Swim shot

kidzmom

Hi folks!!

Any thoughts on this shot? Just wondering how the processing looks. This is part of a HS Senior shoot as he wanted "water portraits".. Taken with 70-200 2.8 IS in plain sunlight. Thoughts on the poster??? Thanks for ANY input whatsoever (good or bad). :lust

trevorb

I like the low angle and the blues. Nice to finally see a shot with the 70-200.

Gringriff

Kelly,

I like the shot and the poster is really cool.

For the photo there may be a little too much room at the bottom, but it is used well in the poster.

In both to me it would be better if you could change the color of the orange stuff in the background. I'm not sure what would be better but the orange stuff may not go well with the blue water.

One thing I would fix for sure is to rotate the shot to level the pool edge so the water does not flow out to the right.

I like the tilt of the insert but maybe another shot there would add more to the poster.

Also with so much space at the bottom I might make the font just a little larger.

One last thing - if you have a shot or could redo it a fly shot with arms and hands extended outward to the sides usually looks better than with hands trailing.

Overall very nice and a cool idea that will probably be copied along the way.

I know this is nit picking because it is very nice as it is, these are just some things I would consider if I was working with it

Thanks for sharing,
Andy

rstwohee

Gringriff wrote: »

Kelly,

I like the tilt of the insert but maybe another shot there would add more to the poster.

...

One last thing - if you have a shot or could redo it a fly shot with arms and hands extended outward to the sides usually looks better than with hands trailing.

I agree with how fly looks best. If you can reshoot and do a head-on at the point of the "flick" as the kids like to call it (arms fully stretched out to side, hands flicking water) it's a really cool picture.

Otherwise, like the shot and colors are sharp.

Irides

Great job with the shot and what a great way to capture a memory that is important to this hs senior. Having taking swimming pictures for a number of years, I know how hard it is to capture just the right moment in the execution of the stroke, timing is everything.

I have many times been frustrated by not being able to capture the wings of the "flyer" fully extended with the head up and have been told by my own "flyer" that this can't happen if they are doing the stroke properly. The reality is by the time a competent butterflier is fully extended, his face is already back in the water as part of the stroke cycle. You have captured this part of the stroke exceptionally well. Kudoos!

kidzmom

Thanks SO much for the input everyone!!! I have taken note of all of the thoughtful and informative comments and have already started a new edit. I absolutely did not see the tilt of the water until it was mentioned by Gringriff. I've rotated the image and also duped the upper right corner and flipped it to cover the brown and distracting background. These are great suggestions and have vastly improved the image. Irides, THANK YOU for your post. It boosted my confidence on this shot. Not being a swimmer myself I struggled to capture the right moment. Luckily my subject was more than willing to show off his stroke. Since he is a 'fly-er' I know this means so much to him, so I tried my best to capture it. It isn't an easy one to photo!! I'm very happy you like the shot! You are absolutely right that the arms extended and face up is nearly (if not impossible) to get! I did get a lot of arms extended shots too, and I agree with Rstwohee that it would look great to get the "flick" also. Instead of the same image in the upper corner I'm going to add the arms extended in order to complete this series. I REALLY hope this will make him happy. He is a dedicated swimmer and a neat poster for his wall would make him very happy. I'm very appreciative of all the commets! THANK YOU! And by the way, Trevor there are MANY more shots to come with the great white. Man, I love this lens!!!!!! I put off the purchase for WAY too long. Anyone who is struggling with whether to buy this lens or not. It is worth every penny (and weighs as much as the whole bank, lol). Thanks again and I'll repost my edit tomorrow.
Kelly

rstwohee

I'm looking forward to a repost to see the new edits. I did want to mention that it's not totally impossible to get that fly shot -- just very difficult. I've personally never quite made it but I know others who have and it would seem that the best opportunity to get the shot is when a swimmer is actually competing. Strokes seem to change ever so slightly when one knows they are performing for a camera vs. racing to win. I debated posting a pic here (of a very talented "flyer") but i don't want to hijack the thread.

I'm with you on the 70-200 2.8 -- it's well worth lugging around as the shots are amazing.

