Spyder ?

Bruce IBruce I Registered Users Posts: 14 Big grins
edited December 28, 2010 in Digital Darkroom
How hard is it to calibrate the monitor with this ?? I'm not real computer literate ...I get by nicely .. I have an older monitor too Videoseven .. thanks for all answers !!

Comments

  • BlackwoodBlackwood Registered Users Posts: 313 Major grins
    edited December 14, 2010
    It's easy. You hang it over the monitor (it shows you where) and click OK. Then it runs.

    If I had it to do again, I'd have just got the ColorMunki to begin with since it calibrates printers as well as monitors. But alas.
  • NewsyNewsy Registered Users Posts: 605 Major grins
    edited December 14, 2010
    I tell most people to get the Spyder3 Elite and to consider it an investment.

    http://spyder.datacolor.com/s3compare.php

    This is because a lot of people now are considering using a dual monitor set-up and the Elite just makes the task of getting two external monitors to look similar so much more easier than either the Spyder3 Express or Pro models.

    The Elite has full function software where the Express and Pro are crippled. The key feature that the Elite offers is that it has a dedicated function to target a specific monitor brightness and then walk you through measuring and setting that brightness level. The Pro only reports the brightness at the end of the calibration session and the Express does not quantify it at all. Brightness is measured by the white luminance value of the monitor.

    If you have two monitors sitting side by side, you want them to look a close to identical as possible. In addition to setting gamma (2.2) and temperature (usually 6500K), and adjusting RGB values to get as close to the sRGB standard as possible, you also need to ensure they are similar in brightness. Your eye is not a good instrument to do this. It has too many perceptual issues to be accurate.

    Brightness is critical if you do any editing of images where you adjust the brightness of the image via levels or other means. If you're editing on a monitor that is too bright in contrast to the the ambient lighting levels of the room you edit in, your eyes' perceptual bias will fool you into lowering the levels of the image. When you later print that edited image, you'll find that it appears too dark when viewed under normal light levels.

    There is no one specific white luminance value that is "correct". The proper white luminance value is only known for sure from edited prints. What is typical is this:

    80 cd/m2 ...... a very dark room
    120 cd/m2 .... a typical setting for a moderately lit room
    150 cd/m2 .... maybe the level for a commercial office that meets WCB light levels


    If you're shopping the used market... be aware that the Spyder2 series is not recommended for use with "wide gamut" monitors, strictly standard sRGB color space monitors. Your current monitor is most likely a standard sRGB monitor. Also be aware that the Spyder2 is a LOT slower than the Spyder3 and as you should re-calibrate at least every couple of months, you may find the time savings worthwhile to justify a few extra $$$.

    For the most part, with a single monitor the calibration process is easy - just follow the instructions. Setting the brightness is the most tedious part as you will have to do some print comparisons between an un-edited image and edited versions of the image to determine if you have the "right" brightness level.

    However, the Elite also has a light sensor that measures the ambient brightness of your editing space and will suggest you use a certain white luminance value. It's not 100% accurate, but it gets you close.


    A couple of other points.... if you are still using WinXP, a calibrator can be somewhat problematic as the native version of WinXP lacks a color management utility (there is a download from MS though). Vista and Win7 have this. Your OS is??

    Your monitor may not have a full set of controls to allow you to make the most of a calibrator.

    The calibrator I'm suggesting probably costs more than your monitor and it may not make enough of a difference to justify purchasing it.

    Perhaps you should try this next web site and see if it helps:

    http://www.lagom.nl/lcd-test/

    For setting brightness you can try this very rough method - grab a sheaf of white printer paper (several pages thick) and hold it up next to your monitor while it is displaying a white screen and while the room has its' typical lighting used while you edit. If the paper looks brighter than your monitor, then your monitor is too dark. If the paper is darker, then the monitor is too bright or perhaps you need to increase the ambient lighting of the room. The paper will appear yellow under incandescent lighting so another trick is to buy some 6500K compact fluorescent bulbs for the lighting in your room (if your monitor temp is 6500K) and use them while attempting this paper method.


    FWIW... I previously used the Spyder2 Pro (the Spyder3 Elite replaced this model) and I now use a Xrite i1 Display2 with dual monitors. If I had to buy another calibrator today, I'd likely get the Spyder3 Elite. I don't print much at home.

