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Help with lighting for informal portraits
Bend The Light
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Hi All,
Tomorrow, I am picking up a set of studio lights. I am borrowing them.
Not sure exactly what they are, to be honest, but I do know there are 2 of them, and they have softboxes which are about 20in square. They are on stands. I believe they have cables to trigger them from the camera hotshoe...
I have NEVER used anything like this before, and I am going to take portraits of dads and kids at a saturday club I go to with my daughter.
I will have the use of a room which is about 12 x 8 ft with windows with blinds at one end. I can put some sort of backdrop up.
Question...based on this (poor, I know) description, what sort of set up would you use?
I have a canon 400d, 18-55 kit lens, or a number of manual focus lenses (e.g. 28mm, 30mm, 35mm, 50mm f1.8), and either hand held or a tripod.
Or, could you give me some ppointers on other ways to approach this?
The dads and kids know I am new, and so are not expecting miracles, but I would like to get a few nice shots of them.
Cheers
Tomorrow, I am picking up a set of studio lights. I am borrowing them.
Not sure exactly what they are, to be honest, but I do know there are 2 of them, and they have softboxes which are about 20in square. They are on stands. I believe they have cables to trigger them from the camera hotshoe...
I have NEVER used anything like this before, and I am going to take portraits of dads and kids at a saturday club I go to with my daughter.
I will have the use of a room which is about 12 x 8 ft with windows with blinds at one end. I can put some sort of backdrop up.
Question...based on this (poor, I know) description, what sort of set up would you use?
I have a canon 400d, 18-55 kit lens, or a number of manual focus lenses (e.g. 28mm, 30mm, 35mm, 50mm f1.8), and either hand held or a tripod.
Or, could you give me some ppointers on other ways to approach this?
The dads and kids know I am new, and so are not expecting miracles, but I would like to get a few nice shots of them.
Cheers
0
Comments
1) Learn flat lighting quickly. While it may not be as dramatic as other types of lighting, it's safe and predictable.
2) Shoot on a tripod. If everything else is a bit of a variable, at least be consistent. Get a test subject to pose for you and then lock in your tripod settings so that all you have to do is raise and lower for height compensation.
3) Not sure how large your groups are so take the old photo rule of f/8 and forget it. Find the optimal strobe settings that will get you good exposures with your camera locked into f/8 1/125 @ ISO 200. That way if you're layering 1-2 people deep, you can still get decent/good depth of field.
4) 1 pose. Keep it simple. If the kids are younger, have the parent seated and start with a child posed to he/she back to back. With additional kids, add them in opposite sides. Try to stagger height so that everyone's eyes are not at the same horizontal level.
5) AF or MF lenses are a personal choice; I'm particular to AF myself but I trust my camera's AF system.
Good luck!
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The room seems too small for me. Also with the window at one end you may not need the lights or maybe just a little bounce and / or fill.
Think about taking the portraits outside. perhaps in a spot shaded by a wall or trees.
Sam
Thanks, Sam. I know, I will find out what the lights are...a little premature asking for help without knowing what I am dealing with, eh?
Looking at the weather here, the outdoors may not be an option...I may be able to get a different room...a school hall, perhaps. We sometimes have access to that...
I'll check out the gear and get back...
Cheers
Craig
I have 2 x Prolinca 250. Can be half or full power.
There's a couple of shoot through brollies, a couple of reflecting brollies, or a couple of softboxes.
I can trigger one of the lights with my wireless trigger, and the other as slave...Or both a slave from the on-camera flash?
with stands, obviously.
And a couple or more backdrops...
Cheers
Start with the lights set at half power, in front of the subjects at say a 45% angle. Begin with one light, and just try shooting at say ISO 100 at f5.6 or f8. The shutter can be between say 1/100 to 1/250 or whatever your sync speed is.
With only full or half power options, you won't be able to adjust the power levels very well electronically. You will need to primarily use distance to get the lighting levels where you want them. Of course you can also adjust your ISO and f stops to get the exposure you want.
Adjust each light separately. When your happy with each try them together. Try one light at farther distance to reduce the light from one side to help show some detail.
I would recommend you practice at home, and note down your camera settings and light positions and distance.
Sam
- no need for backdrop - you're shooting in the club, you have to bring the surroundings in, otherwise shoot in the studio.
- close the blinds - unless you're going to use a window light, which can be tricky for a group shot and rarely look informal.