Betsy

kidzmom

Hi Everyone,
So here are a few more edits. I added a portrait to the poster, along with a different swimming perspective (arms extended with the water flick). I also edited the b/g on my preferred swim shot and rotated slighly so that the water would not be flowing downwards. THANK YOU for all of the helpful and useful suggestions and thoughts. Please keep them coming, this may or may not be the final version...I'm up for comments

#1 New edited version of poster



#2 With Less Distracting BG


#3 Pool headshot for poster (jury is out on whether to include this or not)


#4 Water flick with spread


Thanks again so much everyone! Please feel free to hijack this thread for picture examples or ideas!!!!!!!!

trevorb

Stellar portrait! The expression is perfect. Not to smiley and not to posed, perfect for a guy.

rstwohee

The portrait/headshot is great. I'd definitely keep it. I'm a symmetry person so the poster feels lopsided to me (please take with a grain of salt... ;-)) Could the 2 added pics on the poster have the same border treatment? Perhaps tilt the one on the left so that it has a complementary feel to the headshot - not in the same direction but so that each has a tilt that heads up to the center.

This guy is going to love the poster for sure.

Gringriff

Very Very Nice! I like it a lot. Adding the second insert is good too.

I agree with rstwohee about adding the tilt back to the one on the left. They two inserts don't have to be the same degrees but both should be tilted and both tilted toward the center would be nice.

I also agree about the insert borders. Not sure which border or if any border would look best but both should probably be treated the same.

Excellent portrait and great use of it in the insert.

You have a real winning poster here and I'm sure he'll love it.

About your lens. Is it the brand new 70-200 that came out this year. I know I LOVE my 70-200 f/2.8 non-IS and it is a terrific lens for up close sports like this.

Andy

trevorb

I think the slight tilt just comes from taking it at an angle, instead of straight on. It's pretty minor.

Gringriff

trevorb wrote: »

I think the slight tilt just comes from taking it at an angle, instead of straight on. It's pretty minor.

Trevorb,

No the slight tilt of the swimmer is fine. I was just saying if the small insert on the left was rotated similar to the one on the right instead of being square it would be nice.

Andy

kidzmom

Thanks everyone for taking this project as seriously as I am. I can't tell you how much I appreciate all of the detailed feedback! I really want this to turn out perfectly...You three are helping me big time.

Okay, up for vote: three insert options. Two with various tilts and 1 straight on. I don't want things to feel lopsided and I agree the same frame treatment is called for. Actually all I did was emboss the edges but used the same stamp this time.

So let me know what you think!! I did these re-edits quickly but just wanted to know in general which is the most pleasing to the eye Thank you three!!!!!!

#1


#2


#3

Gringriff

Kelly,

All are vary nice - I vote for #3.

Andy

kidzmom

Thank you Andy! I appreciate the input very much. Oh, and I forgot to mention my lens. I was going back and forth b/w the 2.8 IS and no IS. I bought a used IS from Adorama and then returned it for a new one since the older one was pretty beat up ($1899 new vs 1500 used). The newer version of the IS (released in April I believe) is $2400...I figured the standard IS would be good enough for me. I do a lot of low light shooting (for gymnastics) so the IS helps me a lot. I'm curious about the IS II though---ie how it differers in performance from the regular 70-200 2.8 IS version. $500 bucks is a lot of money.

Gringriff wrote: »

Kelly,

All are vary nice - I vote for #3.

Andy

trevorb

#3:d

rstwohee

I'm torn... really torn. I like them all and I've lost my 3-sided coin OK.... #3

As for the 70-200, I have the new model and LOVE it. We rented 70-200 IS I in February for a large swim meet and thought it was THE lens for us. Then the II came out and we were quoted a nice price (it is Canada so nice price is relative....) and bought it. Well... at least for the types of shooting my husband and I do (low, inconsistent lighting -- indoor swim meets) it was night and day. The new model is faster -- feels faster and more accurate. For me it was worth the extra $$$.

Betsy

kidzmom

Wow, a shutout for #3! Thanks you three!!!! Bestsy, I appreciate your input on the IS I vs IS II! That is awesome that you got the II. I'm just counting my lucky stars that my husband was kind enough to step me up from non-IS to IS, lol! My main shooting with this lens will be for track and field events, outdoor portraits and indoor gymnastics (enough light but very backlit at times with huge walls of windows that backlight things completely!) So far things are looking good with the shots. I'm am BLOWN away by this lens quite honestly. It is really a photographer's dream. I appreciate all the input for this poster, everyone!!!!!! And hey Bestsy...show me that stellar fly shot. I can't wait to see it

puzzledpaul

Whilst #3'd probably also get my vote, there's a couple of things I'd address if they were my pics.

Small mod - make sure the cloned droplets in the bg aren't too easily recognised - as they are now (imo)
Big mod - perhaps have a go to see what it looks like without the poolside / wall at all - trying this also gives you the opportunity (if desired) to use a totally different bg.

