Help with Color Management/Calibration

Doug Solis

I have been using a Lenovo W700ds laptop, which has a built in rite/pantone Huey color calibration for a couple of years now. Every couple of weeks it asks for you to perform a color calibration which I do religiously. I have never printed any of my images; just post them on my website, up until last month. I had printed out at Bay Photo several large images which came back totally underexposed, and the colors seemed too warm as well. I thought it was a problem with the printing company but I happen to check my website on a friend’s computer and almost all my images are underexposed and the color seems too warm to boot. On a side note I also convert to profile sRGB for my website and email and RGB1998 for print as that was requested by the printing company.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
I can make slight adjustments to the Huey calibration software such as Gamma 1.8, 2.20. 2.40 also a color temp adjustment of d50, d65,d75. I’m currently at the middle adjustments for both gamma and color.<o:p></o:p>
Should my first step be to adjust the gamma to 2.40 to make the screen darker and change the color temp to d75 to make the screen cooler??<o:p></o:p>
Thanks much for the help<o:p></o:p>
The depressing part of this is I have to go back through all my images and adjust them to the new setting. Ugh! I just don’t want to have to do this several times.<o:p></o:p>

Newsy

Doug Solis wrote: »

I have been using a Lenovo W700ds laptop, which has a built in rite/pantone Huey color calibration for a couple of years now. Every couple of weeks it asks for you to perform a color calibration which I do religiously. I have never printed any of my images; just post them on my website, up until last month. I had printed out at Bay Photo several large images which came back totally underexposed, and the colors seemed too warm as well. I thought it was a problem with the printing company but I happen to check my website on a friend’s computer and almost all my images are underexposed and the color seems too warm to boot. On a side note I also convert to profile sRGB for my website and email and RGB1998 for print as that was requested by the printing company.<o:p></o:p>
I can make slight adjustments to the Huey calibration software such as Gamma 1.8, 2.20. 2.40 also a color temp adjustment of d50, d65,d75. I’m currently at the middle adjustments for both gamma and color.<o:p></o:p>
Should my first step be to adjust the gamma to 2.40 to make the screen darker and change the color temp to d75 to make the screen cooler??<o:p></o:p>
Thanks much for the help<o:p></o:p>
The depressing part of this is I have to go back through all my images and adjust them to the new setting. Ugh! I just don’t want to have to do this several times.<o:p></o:p>

ouch! that red type is almost unreadable...

Leave the gamma at 2.2 and the color temp at 6500K. No point in going to 5000K (d50) if the room you edit in is not a controlled lighting environment with bulbs at 5000K.

Dark or underexposed images are a hint that the brightness of the monitor is too bright in relation to the ambient lighting of the room you edit in.

Does the built in calibrator sample and give a value for white luminance?


Images that appear too warm are sometimes a symptom of viewing sRGB images on a wide gamut screen using software that is not color managed or is color managed but is being pointed to the wrong ICC profile. Skin tones, reds, and greens will appear overly vibrant/saturated.

Is your friends system calibrated?

Does he use a wide or standard gamut monitor? (if you tell me the make and model I can confirm it)

What browser we're you using to view the web images?

.

Newsy

PS... I just went through a few of your Smugmug galleries. Nothing there that is glaringly obvious to me except for one in Waterscapes - Makena Morning.

I'm viewing on dual calibrated sRGB gamut monitors, one an e-IPS and the other a S-PVA panel, using FireFox 3.6.x.x which is color managed, and Chrome.

arodney

I can make slight adjustments to the Huey calibration software such as Gamma 1.8, 2.20. 2.40 also a color temp adjustment of d50, d65,d75. I’m currently at the middle adjustments for both gamma and color.
Should my first step be to adjust the gamma to 2.40 to make the screen darker and change the color temp to d75 to make the screen cooler??

Yes. The ideal settings are those that produce a visual match of display and print. Read this:
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/why_are_my_prints_too_dark.shtml

Most web browsers are NOT color managed, you cannot gauge correct previews unless you are embedding a profile in the documents on the web and using Safari or FireFox.

Doug Solis

Newsy wrote: »

ouch! that red type is almost unreadable...

Leave the gamma at 2.2 and the color temp at 6500K. No point in going to 5000K (d50) if the room you edit in is not a controlled lighting environment with bulbs at 5000K.

Dark or underexposed images are a hint that the brightness of the monitor is too bright in relation to the ambient lighting of the room you edit in.