- Set one light as a rim/hair (behind/above the subjects). Probably a softbox without diffuser panels. I don't think you have a grid for it, but if you do - use it. In any case make sure it doesn spill the light into your lens, otherwise you'll end up with a lot of flaring/pollution. Probably minus half a stop from the main.
- Use the other one (main) in full power to bounce of the ceiling in front of the subjects. I would use a brollybox located next/above the camera.
- Make sure both lights are in a diagonal/cross fire mode, i.e. on the same straight line passing through the subjects.
- Gelling them to 1/2CTO could be a good idea if you want to incorporate incadescent ambient lights, but again, you may not have those, so just make sure you overpower any ambient with your strobes (3 stops are typically enough).
- And yes, use a tripod...:-)
HTHNikolai
BTW, what is 1/2CTO?
Cheers
CTO = "Color Temperature Orange" = an orange gel filter.
1/2 CTO = 1/2 density of the "full" CTO.
There are also 1/4 CTO, 3/4 CTO and "full" CTO.
Thank you. And no, I don't think I have one.
I just played with the lights. They have a modelling light and the flash I had the triggering from wireless trigger, and one on slave. I also had an OCF behind the model. Used shoot through brollies first, then changed one for a reflecting brolly. Had them about 45 degrees either side, but one 1/2 distance to subject (the reflecting one)
I think the results looked ok...this is the one with both brollies on shoot-through...
dolly test big lights by Bend The Light, on Flickr
what do you guys think?
I'm going to set up on Saturday morning - I'll have aboiut 1hr before they'll be wanting a few shots, so time to set up in the actual room then. Just wanted to be sure I knew HOW to set up.
I will try...I don't have the space for it in the room I just tried. Was just checking I could actually work the lights, to be honest.
Cheers
EDIT: Make sure to move your subject off of your backdrop... I have to remind myself every time.
Hi! I'm Wally: website | blog | facebook | IG | scotchNsniff
Nikon addict. D610, Tok 11-16, Sig 24-35, Nik 24-70/70-200vr
Thank you. I will try it...just so long as I have space
You know, I am just wondering if they would let me use the hall at the school where I will be shooting instead of the small room, There'd be more space for that set up, and to bring the subjects off the backdrop...
Cheers
I'm generally happy, tall, and fuzzy on the inside.www.NickensPhotography.com
I think it was f11. I was using a manual lens, so the exif doesn't show, but I am sure it was about that. I was shooting at about 70mm. ISO 100, 1/200s. I was having trouble with the shutter lagging, black band on photos, so it had to be 1/200.
Cheers
You shouldn't need f11 so try using f8 with lights being set up with the same distance and power. See if that helps.
Since I don't know the distance I don't know whether you should try moving the lights closer or using full power and maybe moving the lights back.
I would do my best to listen to Nikolai, he has a lot more experience with portrait lighting than I do.
Also I don't think you will be able to experiment and get the lighting set up in one hour.
Give up sleep and start working on the light set up. Keep notes on each setup and image.
Sam
The Big problem is I don't have anywhere TO practice, other than our cluttered dining room. That doll is on the table! I can't move things around at all, really. But unfortunately, that's not going to change anytime soon. I'm going to have to go in and, as you said, follow the great advice I have been given, actually on the day. I'm making diagrams to take with me of the set ups advised.
One day, I'll have my own space
Good luck and let us know how it went.
Sam
Will post some results for the post-mortem...good or bad.
cheers
Hi! I'm Wally: website | blog | facebook | IG | scotchNsniff
Nikon addict. D610, Tok 11-16, Sig 24-35, Nik 24-70/70-200vr
Thanks.
camera 6ft away from subject. reflector umbrella above, right about 30degrees of axis. Softbox (20") behind to left, low down - diagonal to first light. Was suggested I try this set up, and tried my best.
Camera at ISO 100, 1/200s, f10.
Background too close to subject, but nothing I could do. Could have ironed it, though!
Ethan and Mick by Bend The Light, on Flickr
OK, pull it to bits...I have a paid shoot tomorrow (a friend, husband, 6 year old, baby) and want to do well...
thanks
The white balance is off. Looks a little green to me. A little hot on the face skin. Also I would try and ether include more of the arms / hands or crop them out. As it is they are just chopped off.
Why f10? This might just be my quirk, but I would try f11 or f8. I would look at raising the camera up a little. It's hard with two subjects that are very different in height. Basically I try to shoot portraits with the camera even or slightly higher than the head, but not shooting up. Watch for Nikolai's advice on this.