I just think that it'd be an even more dynamic looking shot - bearing in mind the low angle you got - if the outline of his body wasn't broken by the poolside stuff

pp

kidzmom

Wow Puzzledpaul..these are things I hadn't considered doing, but after your comments I'm all ears! I always hate manipulating images too much, but I suppose I've opened up pandora's box since I already had to dupe and flip the b.g to cover the orange/yellow distracting building that was on the left side in the first post. I'm very happy to be rid of it and I agree that the current b.g also is a bit distracting. What color b.g would you go with? You'd strip the pool wall also (or perhaps just the top part?). Thanks for the ideas.

Gringriff

puzzledpaul wrote: »

Big mod - perhaps have a go to see what it looks like without the poolside / wall at all - trying this also gives you the opportunity (if desired) to use a totally different bg.

That's a cool idea. The work involved is much more but it could really be slick when finished. Maybe a look like one of those endless swimming pools. But then you've got to pick a new BG.

Would love to see what the final product looks like.

Andy

kidzmom

Hey Andy..or anyone...any thoughts on where I'd find my new b/g? I'm always up for a challenge!

puzzledpaul

Well, there's probably a few ways of going about things if want to play around...

To get a (very) quick / rough idea about whether it's an approach that's going to work - for you - why not just try really blurring the poolside wall and blending it in with the orig shot - just to see what it looks like / whether it 'grabs you' ... or not?
(one quick way is to copy the image in PS, blur the lower layer and reveal this blurred layer thro' a layer mask on the upper layer - don't waste time being precise, if you're just checking it out at this stage)

If you do decide to go further, then, imo, there's several options
Keep the orig bg, but modify / blur it - so the wall lines are far less distracting (adding noise can sometimes help (imo) in this sort of thing if don't want it to be too smooth)
Dump the orig bg and insert a different one - here, it might be worth considering using the bg (water) from the 'arm flick' shot ... and merge / blend that into the water of the orig pic ... and then blend this (now well oof) water into some other colour ... if you want a graduated bg.

You've also got the possibility / potential to merge a fully opaque main subject (the swimmer) into a bg that is a very faint image that's relevant (or significant) to the person / theme
eg an outside shot of his local pool
Gala programme where he broke the world record
etc

Whilst I've little experience of 'Out of Border' pics, I'd have thought that this pic also lends itself to this sort of treatment?
... Head braking thro' the top of the frame / border.

(Seem to remember a DG forum related to examples / techniques for this ?...)

pp

kidzmom

Wonderful suggestions PP!!! I'm going to layer masking and blending first! I'll post with my results for feedback THANKS!

Irides

# 3 for me as well.

I too have the 70-200 2.8 ISM. While not the new version as I purchased it about 2.5 years ago, it is my go to lense for pretty well everything and I never leave home without it. I have been able to take some pretty amazing shots with it.

While it is a bit on the weighty side, (the price of good glass) you will get used to it. One of the bonuses for me is the compliments I get for the shape my arms are in from packing it around :-).

Have fun with it, it will work well for all the stuff you bought it for.

Irides

Hope you don't mind but I thought you might like to see one of the shots I took with my 70-200, wide open at 2.8; 1600 ISO, no flash, indoor pool.20091205-IMG_0488.jpg

rstwohee

Iris - is that you? It's Betsy down in Medicine Hat :-) As always love your shots!

Irides

What gave it away? The "Foot" on the cap?

rstwohee

The "Foot" on one side and "hills" on the other and ignoring the fact that 1) it's an excellent swim photo 2) it's of a "flyer" 3) indoor swim meet with photog at deck level (not everyone can get down on deck....)... yeah all the hints were there.

Welcome fellow newbie to Digital Grin.

And back to your picture post - I'm not sure which meet this is at but having been to pretty much all the same meets as you guys I know just how hard it is to get a decent shot with the mediocre to non-existent lighting at these facilities. What I would like to know is did you shoot this continuous or a single shot? I've been working on getting that flick on fly and it just isn't working for me. Did you crop in post-processing or were you down on the bulkhead?

kidzmom

That is a great shot at 1600! It seems in swimming..anticipating the stroke is just SO essential. You nailed it! Thanks so much for sharing!

Anyway I just had a few minutes to play with a gaussian blur and a layer mask. The pool rim is still there but maybe less noicable. Does this fly (no pun intended)?