Second Shooter rates for California

Candid Mug

Hello all!

I have a question about rates for second shooters. I have my own photography business, but started working as a second shooter for a prominent wedding photographer last year. I had not done weddings before, so I did the first 6 weddings for free, used my own equipment, drove to them myself and edited my photos before handing them over. They used most of my photos when creating the couples’ online proofing gallery and also for slideshows and albums, etc. I have also done several engagement shoots for free with them for the experience and provided all photos edited, which they used in the proofing galleries.

I have an eye for wedding photography and produce sellable images. I feel confident that I could do a wedding myself at this point and plan to do so. The last two weddings I did for this company, they paid me only $100. I had to rent an L series lens and edit my own photos. I have now been asked to do another 12 weddings for them as a second shooter and they still want to pay me $100. I am insulted to say the least, since this equates to less than minimum wage.

My question: What is the average rate for a second shooter in California? I have Googled this question and come up with a wide range. I would very much appreciate if some lead photographers in CA could give me some advice on what a second should get paid. I feel like I am being taken advantage of and want to be better informed before responding. At this point in my life I am not interested in being someone's apprentice or go back to earning the wage I did a few decades ago.

Thanks!

Art Scott

I would not do it for a $100, unless I was absolutely starving....the wear on the cam is worth more than that alone.......However if for some reason you decide to go for it, then do yourself a favor tell them to supply you with memory cards...shoot and give them the cards and let them process them.
You still will not come out ahead but your not working at slave labor prices either.....

Get that work flow down to a few seconds in LR and no time in Photoshop or other pixel processor unless absolutely necessary and it is not necessary for proofs.

You did way more wedding for free to prove you can shoot and all than I would have or ever have done when I was starting out......2 was my max and I only shot, never processed a roll of film for any client that wanted me to shoot as a contract shooter............

Good Luck

Candid Mug

Thank you for your response. Well I am certainly not starving. I have a Masters degree and hold a full time professional position by day. I have got to a point in my life though, where I want to follow my passion and not just work for a paycheck.

I agree, the wear on my equipment is certainly an issue. I actually had one of my cameras lock up after several hours of shooting last weekend. Luckily, it is fine now, but worth considering.

I have no intent on continuing to be taken advanatge of, but I do not know the industry of wedding photography enough to know what a fair price is for a second. I have heard everything from $25 to $150 per hour, but the average seems to be about $75/hr. Any suggestions on reasonable second shooter rates?

Wachel

Are you allowed to use the images for your portfolio? That helps offset the pay a little.

I would consider you an experienced 2nd by now. $100 seems way too low for what you are doing. Good luck with the negotiations and keep us updated.

Sam

Hi Candid Mug,

A couple of questions: Where in CA are you located? The reason I ask is that I am located in San Jose. Do you have a web site with some wedding samples?

Shooting 6 weddings as a second for free as well as engagement sessions is, how shall i put this?.........not wise. Then shooting 2 additional weddings for $100.00 adds to the issue.

As for having to rent an L lens.....how did they make you rent this lens?

You shot 6 plus times for free, then shot 2 for $100.00. They are simply offering you the same amount of money you have already worked for. How can you now be insulted?

OK, now that that's out of the way...............Take a good look at the quality, and skill you offering. Get some independent opinions. You really want to establish as objectively as possibe if this company is offering you an opportunity, or taking advantage of you.

Once this is done you can decide on your next move. If this is the standard operating procedure for this company and their goal is to get free or very cheap help and have no intention of paying more, then you need to get away from them yesterday.

If on the other hand they recognize your growth and current skill level you are in a position to negotiate a fairer pay rate.

There are a very large number of variables with regard to a 2nd shooter pay rate. That said I think the common rate would range between $200.00 and $500.00 per wedding. This would not include any post processing and would give you rights to use the images in your portfolio. Depending on skill and client requirements the pay could be higher. I can't conceive of a lower rate.

Think about it this way............at $100.00 per wedding and an 8 hour wedding (including travel time, etc.) that would be $12.50 per hour. Gas and mileage to get to and from the wedding location, reception, and home: estimate. $20.00. Now you are down to $10.00 per hour. Now lets look at your current agreement of processing images and give you two hours for this, plus $1.00 for a DVD. Now your at: $7.90 per hour. We aren't done yet wear and tear on your equipment. Lets say $5.00 for the whale day.

Now your at a whopping $7.40 per hour. At this rate you could buy a new 5D II after only 35 weddings, or say a nice 70-200 2.8 IS after another 30 weddings.

This is just to get you thinking..the numbers and expense examples are just that..only examples.

Sam

Candid Mug

Thank you so much for your reply Sam!

I will start with my experience with this company and go from there. I agreed to shoot the first 6 weddings and the engagement shoots for free and I have no problem with that. I was happy to get the experience and learn from a pro. I appreciate everything I learned from them, the opportunity and the ability to use the photos for my profile/website, but now that I am consistently producing sellable shots, I don’t think I should be giving up my spare time and committing my Saturdays and Sundays for minimum wage. After shooting for free for the past several months, I was told that they wanted to start paying me, since I was ready to be a second shooter. I had already committed to the wedding when they told me they were only paying me $100 for this first paid gig to test me out and then they would pay me more. I did not consider minimum wage very appealing for my first paid wedding gig with them (6 hour wedding and 4 hours travel time), but I had committed to it already. The next one I did, I was not told ahead of time what I would be making. I went along with it to see what they would end up deciding on. I then found out it was only $100 again and then they offered me several other gigs for $100. I have not responded, as they clearly think I am capable, but insist on treating me like an intern. I have also been editing for them and they have been paying even more abysmally for that. They don’t make me rent L series lenses, but in order to get the best results at a wedding, it is a necessity.

I am located in San Diego and there is no shortage of weddings here.

I have done the math and it does not add up at all. I have also considered the wear on my own equipment and the time needed to edit. I have my own business to focus on and cannot give up prime days to work for peanuts. Your estimate of $200-$500 for a second shooter sounds much more reasonable and closer to what I had in mind.

You can view some of my older wedding stuff at this link, but the last two weddings are not posted yet and I have improved immensely since. The second link is my engagement gallery.

http://www.candidfx.com/Photography/Candidfx/15232057_t9xdG#1203224531_D6hE8[/COLOR]

http://www.candidfx.com/Photography/Engagements/15873010_TBMem#1197845113_pcPjv

Thank you again for taking the time to respond to my questions. I very much appreciate it.

JimKarczewski

I'm in Chicago, but I was seconding for $400 and I won't take any less than that for second. That's an 8 hour day, me handing them them images or downloading at the end of the night.

mbonocore

Hi Candid,

Like Sam says, $200-$500 WITHOUT doing the post processing is what you should be getting. That is roughly what I pay my second shooter, depending on what my final profit will be. It is an insult for them to offer you $100 and expect you to post process the images. I have seen your work. You are worth more than that. Good luck and let us know how it goes!

Candid Mug

Thank you everyone for your responses and thank you mbonocore for the compliment!

I did approach them with what I believe is a fair rate and told them I just could not work for that little. I have come to an agreement with them that allows me to get an increasing rate as I progress and starts me at a rate I can live with. I am glad I can keep shooting for them, but I also think it's time to start working on getting my own weddings as well. I just revamped my website to deliniate my categories a little better and prepare for the push I am making right away in advertising. I also just bought a brand new 5D Mark II, which I am pretty happy with!

Thanks again everyone; the advice and feedback is much appreciated! :