Sam
I used the WB in Photoshop from the white on the cushion...maybe it's not quite white?
I will try raising the camera some more...
F10 because I dialed it in as I was looking for a decent exposure...I have f11 on other shots, so I think this is just an anomaly.
The "hot" on the face...is that due to the main light at 20 degrees camera right? It was with reflector umbrella, on full power (either half or full available,nothing else). Should I knock that down to 1/2 power and adjust settings on the camera for exposure?
I am also looking for a white, plain background for tomorrow...I think that will look better than the one I used. The one today looks a little "school photo" to me, but it's all I had.
Cheers for the advice. And I will re-read Nikolai's words again...:)
- Uhm, when I said "diagonal" I meant position, not altitude. I thought I suggested both lights to be above the subject, plus main to be bounced from the ceiling. I'm sorry if it was unclear. Horror/Rim (as oposed to Hair/Rim) is rarely used for a general portraiture, it's more like a special effect setup.
- F/10 (or f/11) - is a bit too much for a portrait. I rarely shoot above f/5.6 (only when I go really close). However if 6 ft to the subject was all your had...
Man, did you have to go to that club at all, especially since you brought a backdrop? You probably have more space in your (or their) living room...
- And yes, bg was too close and wrinkled, esp for for F10, which of course, brought it perfectly in focus :-(
- You also had a lot of light spill on the b/g from the second light. Ther reason I suggested to put a softbox w/o diffusers on the back was exactly to avoid such an effect. Yet, of course, you would have to have some space on the back (which is why I suggested to ditch the backdrop in the first place)
- Exposure-wise: both subjects are very fair skinned; you need to dial your settings down.
- Pose-wise: while both subjects look OK if it were an individual picture, as a group, esp. dad/son portrait you have missed it
. There is pretty much no connection between them, they even look into different directions. Putting a son on dad's laps would be a better setting.
- Vantage: when shooting sitting subjects upper-body it's generally advantageous to have your camera above subjects eye level. Again, putting the kid on dad's laps would equalize the height difference and you'd have less trouble composing.
- Colors: too many msmatches: two colors on bg, cover, pillow (at least it matches dad's clothes), boy's shirt
This reminds me of my first paid gig 5-6 years ago... I had only one light...Hmmm, so I missed quite a few bits then?
Yes, I missed the bit about both lights been above the subject. I missed the "bounced from ceiling" too. My fault for not reading your information again and again.
The backdrop was nearly on the wall, there was no more space behind, so even if I ditched it, I would have had no extra space. There was also a lot of "stuff" on the walls, displays etc....typical of a school or childrens centre (which this was).
I do need the advice on posing...I realised I knew nothing today. I will address that issue better next time.
I had NO control over the clothing...they were there for the other things in the Dad's and Kid's club. The photos were extra. The backdrop and covers for the seats were my fault - I had nothing else. Next time I am going to take just a plain white background.
When you say "softbox without diffusers"...what do you mean? Sorry if that's a real amateur question, but I am really new to this. You mean, just have the white diffuser on the front, but no backing to the softbox? The light spills out of the sides?
Thanks again for your advice...I am really trying to understand, and it's my fault if I don't, not yours.
Cheers
Posing: there was a thread in People recently with the similar question I think... It's a fairly large and complicated subject (at least as complicated as lighting, if not worse), but there were a few links...
I would have descriped primary posing rules as three captial C-s:
- Connections
- Construction
- Closures
but it would take a much, much longer post to elaborate on the exact meaning of each...amongst subjects and between subject(s) and environment
lines and curves that construct the whole image and provide the stability, dynamics and the flow
purely geometrical, "rubber stamp" black and white areas
Softbox: yes, I meant to remove all the white fabric. Good softboxes have two layers. Entry level have one. You need none, since it's exactly the fabric that is reason of spill. Grid/crate would help, but you have none...
Thanks again.
So, no sides, just a front white diffuser held in place by the rods that hold the softbox. Light coming out of the sides?
That's exaclty the piece you want to remove (in case it's removable). If not - forget the softbox and use reflective umbrella, but try to focus it to the best of your abilities.
To "focus": set it next to your bg firing accross the frame (i.e. paraller to bg) a take several test shots, each time marking the position of the shaft and checking the cone of light on the bg. You need the narrowest one.
Again - remember not to bring it to close to your frame to avoid flare/pollution. It would help to place it higher and angling down, too.
Sorry...silly questions perhaps.
The front does come off...so light is more directed, less scattered?
Thanks again.