backup

m147m147 Registered Users Posts: 61 Big grins
edited November 24, 2010 in Digital Darkroom
i was just wonder what you all use for backup? online, HDD, CD, DVD, etc?
any suggestions recommendations.
if DVD's do you find any brands to be better than others?
thank you.

Comments

  • Wil DavisWil Davis Registered Users Posts: 1,692 Major grins
    edited November 17, 2010
    m147 wrote: »
    i was just wonder what you all use for backup? online, HDD, CD, DVD, etc?
    any suggestions recommendations.
    if DVD's do you find any brands to be better than others?
    thank you.

    Script files using robocopy to copy to external hard-drive.

    - Wil
    "…………………" - Marcel Marceau
  • gecko0gecko0 Registered Users Posts: 383 Major grins
    edited November 17, 2010
    internal drive images via Acronis + external drives for second copy + Backblaze online backup.
    Canon 7D and some stuff that sticks on the end of it.
  • NewsyNewsy Registered Users Posts: 605 Major grins
    edited November 17, 2010
    Multiple eSATA connected HDD's in a drive dock using either "Beyond Compare" or "SyncbackSE" to automate copying files to the external.

    http://www.thermaltakeusa.com/Products.aspx?C=1346

    http://www.scootersoftware.com/index.php

    http://www.2brightsparks.com/syncback/sbse.html


    For Disk Imaging I use Macrium Reflect.
    http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.asp

    I have a licensed copy of Agrium's disk imaging software from a couple of years ago but I stopped using it due I found it installed some accessory software I found to be intrusive.

    .
  • m147m147 Registered Users Posts: 61 Big grins
    edited November 17, 2010
    Wil Davis wrote: »
    Script files using robocopy to copy to external hard-drive.

    - Wil


    those of you who use externals, how large & are they dedicated?
  • Wil DavisWil Davis Registered Users Posts: 1,692 Major grins
    edited November 17, 2010
    I use 3 in rotation; 2 x 1Tb; 1 x 1.5Tb.
    "…………………" - Marcel Marceau
  • aquaticvideographeraquaticvideographer Registered Users Posts: 278 Major grins
    edited November 17, 2010
    Backblaze! thumb.gif
  • m147m147 Registered Users Posts: 61 Big grins
    edited November 18, 2010
    Newsy wrote: »
    Multiple eSATA connected HDD's in a drive dock using either "Beyond Compare" or "SyncbackSE" to automate copying files to the external.

    http://www.thermaltakeusa.com/Products.aspx?C=1346

    http://www.scootersoftware.com/index.php

    http://www.2brightsparks.com/syncback/sbse.html


    For Disk Imaging I use Macrium Reflect.
    http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.asp

    I have a licensed copy of Agrium's disk imaging software from a couple of years ago but I stopped using it due I found it installed some accessory software I found to be intrusive.

    .


    is putting your pictures into disk images safer? what are the benefits?
  • Art ScottArt Scott Registered Users Posts: 8,959 Major grins
    edited November 18, 2010
    Newsy wrote: »
    Multiple eSATA connected HDD's in a drive dock using either "Beyond Compare" or "SyncbackSE" to automate copying files to the external.

    http://www.thermaltakeusa.com/Products.aspx?C=1346


    These BlakX docks are great.....I have like 1st gen docks so have to keep drives no larger than 1 or 1.5 TB....the new gen docks can be used with upto 2tb drives....

    my work flow is too just have 3 exact copies of my work on harddrives......I do a simple drag and drop and go to bed...it is done in the morning...if I have work away from office i start any back ups i need to and leave...computer works while I am gone ........

    maybe I should look into "Beyond Compare" or "Sync Backs"
    "Genuine Fractals was, is and will always be the best solution for enlarging digital photos." ....Vincent Versace ... ... COPYRIGHT YOUR WORK ONLINE ... ... My Website

  • NewsyNewsy Registered Users Posts: 605 Major grins
    edited November 18, 2010
    m147 wrote: »
    is putting your pictures into disk images safer? what are the benefits?

    Disk Imaging software is generally used to create an exact bootable copy of what is on a hard drive for easy restoration after a catastrophic failure or incurable malware infection.

    I generally like to create an image just after a fresh OS install when I have installed all the OS updates and my key software programs, such as MS Office, and their updates. One of the reasons I do it at this time is that the size of the image will be small in comparison to if I tried to make an image after all my games, videos, and images get restored from other media.

    The key benefit to disk imaging software is that it quickly gets you back to work but you have to have confidence that you can restore from your image. In my experience with some programs, you have to do a little prep work in addition to making the image. If you forget to make a recovery disk ahead of time, you can be out of luck.