    Bruce... I see you are in Ontario. I'm in BC. Western Canada pricing for this type of hardware is a rip-off imho. Locally I'm looking at about $320 for either the Spyder3 Elite or i1 Display2. With our dollar being so strong atm against the US dollar, I suggest you look at ordering online from a US reseller if you can't find a good price from Henry's, Vistek, or Aden in the Toronto area. I've used B&H and found them very good to deal with - you can get the Elite for about $186 US today.

    .
  • arodneyarodney Registered Users Posts: 2,005 Major grins
    edited December 15, 2010
    Sypder, its OK. I’d go ColorMunki or EyeOne Display.

    As for what target calibration settings to select, its all about matching to the print. All summed up here:http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/why_are_my_prints_too_dark.shtml
    Andrew Rodney
    Author "Color Management for Photographers"
    http://www.digitaldog.net/
  • MileHighAkoMileHighAko Registered Users Posts: 413 Major grins
    edited December 16, 2010
    I just picked up a Spyder3 in the past week. It has made a significant difference. I feel much more confident now in the color adjustments I am making in Lightroom. I had no idea how "out of whack" my monitor was. I'm very happy with the performance of this device.
  • Bruce IBruce I Registered Users Posts: 14 Big grins
    edited December 16, 2010
    Thanks so much for all the info I really appceate it .... I'm on the fixed income thang you know .... I'll have to save up since I have a 150 mm sigma coming now ....... and checking state side is cool I keep a American Address for shipping with a UPS store ...they charge me $5 an item I have sent to them ....which is pretty cool!
    Thanks so much everyone!
  • lfortierlfortier Registered Users Posts: 237 Major grins
    edited December 17, 2010
    When I bought my Dell 2409 WA monitor I upgraded fromthe Spyder2 to a Spyder 3 Elite. Well worth it.

    Keep an eye on EBay and/or Craigslist for a Spyder 3 Elite. You'll save a bundle.
  • piolet_rampepiolet_rampe Registered Users Posts: 94 Big grins
    edited December 21, 2010
    I was unable to load the Spyder 2 software on Windows 7 64 bit. Keep in mind when buying these things that as time marches on, so do operating systems, and manufacturers such as that for Spyder have no incentive to develop a driver for an older model no longer being sold.
  • Ed911Ed911 Registered Users Posts: 1,306 Major grins
    edited December 22, 2010
    I was unable to load the Spyder 2 software on Windows 7 64 bit. Keep in mind when buying these things that as time marches on, so do operating systems, and manufacturers such as that for Spyder have no incentive to develop a driver for an older model no longer being sold.

    Here's a fix that worked for me. I downloaded the drivers for Vista 64 bit...worked like a charm. I too thought that I was going to be forced into buying an upgrade. Found this fix by doing some research on the INTERNET. This worked on my new AMD Phenom 2 X4 system as of November 2010.

    Hope it helps you.
    Remember, no one may want you to take pictures, but they all want to see them.
    Educate yourself like you'll live forever and live like you'll die tomorrow.

    Ed
  • OffTopicOffTopic Registered Users Posts: 521 Major grins
    edited December 22, 2010
    Ed911 wrote: »
    Here's a fix that worked for me. I downloaded the drivers for Vista 64 bit...worked like a charm. I too thought that I was going to be forced into buying an upgrade. Found this fix by doing some research on the INTERNET. This worked on my new AMD Phenom 2 X4 system as of November 2010.

    Hope it helps you.

    I wish that worked for everyone, but some of us are having a problem that although the program will run with the Vista driver it starts to flash a solid gray screen which prevents calibration. checking around it seems people think it might be caused by the monitor driver. In my case I kept my old monitor when I got new tower, and there is no new driver for the monitor, so we think that's probably the problem. Have to either buy new monitor when I have no real reason to replace the one I have, or upgrade to Spyder3. :(

    It's worth giving a try, but if you run into the gray screen problem check for updated monitor driver.
  • NewsyNewsy Registered Users Posts: 605 Major grins
    edited December 22, 2010
    OffTopic wrote: »
    I wish that worked for everyone, but some of us are having a problem that although the program will run with the Vista driver it starts to flash a solid gray screen which prevents calibration. checking around it seems people think it might be caused by the monitor driver. In my case I kept my old monitor when I got new tower, and there is no new driver for the monitor, so we think that's probably the problem. Have to either buy new monitor when I have no real reason to replace the one I have, or upgrade to Spyder3. :(

    It's worth giving a try, but if you run into the gray screen problem check for updated monitor driver.