Does the built in calibrator sample and give a value for white luminance?


Images that appear too warm are sometimes a symptom of viewing sRGB images on a wide gamut screen using software that is not color managed or is color managed but is being pointed to the wrong ICC profile. Skin tones, reds, and greens will appear overly vibrant/saturated.

Is your friends system calibrated?

Does he use a wide or standard gamut monitor? (if you tell me the make and model I can confirm it)
[/COLOR]
What browser we're you using to view the web images?

.

Thanks much for the response Newsy, let me go through your questions the best I can, part of the problem is while I know Photoshop pretty well I have very little knowledge of color management for printing as I just started to print my images:

First, sorry for the red, i composed on Word then copied, yike it is pretty bad.

The sequence went like this, I submitted to a pro print shop one large jpeg to have a triptych in B/W done, the prints were returned way underexposed. I then sent in and had them do 5 evaluation prints (in color) which also came back underexposed and were very warm.

I then went to my website www.dougsolisphotography.com from my other computer which I very rarely use and have never calibrated it and the images looked underexposed, especially the most recent work from Washinton/Or and Colorado.

I need to look at my site from another computer that has been calibrated as you say just to confirm my findings. But the fact that the 5 evaluation prints all came back the same way is telling.

The built in calibration gives a value for corrected gamma and color temp after is does its thing. I can change both of these settings from a range of gamma 1.80-2.40 and color d50-d75, those are my only adjustments.

I'm using explorer 8

If you did have time could you take a peak at my website photos just to confirm the above. The images in Smugbug have to be pretty old I'm guesing.

I'll also spend some time reading the info Andrew suggested.

thanks again for the help.

jchin

tag ... I am also curious. My W701 experiences the same issue. My prints are darker than what they are in Lightroom on my screen. Maybe I should try setting gamma to 2.4 instead of 2.2.

arodney

jchin wrote: »

My prints are darker than what they are in Lightroom on my screen. Maybe I should try setting gamma to 2.4 instead of 2.2.

No! Read the URL I posted above. The issue is improper target luminance! The TRC gamma in ICC aware app’s has no role here.

jchin

Since Lightroom has no "soft proofing" option, what can we do? Any suggestions? I've tried to turn down the LCD brightness while I edit an image but that doesn't make it any better either.

arodney

jchin wrote: »

Since Lightroom has no "soft proofing" option, what can we do?

Soft proof in Photoshop.

Newsy

jchin wrote: »

Since Lightroom has no "soft proofing" option, what can we do? Any suggestions? I've tried to turn down the LCD brightness while I edit an image but that doesn't make it any better either.

I'd bet you're still not turning it down enough in balance against the ambient lighting of the room you edit in. Do you know the white luminance value of the 701's screen? How bright a room do you edit in?

An option is to turn the brightness of the panel down as low as it will go and then increase the ambient lighting of the room you edit it. Maybe go out and get some 5000K bulbs and try them while editing - better than the typical 3300K lighting most rooms have.

I know the 701 is a premium notebook but it still uses a pseudo 8bit TN panel and I can't imagine it has a whole lot of leeway in back light brightness - from what I can see from the limited online user manual I was able to find, it is just like other laptops in that it only has the Fn key + Home & End keys to adjust brightness.

For serious editing, you would be better served by attaching an external monitor. For starters you have full RGB hardware controls and true hardware controls for Brightness and Contrast. Then calibrate the monitor and use it for viewing images on which you edit.

If you want a real nice monitor with a wide gamut, attach a NEC PA241W.

.

Sam

Please note this is only my opinion.

Trying to color calibrate and use a laptop display to prepare images for printing is a losing proposition.

Buy a good monitor, then your in business.

I have a friend who has a 17 " Mac Book Pro. and let me tell ya the images just leap off that screen burning wonderfulness into your brain. The problem however is the prints would not match the screen. She has the same problem you have.

When she wanted a really nice print she would bring it to me. I have a Lacie 22" Blue CRT. (Unfortunately they no longer make these.)

Also it's important to remember matching or getting the print to be what you want isn't strictly science. You need all the good stuff plus experience, trial and error, some guesstimation, some fudging, and all important a good supply of witchcraft quality frogs hair and eye of neut.

Sam

jchin

Thanks Newsy. I am editing under "Daylight" CFL bulbs bought from Home Depot.

Thanks Sam. I guess I now know that my recycle bin is not the only one that is so full of discarded prints