I also use opaque cloning in lighten mode, but have found that if I want to keep a little more skin texture the soft-light-dodging works better, and doesn't take significantly longer once you've worked through it once. All useful techniques - I find myself using many of them, often in conjunction with each other! The main reason I mentioned it is because I know that Icebear is so anti anything-which-looks-retouched, and I've found it does leave more skin texture than cloning
It does... but it doesn't always leave the original texture. If I'm doing undereye circles via cloning I'm generally cloning from nearby skin that's lighter, but may not necessarily be from the around-eye area, since I don't want to pick up wrinkles/creases etc from nearby eye areas.
Then again, what magnification are you working at Zoomer - do you do it at very high resolution? I find if I do that I "lose my way", so generally I'm doing it so I can see at least 1/2 the face while I work on the eye area.
First of all I will say I think people are overthinking the whole baggy eye deal. For most people after doing the skin work it is a non issue. You should not get rid of the dark areas all the way on normal people it just looks weird...of course for models etc. that is different....also not much of an issue if the makeup was done properly.
Anyway back to dark circles under eyes. Clone tool 30 percent opacity, set on lighten or normal, soft brush.
Grab a fairly large spot as close a possible to the dark area, drag it up and clone it into the spot you want to lighten, apply it (click) as many times as required to achieve desired affect, move to the next spot.
I don't spend much time on it, don't zoom in much. It just take a few seconds and on to the next thing. I have done it so many times I can generally do it in a few clicks if I bother at all.
I have seen a VERY few photographers who do Amazing skin work that removes all the blemishes and still retains all the skin texture...I can count the number of photographers on one hand. For these guys any break in the texture of the skin for different areas would be noticeable. For the rest of us matching the texture exactly is a non issue at normally viewing sizes.
Doing the overall skin work evens out the textures, you can either do it first or last.
But we have had this discussion on skin work here before. Some people spend hours on it, others like me spend minutes.
Whatever works, that is why these discussion are very valuable to people starting out so they can see the different methods/philosophies.
And after all that... :whew Excellent!! You're the man!
"Photography is not about the thing photographed. It is about how that thing looks photographed." Garry Winogrand Avatar credit: photograph by Duane Michals-picture of me, 'Smash Palace' album
Zoomer, I will say that after our last discussion on this I really considered the amount of time I was spending on final images, and how much is "too much", which is one of the reasons I decided to dig deeper into skin retouching techniques to refine my workflow a bit. I now use several different methods (alone or in combination) depending on the needs of the image and, as I do more and more of it, have started developing a recipe I like that takes me a lot less time than it used to. I use CS3, fwiw - I really want to upgrade to CS5 if only for the more refined cloning algorithms!
John, while I take your point about veracity, this isn't a personal or editorial portrait, but a piece of public, promotional material, and therefore a little more retouching isn't necessarily out of order or ethically wrong, IMO. Like it or not, there are expectations out there from years of media manipulation, and this will fall into that category as something which will be in front of the eyes of the photographically uneducated who have those expectations, and thus is a whole different ball o' wax than a portrait one might hang on one's wall, or a character study where those "flaws" might actually be an integral part of it. Just my philosophical 2c.
Now, granted, I don't know where you started from so can't comment on whether you've gone "too far" or not, but seeing this end result does look like you've done very little. While you don't want to plasticize her (ugh - HATE that look!!), I do think you can remove the red spot on the right (CL) side of her nose, and the one actually on her nose (looks like a spot or a spider vein), reduce (just a bit! Perhaps patch tool at 30-50% opacity) her two forehead (between eyebrows) wrinkles, and lighten her camera left undereye area - there's a marked difference in undereye circles on each side, largely because of the disparity in light (which doesn't look like light because it's soft. Bad English, but hope that make sense - I'll clarify if it doesn't!). The lines around her eyes don't bother me at all and are well worth keeping, IMO - she needs to look her age and look like HER, not a doll! They add to her expression, too.
I think part of the reason we're noticing these things and feel a bit more skinwork is needed is because the light on her left (CR) is brighter and "burning out" skin flaws on that side, making the ones we can see more prominent. If you can equalize between the two sides - no more than that!! - I think it will help balance it up overall.
I agree with Heather about the light levels - definitely improves it on this monitor. I think because the beautiful natural light runs diagonally across her face below the nose, enough of her face is in soft shading that lifting it a bit like this really works.
HTH - I really like the light and airy feel to the shot!
I think you made some great points here and I haven't read beyond this post yet but I can't wait to dig in....
I can say after reading all this that I've learned quite a bit and I'll be applying some of the various techniques to see what works for me best in LR
Thanks guys for the interesting read.....
Comments
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21695902@N06/
http://500px.com/Shockey
alloutdoor.smugmug.com
http://aoboudoirboise.smugmug.com/
Then again, what magnification are you working at Zoomer - do you do it at very high resolution? I find if I do that I "lose my way", so generally I'm doing it so I can see at least 1/2 the face while I work on the eye area.
Anyway back to dark circles under eyes. Clone tool 30 percent opacity, set on lighten or normal, soft brush.
Grab a fairly large spot as close a possible to the dark area, drag it up and clone it into the spot you want to lighten, apply it (click) as many times as required to achieve desired affect, move to the next spot.
I don't spend much time on it, don't zoom in much. It just take a few seconds and on to the next thing. I have done it so many times I can generally do it in a few clicks if I bother at all.
I have seen a VERY few photographers who do Amazing skin work that removes all the blemishes and still retains all the skin texture...I can count the number of photographers on one hand. For these guys any break in the texture of the skin for different areas would be noticeable. For the rest of us matching the texture exactly is a non issue at normally viewing sizes.
Doing the overall skin work evens out the textures, you can either do it first or last.
But we have had this discussion on skin work here before. Some people spend hours on it, others like me spend minutes.
Whatever works, that is why these discussion are very valuable to people starting out so they can see the different methods/philosophies.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/21695902@N06/
http://500px.com/Shockey
alloutdoor.smugmug.com
http://aoboudoirboise.smugmug.com/
And just to show you that Barbie is within my repertoire (gratuitous musical reference in deference to present company) I give you:
Natural selection is responsible for every living thing that exists.
D3s, D500, D5300, and way more glass than the wife knows about.
It is about how that thing looks photographed." Garry Winogrand
Avatar credit: photograph by Duane Michals- picture of me, 'Smash Palace' album
~hums~ "I'm a Barbie girl... in a Barbie world..." (I hope you have the wretched thing stuck in your head for hours now that you've gone and put it into mine ....
Zoomer, I will say that after our last discussion on this I really considered the amount of time I was spending on final images, and how much is "too much", which is one of the reasons I decided to dig deeper into skin retouching techniques to refine my workflow a bit. I now use several different methods (alone or in combination) depending on the needs of the image and, as I do more and more of it, have started developing a recipe I like that takes me a lot less time than it used to. I use CS3, fwiw - I really want to upgrade to CS5 if only for the more refined cloning algorithms!
I think you made some great points here and I haven't read beyond this post yet but I can't wait to dig in....
Thanks guys for the interesting read.....
Come on Barbie . . . let's go party!
Natural selection is responsible for every living thing that exists.
D3s, D500, D5300, and way more glass than the wife knows about.