What's up with Canon's mirrorless?

ThatCanonGuy

Will Canon release one about the same time as Nikon and Pentax? And did the EiS rumor ever get busted? (It sounded too good to be true).

I have an idea, because I'm sure Canon will put good video into it and market that like crazy (if they do release one). Why not call it the EOS-HD? You know, EOS-1 D, Ds, EOS-5 D, etc. So instead of 1-Series or 5-Series, make it H-Series. Then you can call it EOS-HD. Or would that be too confusing for customers?

And I sure hope it supports EF lenses with AF and everthing, even if it's done via adapter. I don't know who would buy it if it didn't; Panasonic and Olympus have it all figured out. Plus Sony with APS-C. They'd have to make it really, really good in order to sell it with no EF support.

Photoskipper

I am waiting for the mirrorless body from Canon to be my backup body with the Ls or lightweight travel kit with the APS-C kit lens.

borrowlenses.com

The mirrorless camera could give the 7D some serious competition. It will be interesting to see what Canon does with it.

ThatCanonGuy

Photoskipper: exactly what I was thinking. I'd love to slap a 400 2.8 on a mirrorless (I doubt I ever will have one) Actually, that and a 50 1.8 or 35 f2 and a 85 1.8 would be a nice lightweight kit.

Borrowlenses guy: Could you explain that? I was thinking more of a Rebel competitor(for consumers), maybe 60D... I hope it won't be in the 7D's price range, but if Canon goes high-end with this it very well could be.

Let's hope Canon does a Panny G-Style one for the masses and a higher-end one for us

Photoskipper

I hope the design engineer, product manager and market team from Canon would read this. Here is my suggestion:
1. Take the G12,
2. Take out the glasses,
3. Change to an APS-C sensor
4. Stick the EF mount or adaptor
5. Develop a pancake 24 mm F1.8 lens (Equivalant to 40 mm lens) to go with it.

Sounds simple:ivar, it looks like the PEN or NEX,

ThatCanonGuy

Sounds good. I'll add that it should be red, and hopefully won't require an adapter for EF. Hopefully good video like the GH2. And update the 35/2 and 50/1.4:D

I think your model would outsell all other mirrorless cams.

Edit: Now that I think about it, I wouldn't be surprised if Canon put an APS-H sensor in it.

Photoskipper

ThatCanonGuy wrote: »

Sounds good. I'll add that it should be red, and hopefully won't require an adapter for EF. Hopefully good video like the GH2. And update the 35/2 and 50/1.4:D

I think your model would outsell all other mirrorless cams.

Edit: Now that I think about it, I wouldn't be surprised if Canon put an APS-H sensor in it.

Color is not an issue to the new toys. It may be better to sell color jacket as accessories similar to the iPhone covers.

The adaptor is necessary to create the distance between the rear glass of the EF lens to the sensor. The bigger the sensor, the longer the distance. Anyway, the adaptor of EF lens to NEX is now available on line. The bigger the sensor, the longer the distance or more complicated optical design. I am happy with APS-C with 10 to 12 MP. If I need more juice, I can get back to the full DSLR body any time.

You are right that the market for such camera is huge. I did a rough market size survey and draft up the marketing plan. I think I should patent the design and concept first then sell it to the company so I would have a good retirement allowance.

ThatCanonGuy

Photoskipper wrote: »

Color is not an issue to the new toys. It may be better to sell color jacket as accessories similar to the iPhone covers.

The adaptor is necessary to create the distance between the rear glass of the EF lens to the sensor. The bigger the sensor, the longer the distance. Anyway, the adaptor of EF lens to NEX is now available on line. The bigger the sensor, the longer the distance or more complicated optical design. I am happy with APS-C with 10 to 12 MP. If I need more juice, I can get back to the full DSLR body any time.

You are right that the market for such camera is huge. I did a rough market size survey and draft up the marketing plan. I think I should patent the design and concept first then sell it to the company so I would have a good retirement allowance.

I know, color isn't an issue, a skin would be nice. Red is just Canon, it seems like it should be red.

That adapter is nice, I doubt it allows for AF like a Canon mirrorless would though.

I did a rough sketch for a mirrorless; it was fun. My model beats all others on the market now, and I'm sure most entusiasts/pros would agree. I'd sell it to the camera companies but none of them are smart enough to use it

ThatCanonGuy

Photoskipper wrote:

The adaptor is necessary to create the distance between the rear glass of the EF lens to the sensor. The bigger the sensor, the longer the distance. Anyway, the adaptor of EF lens to NEX is now available on line. The bigger the sensor, the longer the distance or more complicated optical design. I am happy with APS-C with 10 to 12 MP. If I need more juice, I can get back to the full DSLR body any time.

Then what about the APS-C in the NEX? What's different about NEX lenses that allows them to be used without an adapter? Is the glass farther away? I don't think so... If you can use NEX lenses with APS-C without an adapter, why wouldn't it be possible to use EF (assuming the body had an EF mount)?

ziggy53

ThatCanonGuy wrote: »

Then what about the APS-C in the NEX? What's different about NEX lenses that allows them to be used without an adapter? Is the glass farther away? I don't think so... If you can use NEX lenses with APS-C without an adapter, why wouldn't it be possible to use EF (assuming the body had an EF mount)?

There are several considerations and terms we should discuss.

A larger imager or film size normally does allow (or even require) a longer distance from the lens to the focal plane. Part of the reason for this is because you want the corner of the image to be coming from a relatively shallow angle. At too sharp an angle you start to get problems with vignetting and image sharpness suffers too. Partly it's also because a larger imager/film size normally requires longer focal lengths for specific FOVs.

For each lens mount design there is a specific "flange to focal plane distance", generally shortened to "flange-focus distance" or similar. All Canon EF and EF-S lenses share the same flange focus distance.

EF-S lenses do differ from EF lenses in their "back focus distance". EF-S lenses have a shorter distance from the rear element to the focal plane. This is allowed because of a smaller main mirror which does not impact the rear element like a larger FF mirror would.

The mirrorless cameras can allow an extremely short flange focus distance "and" a short back focus because there is no mirror to impact that part of the design decision. The native lenses for the mirrorless cameras do tend to have a wider exit angle from lens to focal plane than SLR designs.

ThatCanonGuy

So is it that EF lenses are made with a longer flange to focal plane distance than say, NEX? Does Canon have a specific distance from the back element to the sensor, and EF lenses can only focus light that distance? And that distance would be too great for mirrorless and would make the body too thick?

Because in Canon's mirrorless, there is no mirror to hit a close lens, so why couldn't they just make it EF mount instead of an adapter?

ziggy53

ThatCanonGuy wrote: »

So is it that EF lenses are made with a longer flange to focal plane distance than say, NEX? Does Canon have a specific distance from the back element to the sensor, and EF lenses can only focus light that distance? And that distance would be too great for mirrorless and would make the body too thick?

Because in Canon's mirrorless, there is no mirror to hit a close lens, so why couldn't they just make it EF mount instead of an adapter?

Yes, the Canon EF, and EF-S for that matter, flange focus distance is much greater than any of the current mirrorless designs. An adapter is required to allow for the greater distance when using an EF lens on a mirrorless body.

An EF mirrorless would not have a primary mirror or pentaprism/pentamirror, but without a shorter backfocus and shorter flange focus distance they would miss some opportunity for both size reduction and weight reduction.

More than likely Canon will either leverage the EF-S design lenses with a different lens mount specific to a mirrorless design, or develop both a new lens mount altogether with a new group of lenses as well.