    I don't think the monitor driver is the issue. In my experience it was the video card utility that was the culprit.

    As I understand it, when you "install" the OEM monitor driver its' main function is to copy to your drive the manufacturers' default ICC profile for the monitor and then set this as the default profile which can be seen in the Windows Color Management utility.

    Something like this:
    1066555159_KjWvu-O.jpg


    You can see here my custom calibration profiles but also at the bottom of the list the OEM Dell ICC profile loaded by the driver.

    I've used a Spyder2 Pro on my Vista 64bit system without any hiccups.

    Where I've run into problems was I when I added a second monitor. I changed from a Nvidia GPU to an AMD/ATi GPU and once into the new ATi utility I started fiddling with settings. Then I acquired the second monitor and a new Xrite i1 Display2 colorimeter. I had all kinds of issues with the i1D2 - fixed gray screens that prevented calibration and other wierd issues like no auto sensing of the puck.

    It turns out it was a function within the ATi Catalyst Control video utility and once disabled, everything worked fine. Under "Hydravision" I disabled the "Desktop Manager" and that fixed the issues.

    .
  • ThatCanonGuyThatCanonGuy Registered Users Posts: 1,778 Major grins
    edited December 24, 2010
    I have Spyder3Pro, just got it this month. I don't have dual monitors. I haven't set it up yet... I'll update when I'm done.
  • ThatCanonGuyThatCanonGuy Registered Users Posts: 1,778 Major grins
    edited December 24, 2010
    OK, I just did it... it's pretty easy. Take it out of the box, install the software on the CD, plug the thing in, and hang it on your monitor... and wait, in a dark room. The room's gotta be totally dark (well, 99% dark, I just shut the door and turned off the light, and if you have windows in the room you should do it at night). Took me about 10-15 minutes just to calibrate. The whole thing? Maybe half an hour. The software shows colors on your screen, and Spyder reads them. At the end, when it's done, Spyder uses your old colors and your new correct ones to show you some photos. With the click of a button, you can switch between your old colors and your new ones. Trust me, it's so cool going back and forth mwink.gif Then you close the program, and THERE, your monitor is calibrated. After you do it, you will notice your monitors colors to be wierdly different from normal... but don't worry, the ones you are used to are wrong! As I type this, I am looking at a monitor with a spooky green tint to it... I didn't know dgrin's color scheme was green and black!rolleyes1.gif
  • Bruce IBruce I Registered Users Posts: 14 Big grins
    edited December 24, 2010
    Well I'm glad to see this thread helping everyone ...it's Christmas Eve and we always open one present each year before bed ....well guess what ?? SpyderPro3 .... just wish I felt up to working with it ... just got out of the hospital and I may be going back .... but at least I have ...I got myself a great wife .... thanks to everyone that helped me out !!
  • FotobyMoMoFotobyMoMo Registered Users Posts: 98 Big grins
    edited December 25, 2010
    I say EyeOne
    Much better software than Spyder
    www.fotobymomo.com | www.facebook.com/fotobymomo

    Gear List: Canon 5D Mm2 | T1i (backup) | 16-35 2.8L | 27-200 2.8L Mk2 | 24-105 4L | Sigma 85mm 1.4 | Canon 580ex flash
  • MileHighAkoMileHighAko Registered Users Posts: 413 Major grins
    edited December 25, 2010
    OK, I just did it... it's pretty easy. Take it out of the box, install the software on the CD, plug the thing in, and hang it on your monitor... and wait, in a dark room. The room's gotta be totally dark (well, 99% dark, I just shut the door and turned off the light, and if you have windows in the room you should do it at night). Took me about 10-15 minutes just to calibrate. The whole thing? Maybe half an hour. The software shows colors on your screen, and Spyder reads them. At the end, when it's done, Spyder uses your old colors and your new correct ones to show you some photos. With the click of a button, you can switch between your old colors and your new ones. Trust me, it's so cool going back and forth mwink.gif Then you close the program, and THERE, your monitor is calibrated. After you do it, you will notice your monitors colors to be wierdly different from normal... but don't worry, the ones you are used to are wrong! As I type this, I am looking at a monitor with a spooky green tint to it... I didn't know dgrin's color scheme was green and black!rolleyes1.gif

    Hmm... I didn't realize it needed to be dark to calibrate. Mine took readings of the ambient light prior to calibration. My dgrin isn't green and black, it's more brown and black to me. Lol. Guess I need to spend more time with it.