    Commonly used image software is Norton Ghost and Acronis but there are others.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_disk_imaging_software

    I personally would not use disk imaging software as a method of regularly backing up images.

    I prefer to copy non-encrypted non-compressed OS level files from my internal drives to my external drives. The Beyond Compare and SyncbackSE programs compare the file on your internal drive to the file on your external and can confirm if there are any exceptions and will copy over only files that have changed. This speeds up incremental backups. Later, if I have to find an original, I can go back to the external and view the files as if they were on the internal and pick out just the one I need.

    .
  • JimKarczewskiJimKarczewski Registered Users Posts: 969 Major grins
    edited November 18, 2010
    Currently use RAID 6 sever here at home. 8TB worth of data right now eliminates me from using an online service like BackBlaze. At max speed (1Mbit/sec) it would take 740 days to upload my whole server..... or 94 days per Terabyte... Ick

    Here is hoping that my Raid controller never dies... and if it does I have access to $700 to immediately replace it.
  • BradfordBennBradfordBenn Registered Users Posts: 2,506 Major grins
    edited November 18, 2010
    I have decided to go completely to the cloud for my backup. Multiple locations in the cloud even. I put frequently used thing in Dropbox. I use JungleDisk on the Amazon S3 service to do both a backup and file storage. I also use iDisk for some stuff just cause it is paid for. For my photographs, I put SOOC JPGs onto SmugMug and for the true keepers (which for me are not a large amount) I place them on JungleDisk as well.

    You might be asking what is the difference between file storage and backing up: In my mind "I have been using JungleDisk as my incremental off site backup solution. It works very well for me, but has some choices along with it that I was not fully aware of when I made them. Using a block copy approach I could reduce the amount of bandwidth and storage space I use, however this does not come without its tradeoffs. By making this choice I would be unable to browse the files online, I would have to actually restore them using the client software." File storage does not require any software just an Internet connection so that I can download just the one file I want.

    More of my ramblings about backup and Data Access at http://bradfordbenn.com/2010/05/data-backup-and-access/

    Hope that helps
    -=Bradford

    Pictures | Website | Blog | Twitter | Contact
  • JimKarczewskiJimKarczewski Registered Users Posts: 969 Major grins
    edited November 18, 2010
    FYI, my main concern about using something like BackBlaze.. What if I upload to them.. and they just drop off the face of the earth since their business model sucked or they go from $5/mo to $5/mo + $.10/GB of storage. Amazon, large providers like that, no problem. But for the amount of data I'm looking to store (and keep adding to) it almost seems like my DIY approach can have benefits. Long as you have a backup to your backup. I know my raid isn't perfect, so I still keep things on external bare drives that pop into my SATA->USB adapter.
  • aquaticvideographeraquaticvideographer Registered Users Posts: 278 Major grins
    edited November 18, 2010
    FYI, my main concern about using something like BackBlaze.. What if I upload to them.. and they just drop off the face of the earth since their business model sucked or they go from $5/mo to $5/mo + $.10/GB of storage. Amazon, large providers like that, no problem. But for the amount of data I'm looking to store (and keep adding to) it almost seems like my DIY approach can have benefits. Long as you have a backup to your backup. I know my raid isn't perfect, so I still keep things on external bare drives that pop into my SATA->USB adapter.

    For me, the main advantage of using Backblaze or another offsite, cloud-based provider is that they have multiple redundant copies far away from where my local storage is. That way, if there's a disaster, or a theft, or something similar beyond my control, I can get my backups back from the cloud. I too have a similar RAID-like setup here at home, but I want to keep things backed up away from my home as well.

    I guess you never know if a company is going to change their business model, pricing structure, or other aspects of how they do business, but I have been pretty happy with Backblaze for the past two years or so.

    You might look into CrashPlan, I think they let you copy your data onto an external USB hard drive (or 20 :-) and then mail them back to them, to "jumpstart" your backup. Then, it's just incremental backups from there.
  • Art ScottArt Scott Registered Users Posts: 8,959 Major grins
    edited November 18, 2010
    My problem with the cloud storage situation is that all of them I have looked at say you have to keep you computer and or hard drives connected so that THEY can update automatically.....they all said if something is disconnected for a long period then it is auto deleted off their systems....hell I have drives with photos on them that have not been connected in over a year.......that is what has driven me to just keep my 3 hdd drive system.......and after I figured the cost for ANY amazon system (smugvault or jungle disk...unless i was bringing 100k+ a year I could not afford to have all my files out there especially since i will be going FF this next year and withthe fact that I uprez to at least 40x60" at 300 dpi it is just much safer, less expensive and easier to just keep the hdd's coming in........pretty soon there will be reliable, inexpensive internal laptop drives and I will be moving all my desktop sized drives to the smaller form factor........
    "Genuine Fractals was, is and will always be the best solution for enlarging digital photos." ....Vincent Versace ... ... COPYRIGHT YOUR WORK ONLINE ... ... My Website

  • JimKarczewskiJimKarczewski Registered Users Posts: 969 Major grins
    edited November 19, 2010
    Cost.. You ain't kiddin Art. I just looked up Amazon S3. Cool, I can send them my hard drives and they will dump from there so I don't have to wait 2 years for a complete backup.. However, 8TB of storage, about $1k a month. Hell, for that much I can buy 10, 2TB drives a month and just make new copies every month. Damn expensive for mass quantities.

