50D & 580EXII will not high speed sync

scraider

My Canon 50D and my Canon 580EXII have been producing 1 out of 5 pictures with flash illumination sometimes 2 out 8 pictures pictures with flash illumination. ( no flashes) I am shooting Tv on camera and EttL high speed sync on flash. I am using a Canon 70-200 2.8 USM IS lense when this happens. I have bought new battteries, I have decharge and re charge every battery old and new, I have clean all connector on flash, camera, etc......

I swith to Tamron 28-70 2.8 lenses and flash fire perfectly with the settings Tv and High Speed sync on flash. I get 6 out of 8 pictures with flash illumination.

divamum

Sounds to me like maybe your flash isn't having time to recycle between flashes? Sometimes if I'm working at high speed they just can't keep up with me, especiall if I'm stopped down. What aperture? If it's fairly high, then maybe open up a little. What's your ISO? Sometimes bumping that up a little can take the pressure off the flash, too.

ziggy53

Light diminishes as a square of the distance. A longer focal length lens will require a much more powerful flash discharge to produce the same exposure at the same aperture setting than will a shorter focal length lens. A more powerful flash discharge requires more energy and longer recycle times.

I suspect that everything is working more or less as it should work.

If you need to use large flash outputs, and you desire shorter recycle times, you could purchase an external high-voltage power supply. The Canon CP-E4 Compact Battery Pack is the correct device to allow shorter recycle times after a large flash discharge. It will also give you more flashes per set of batteries, but the high-voltage pack requires an additional 8 - AA batteries.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/498738-REG/Canon_1947B001.html

http://www.adorama.com/CACBPE4.html

I do caution that too many large flash outputs in a row can lead to overheating and flash shutdown. You should also try to use a higher ISO if possible, and more efficient flash technique. A "Fong Lightsphere" type device can be very wasteful of light, for example, if it's used away from suitable reflective surfaces.

InsuredDisaster

Buy another 3 flashes or so and slave them all together. Each flash will need to work less so they'll recycle faster. Alternately, switch to single advance shooting mode and take a second or two between shots.

scraider

more info from me
I am shooting HS football at night. For three Years, I have had no equipment problems. All human errors.

But in last two weeks, my gear 50D, 580EXII flash, 70-200 USM IS , old or new batteries, shooting Tv at 1/320 ISO 1250 AI Servo HI speed Continuous in camera and ETTL hi speed sync in ZOOM on flash. The gear will not repeatedly fire the flash more than once. I get one flash, one partial dim shot, two to four dark ones (no flash). Disconnect, re-connect, swap batteries, do hokey pokey, and get no better result from the equipment.

I am in a friendly envoronment of Professionals four or more news press or annual staff photogs who all greatfully helpful are baffled with this issue as well; who have recommended the RESET button on bottom of camera, new batteries (in my pocket)(changed out batteries between new ones and older ones)( all batteries were recharged in previous week), disconnected all parts and re-attached, (meaning lenses to camera body, flash to camera body, etc.) turned off and turned on, we even got pencil from team and cleaned all contacts between lenses and body, flash and body, etc.

The conclusion amongst the veteran photogs I stand around is that somehow possibly the camera is not getting the TTL info from the lenses to the Flash or vice a versa which ever way the electronic impulses flow through the gear.

Is it possible I have a burnt circuit inside one of these peices of equipment??

My Tamron 28-70 mm 2.8 does not seem to cause a misfiring flash issue. So, I feel camera and flash may be good but the ciruitry or contacts of the 70-200mm seem to be the culprit. ANY IDEAS???scratch

InsuredDisaster

Have you tried other flashes (to isolate your camera) or put the flash on a known good camera?

ivar

scraider wrote: »

But in last two weeks, my gear 50D, 580EXII flash, 70-200 USM IS , old or new batteries, shooting Tv at 1/320 ISO 1250 AI Servo HI speed Continuous in camera and ETTL hi speed sync in ZOOM on flash.

Can the 50d sync that fast? isn't it limited to 1/250? anyone have a manual handy?

ziggy53

ivar wrote: »

Can the 50d sync that fast? isn't it limited to 1/250? anyone have a manual handy?

The OP said they used HSS/FP mode (thread title).

ivar

ziggy53 wrote: »

The OP said they used HSS/FP mode (thread title).

I guess I should have noticed that, it is only mentioned several times

ziggy53

scraider wrote: »

I am shooting HS football at night. For three Years, I have had no equipment problems. All human errors.