    Sent from my SCH-I800 using Tapatalk
  • cr8ingwavescr8ingwaves Registered Users Posts: 194 Major grins
    edited December 25, 2010
    My hubby got me the Spyder3 Elite ! Just love him!!
    I didn't see anywhere that calibration had to be done in a totally dark room. unless that is how you have the room when you do your workflow, it doesn't make sense to me. Why would the ambient reading step even be necessary?

    edit to add:
    my dgrin is two shades of slate and black....no green......this is the way it has always been.
  • NewsyNewsy Registered Users Posts: 605 Major grins
    edited December 25, 2010
    My hubby got me the Spyder3 Elite ! Just love him!!
    I didn't see anywhere that calibration had to be done in a totally dark room. unless that is how you have the room when you do your workflow, it doesn't make sense to me. Why would the ambient reading step even be necessary?

    Exactly! Normal ambient light is fine though many prefer to run the actual RGB part of the calibration in a dark room to ensure no stray light gets into the face of the puck. If your room is not super bright and you have no direct light shining onto the front of the monitor, and your puck is perfectly flush to the screen, I figure normal ambient is OK and required to use the ambient light feature of this device.

    edit to add:
    my dgrin is two shades of slate and black....no green......this is the way it has always been.
    As is mine.


    Merry Xmas.

    .
  • Dan7312Dan7312 Registered Users Posts: 1,330 Major grins
    edited December 27, 2010
    The doc's for the Spyder 3 Elite seemed to imply I should calibrate the monitor in the ambient light I'm going to use display in. It also warns me if that level in the room changes changes and gives me a tool to change the profile if need be.

    So it seems like calibration is dependent on ambient light, so you shouldn't do calibration in dark room unless you are going to work in a dark room.

    I just beginning to try to understand this color stuff so I may be missing something here.

    There is a little Spyder icon in the Windows tray that gives you access to a number of things and turns red if Spyder thinks your calibration might be off, for example due to a change in ambient light.


    1138445239_93dmF-L.png

    It also includes a utility to change the profile being used.

    1138446523_mTtD3-L.png

    Newsy wrote: »
    Exactly! Normal ambient light is fine though many prefer to run the actual RGB part of the calibration in a dark room to ensure no stray light gets into the face of the puck. If your room is not super bright and you have no direct light shining onto the front of the monitor, and your puck is perfectly flush to the screen, I figure normal ambient is OK and required to use the ambient light feature of this device.


    As is mine.


    Merry Xmas.

    .
  • arodneyarodney Registered Users Posts: 2,005 Major grins
    edited December 27, 2010
    Dan7312 wrote: »
    The doc's for the Spyder 3 Elite seemed to imply I should calibrate the monitor in the ambient light I'm going to use display in.

    Kind of... You calibrate the luminance based on the print viewing conditions next to the display, the print you want to match visually. Other ambient light should be lower (as low as possible) and consistent (fixed). This is all outlined in the URL I posted.
    Andrew Rodney
    Author "Color Management for Photographers"
    http://www.digitaldog.net/
  • ThatCanonGuyThatCanonGuy Registered Users Posts: 1,778 Major grins
    edited December 28, 2010
    Well, I was just repeating what the Spyder software said... mine's Pro, are Pro and Elite different?
  • ThatCanonGuyThatCanonGuy Registered Users Posts: 1,778 Major grins
    edited December 28, 2010
    Oh I see. It says projection systems should be calibrated in a completely dark room. It does say to ensure that there is no light falling directly on the face of the monitor, to turn off overhead lights, and to close the blinds. So, I was wrong, but you're still supposed to get the light balanced and not shining right on the screen.
Sign In or Register to comment.