    I like the thought of that backBlaze and unlimited for one price.. but as I said before, will they be around in 10 years? And with storage ramping up as you mentioned, drives keep getting cheaper.. Almost enough for my 1TB drives in my server to be replaced with 2TB drives...
  • m147m147 Registered Users Posts: 61 Big grins
    edited November 19, 2010
    Newsy wrote: »
    Disk

    I prefer to copy non-encrypted non-compressed OS level files from my internal drives to my external drives. The Beyond Compare and SyncbackSE programs compare the file on your internal drive to the file on your external and can confirm if there are any exceptions and will copy over only files that have changed. This speeds up incremental backups. Later, if I have to find an original, I can go back to the external and view the files as if they were on the internal and pick out just the one I need.

    .

    by chance do you know software similar to those two for mac? I took a quick look at them earlier but I don't remember if they are mac compatible.
  • NewsyNewsy Registered Users Posts: 605 Major grins
    edited November 19, 2010
    m147 wrote: »
    by chance do you know software similar to those two for mac? I took a quick look at them earlier but I don't remember if they are mac compatible.

    Sorry... I'm not familiar with the Mac software.
  • gecko0gecko0 Registered Users Posts: 383 Major grins
    edited November 19, 2010
    Currently use RAID 6 sever here at home. 8TB worth of data right now eliminates me from using an online service like BackBlaze. At max speed (1Mbit/sec) it would take 740 days to upload my whole server..... or 94 days per Terabyte... Ick

    Here is hoping that my Raid controller never dies... and if it does I have access to $700 to immediately replace it.

    ...and hope the RAID controller you get at a replacement is identical and the striped config on the drives is recognized by it...or you're done. Also hope your home/office doesn't burn down or someone steals/vandalizes it, or a virus shreds your files...RAID doesn't help much there. :)

    As you said though, with THAT much data, online storage is not practical unless you're sitting on a huge internet pipe.
    Canon 7D and some stuff that sticks on the end of it.
  • gecko0gecko0 Registered Users Posts: 383 Major grins
    edited November 19, 2010
    Art Scott wrote: »
    My problem with the cloud storage situation is that all of them I have looked at say you have to keep you computer and or hard drives connected so that THEY can update automatically.....they all said if something is disconnected for a long period then it is auto deleted off their systems....hell I have drives with photos on them that have not been connected in over a year.......that is what has driven me to just keep my 3 hdd drive system.......and after I figured the cost for ANY amazon system (smugvault or jungle disk...unless i was bringing 100k+ a year I could not afford to have all my files out there especially since i will be going FF this next year and withthe fact that I uprez to at least 40x60" at 300 dpi it is just much safer, less expensive and easier to just keep the hdd's coming in........pretty soon there will be reliable, inexpensive internal laptop drives and I will be moving all my desktop sized drives to the smaller form factor........

    I'm with you on the pain of having to keep things connected to stay online. They do this because they are a backup solution, not an archival solution, if that makes sense. The one service that does not delete things (if you configure it to do so) that I know of is Crashplan. The rest have a 30 day limit or similar.
    Canon 7D and some stuff that sticks on the end of it.
  • ablichterablichter Registered Users Posts: 294 Major grins
    edited November 24, 2010
    Art Scott wrote: »
    [...]hell I have drives with photos on them that have not been connected in over a year.......
    Well, than I strongly suggest to connect them at least once in a quarter and let them run a couple of hours - better make use of them by moving data around, f.e. from folder "a" to a new folder "b".

    • lubricating film might rupture when it wasn't used for a long time (hope that is the right expression)
    • electrolytic capacitors might degenerate when not charged
    • read/write heads might stuck to their landing zone
    • and last but not least the magnetisation degrates and needs to be refreshed from time to time
    Might be all that never happens, but I wouldn't expect to much from consumer HDDs, especially from those build in external enclosures. Usually people only have an eye to the "compatible with" "USB 3.0 up to 5Gbit/s" or "eSATA 6 up to 6Gbit/s" stickers on them and not to the specs and quality of the HDDs which are build in.
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