But in last two weeks, my gear 50D, 580EXII flash, 70-200 USM IS , old or new batteries, shooting Tv at 1/320 ISO 1250 AI Servo HI speed Continuous in camera and ETTL hi speed sync in ZOOM on flash. The gear will not repeatedly fire the flash more than once. I get one flash, one partial dim shot, two to four dark ones (no flash). Disconnect, re-connect, swap batteries, do hokey pokey, and get no better result from the equipment.

I am in a friendly envoronment of Professionals four or more news press or annual staff photogs who all greatfully helpful are baffled with this issue as well; who have recommended the RESET button on bottom of camera, new batteries (in my pocket)(changed out batteries between new ones and older ones)( all batteries were recharged in previous week), disconnected all parts and re-attached, (meaning lenses to camera body, flash to camera body, etc.) turned off and turned on, we even got pencil from team and cleaned all contacts between lenses and body, flash and body, etc.

The conclusion amongst the veteran photogs I stand around is that somehow possibly the camera is not getting the TTL info from the lenses to the Flash or vice a versa which ever way the electronic impulses flow through the gear.

Is it possible I have a burnt circuit inside one of these peices of equipment??

My Tamron 28-70 mm 2.8 does not seem to cause a misfiring flash issue. So, I feel camera and flash may be good but the ciruitry or contacts of the 70-200mm seem to be the culprit. ANY IDEAS???scratch

The first thing to do is to check recent EXIF with past EXIF from pictures to see if that can hint as to the problem.

A camera reset is indicated, to eliminate an inadvertent setting change.

I do not necessarily recommend HSS/FP mode for trying to eliminate subject motion. Focal plane shutters don't work quite like many people think. To quote myself from a similar recent response:

---

HSS/FP mode does not necessarily stop action any better than normal flash sync.

A focal plane shutter travels at the same rate regardless of the shutter speed rating. At faster shutter speeds the leading and trailing edges of the shutter form a slit which travels across the image plane. Since the slit takes the same amount of time to cross the image plane regardless of the width of the slit, any subject motion that occurs during the exposure will record as subject distortion. There is a good description of the cause and effect here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focal-plane_shutter

http://webs.lanset.com/rcochran/flash/hss.html

Notice the image distortion that can occur, even with HSS/FP flash.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6f/Bundesarchiv_Bild_183-1991-1209-503,_Autorennen_im_Grunewald,_Berlin.jpg

Stationary target:

http://webs.lanset.com/rcochran/flash/medres/turnedoff.jpg

Spinning target with HSS/FP mode flash (1/4000th):

http://webs.lanset.com/rcochran/flash/medres/s4000.jpg

Spinning target with normal flash sync, but low power (1/250th):

http://webs.lanset.com/rcochran/flash/medres/flash.jpg

Conversely a speedlite used in a single pulse has a typical duration of 1/600th or so, effectively much better at stopping subject motion. At lower power output the flash duration is even shorter. Hummingbird photographers often use multiple, synchronized, low power flashes to produce sufficient light but with extremely short durations.

ziggy53

ivar wrote: »

I guess I should have noticed that, it is only mentioned several times

You are correct in that some of the recent 1D/1Ds series bodies do flash sync slightly faster with recent Canon flashes. I believe that some RF controller/slave combinations also allow slightly faster flash sync.

scraider

underwtood
I have tried to reproduce at home in dark rooms, closet with no light.

Only thing I notice is that the IR on front of flash never transmit or sends a test blast as stated in manual? Could IR have gone bad?

pyry

scraider wrote: »

I have tried to reproduce at home in dark rooms, closet with no light.

Only thing I notice is that the IR on front of flash never transmit or sends a test blast as stated in manual? Could IR have gone bad?

Did you use manual focus? The flash emits a focus assist in the dark, but only if you are using AF. As for any actual IR-emissions, it doesn't have a dedicated IR-emitter: E-TTL uses the main bulb to communicate.

Also if you use manual exposure mode the main bulb doesn't emit a measuring pre-flash.

ziggy53

In a dark room you should see the AF assist light illuminate your subject. If it is not, the lens could be in a manual focus setting.

If the lens is not in manual focus, there may be some lack of communication between camera and lens. Test the lens at different zoom settings. Clean the contacts on both lens and camera.

As has been mentioned before in this thread, change camera bodies and lenses and flashes to see if there is a correlation between specific combinations of those items. If the problems move with a specific item, you will have a likely culprit.