with studio work you will want the strobes that recycle quickly, chirp at you, have temp balance, fans, etc...

    As far as strobes go...check out this basic setup from Photogenic at B&H http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/404366-REG/Photogenic_907287_StudioMax_Portrait_Studio_Two.html

    Not the top of the line, but I've used these for years as inexpensive back up strobes. Although I don't have any Alien Bees I hear that they are great inexpensive units as well. Have fun!
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