HELP - How to negotiate Promo work with a club?

PhotosbyKW

I'm in a situation where I might be meeting with the owner of a local club about doing some Promotional work.

The only problem is that...

well basically, I have never negotiated a deal with a club before, and I'm hoping for any insight into examples of how this type of thing typically works?

I'd like to have some sort of general idea of what to "shoot for" - pardon the pun, before I meet with this guy.

I don't want to scare him away, but don't want to shoo away an oportunity, if there is one awaiting my request.

Any help will be most appreciated..

KAW.

PhotosbyKW

No ideas huh?

Well to give yall a better idea of what I'm talking about- the club is about a half hr. away, and so far- he has only mentioned shots done at the club, but perhaps doing coverage for some of their events. I really don't have any more details yet and was just unsure of what types of options that other people typically try to work out when negotiating with clubs? I really have no idea of what terms to even suggest for this type of thing.
It really is no trouble for me to pack my gear with me and do formal shots at their location, if need be, as I do a lot of location stuff and my stuff is usually stored in portable chests anyway.

Some random thoughts:

Would you charge by event, by hour, by subject?

Would you offer Prints, CD, and should I try to work out a deal with the owner for usage rights?

Would the owner pay, or have me make profits indipendently?

Should I offer some sort of trade, or temp rate for a set amount of time?

Should I offer to not charge for an event for a trial and see how they like my performance?


Things like that.

Snowgirl

PhotosbyKW wrote: »

No ideas huh?

Well to give yall a better idea of what I'm talking about- the club is about a half hr. away, and so far- he has only mentioned shots done at the club, but perhaps doing coverage for some of their events. I really don't have any more details yet and was just unsure of what types of options that other people typically try to work out when negotiating with clubs? I really have no idea of what terms to even suggest for this type of thing.
It really is no trouble for me to pack my gear with me and do formal shots at their location, if need be, as I do a lot of location stuff and my stuff is usually stored in portable chests anyway.

Some random thoughts:

Would you charge by event, by hour, by subject?

Would you offer Prints, CD, and should I try to work out a deal with the owner for usage rights?

Would the owner pay, or have me make profits indipendently?

Should I offer some sort of trade, or temp rate for a set amount of time?

Should I offer to not charge for an event for a trial and see how they like my performance?


Things like that.

What kind of club? Nightclub? Sports club?

I definitely would NOT do ANYTHING for nothing. The club owner is making money and your services presumably will help to enhance his business so, of course, you should expect to be paid.

The first question is - who wants the pictures and how will they be used? That helps to determine what you should be charging.
Or is he expecting you take pictures of patrons and then sell them to them? Good luck with that - wouldn't count on making much that way - and some people take offense at having their picture taken in a social situation unless they've requested it.

Hope you have a LOT of liability insurance for that type of situation.

Your initial email was quite vague which is probably why you didn't get any responses.

PhotosbyKW

Snowgirl wrote: »

What kind of club? Nightclub? Sports club?

I definitely would NOT do ANYTHING for nothing. The club owner is making money and your services presumably will help to enhance his business so, of course, you should expect to be paid.

The first question is - who wants the pictures and how will they be used? That helps to determine what you should be charging.
Or is he expecting you take pictures of patrons and then sell them to them? Good luck with that - wouldn't count on making much that way - and some people take offense at having their picture taken in a social situation unless they've requested it.

Hope you have a LOT of liability insurance for that type of situation.

Your initial email was quite vague which is probably why you didn't get any responses.

I eo appologise for the vague initial post. I just don't have much info, other than that. I am supposed to meet with the owner to talk more about what he has in mind, but I didn't have much in the way of knowledge of what types of arrangements were typically set up, before I talked with him.

The town is quite small, and so is the club. It has been around for a few years under different owners and names but has flopped each time. There is not a lot that goes on in the town and not too much traffic from the younger generation, but this guy seems to be working pretty hard to pull people in from other directions. There is a decent sized dance floor inside and a few pool tables, but for instance, he had a boxing ring set up the other day before normal hrs, and also scheduled the place to be open during daylight hrs. for a BBQ as a pitstop for a multi-club bike rally that was traveling through for a charity drive. I don't know how much there is to be had at the moment, but I think that if he doesn't go bottoms-up, that it might be a good place for meeting other potential customers. I don't want to scare him away by appearing greedy in this low-income area, but I'd like to be in a position to take advantage of an opportunity if there is a chance that I hear it knocking.

starlight

Get a feel for what he's looking for first, and an idea of what he's looking to spend. If he's basically looking for free work, then it's your call... On the other hand, if he understands the value of what you can provide (good quality photos he can use to promote his business), then hopefully he'll want you *onside* so to speak. Don't let the unknown value of unknown future work cause you to go out on a limb now where you're expected to provide valuable work for nothing.


Unless you can absolutely avoid it, do not offer to work for free. It's much easier to offer a *discount* from your *regular* rates than to be seen as raising your prices later. Showing a portfolio, or doing a test shoot is one thing, but he shouldn't get the photos from a test shoot without paying at least something for them. Doing the work and only being paid if the client likes the work is called working *for spec* and it might be a foot in the door, so to speak. Best case they like it and hire you *and* you get additional fees from people who attend and want prints...worst case at least you get the experience and a better feel for the work.

As pointed out above, do be very clear where the lines are with regard to shooting performers and customers. If he hires you, you should be known to staff/etc as the official or event photographer...it really does help to be seen as *official*, rather than some guy with a camera...especially when shooting and performers or customers.

deb22

I think a lot depends on who contacted who. If he contacted you then a simple what are you looking for will start things off. If you contacted them he may be under the get stuff for free assumption. Not all businesses are like that but you mentioned some difficult barrieres in this region and I live in a small village and if they can get it at low or no cost they will try. If he is agreeable to hear some of your suggestions after he sets his objectives then negotiate away and good luck to you.

chrisjohnson

In many places you would have to pay for the franchise of taking photos in a club.

The main opportunity is to sell prints of the guests to the guests, so you need an end-to-end process to cash.

Don't worry about liability - only an issue when you publish photos without permission and even then a grey area. The odd punter will get mad when you shoot them cheating on their wife or whatever; simplest solution is to delete there and then, or run like hell. Always ask if they are ok when you hand over your card. I do these photos every year during Carnival and never had a problem yet.

I would give the club promo photos for free as long as you have exclusive rights to shoot the guests and take the income. You are lucky if you get the club to pay you beyond free entry and a few free drinks. This is not a fat business.

If it is a one-off deal then charge wedding rates and assign the copyright to the club - avoiding any liability issues.