Just trying to figure out Portraits---helpful advice and cc's welcome

jimqjr

I posted a picture a while back with some good feedback. I by far am not a portrait picture person, like the Stars that are on this site. Which is why I am posting to get some opinons on crop, quality, and how much post is necessary or what other things I should be doing to get a better photo. I also understand that some of you are a must with external lighting for portraits for me I am not there yet when I flash I end up with a flat subject with no depth... I am learning lightroom and have not figured out photoshop so I have a big disadvantage especially with fly away hair strands. I realize I will need to learn that skill in order to become better though first things first. Thanks for looking.
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Thanks for looking and of course thanks for the feed back.

divamum

Pretty model, and a great start!

First thing is that they all look too dark on this monitor - I'd love to kick up the brightness so we can see those pretty eyes better! Best place to do that would have been when you were shooting with a brighter exposure (either through ap/ss, or adding more light with flash/reflector/changing position), but you can also lift them in post a bit more (although you'll probably have to add some noise reduction to compensate - this isn't a big deal in Lightroom, especially if you shot RAW).

Also, the light is coming from quite low in 1/2/3 (look at the catchlights in her eyes, which are at about 5 o'clock, and also how the shadow of her nose is going UP onto her cheek) - a slightly higher light source is usually more flattering. If you can't get the light source higher, you can always put the model lower

5 doesn't work for me because of the bright light on her arm - it takes my eye away from her face (which is also, IMO, too dark). Nice pose, but too many other things to distract in the frame, including the bit of branch in front of her (although you could clone that out if you choose), the bright highlight in the foreground, previously mentioned bright highlight on her shoulder etc etc

Crops and angles are generally good, and your'e on the right track!

jimqjr

Thanks for the reply.

I am wondering about the too dark I think the last one is a little dark the rest seem fine. I do Calibrate who knows. The last one got dark in the up load process sometimes they even end up on the red side when loading form lightroom to smugmug?

I did shot in raw, and I seemed to have a correct exposure though it is fixable.

The catch lights must be from off the ground or a reflection from something other than what I did. There were no lights used or bounced other than what was coming from mother nature.

When I took the pictures I said I didn't like the light that was hitting her and was ready to toss them out (first 3). Picture 4 was completely candid and she gave me that look and I quickly framed and took the photo. We were waiting for her family and she had just changed into the shirt, I told her we can never use a shirt with writing on it, it will screw up the picture....to which she said it was her favorite shirt.....oops, I was kidding with her. I did wonder how it would work. Then when I got them on my computer the shadows bothered me less and I thought the photos were great (not that my opinion is worth much in this area).

Being I have no formal background in photography I guess on a portrait there should be no face shadow. I am sure I can clean it up, it was the way I processed the photo that created a highlight look on the side of her face and hair. I used OnOne and used a canned look from the software called like Golden Hour or something.

I guess I have a lot more work ahead of me.

Thank you for taking the time to look and comment.

jimqjr

Hello DivaMum, I checked out your blog page...wow your pics are incredible. What camera and lens do you use for your landscape/architecture do you use?

Icebear

To build on what the Diva said . . . Google "Horror Lighting" or just have a look here. You're getting kinda close. That being got out of the way, the light ratio between the "bright side" and the "dark side" is too high. Too much difference in illumination for a "normal" portrait. If you aren't using artificial light, the way to bring up the light level on the dark side is by reflection. Either place your subject against a lighter colored wall, or us a reflective surface, like a piece of foam core board, or (better) a thing like this. Just make sure your reflector is big. Huge is generally better than big.

You're on your way. Shoot a lot, but try to learn from every session. You will get a lot of critique here if you ask for it. Some folks may critique your style, and you may or may not agree with what they say. That's OK. Pay close attention though when folks critique your lighting. That's what photography is all about.

Posing is hard. People can give you hints about that too, but a lot of that is personal style. You just have to learn how to get what you want from your subject.

jimqjr

Great.
I will check out the Horror lighting....glad to know that I am on the right path for the wrong direction.
A work in progress....

jimqjr

Okay after looking at the horror lighting I know that it wasnt that bad though I do get the point.
Portraits NO shadows

jimqjr

So would this be better. Again I am not using flash or modifiers I was just trying to use the sun for some back lighting to the hair. The photos were taken at 11:45 and the sun was high and harsh not the time I would have picked and I explained the problems.

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divamum

Thanks! Those were the pix from Scotland, right? Almost ALL of those were taken with a Canon s95 - incredible little camera! My dSLR is a 7d (you can see my portrait stuff at divamum.smugmug.com.)

Soft "modelling shadows" which help shape the planes of the face are absolutely vital in portraits, but the trick (and hard part!) is putting them where you want them. I think one of the best pieces of advice I ever got about light was something our own rwells said in a thread about reflectors (it's in the Technique forum somewhere if you search back far enough, I'm sure). I may be misquoting/paraphrasing, but it was something along the lines of "Good photography is putting light where you want it. and taking it away where you don't". Great advice

ETA (we posted simultaneously): 2nd batch #1 lighting is great (open shade is always good!), although the pose is a little stiff; #2 suffers from bright hotspots. You're on the right idea to use the sun as you did, but bright midday sun (as you point out) is a brute since if you expose correctly for the face, you blow out the areas where the sun is hitting. Fill flash would have helped some, so you can expose correctly for the background and then boost the face with the artificial light. Do you have a hotshoe flash (ie something other than the popup built into the camera)? If so, you can simulate off-camera directional lighting by bouncing it off a piece of foamboard or other light-coloured reflector, even outside.

Icebear

jimqjr wrote: »

Portraits NO shadows

Whoa there cowboy! If you have no shadows on a face, you've crossed over into a very specific kind of portraiture. More fashion or glamour than what I call "normal" portraiture.
As Diva said, you normally want nice soft shadows to model the facial structure. Back to my initial response to you, a good starting ratio between the lit and dark sides of the face is about 2:1. There are as many opinions about this as flavors of ice cream, but that's a good starting place. That's a much smaller difference than you might think, but it's instantly perceptible.

Icebear

OK, more hints. Try to not look up the nostrils. And by the same token, for most normal humans the underside of our chin is not the most flattering part of our body. A slightly higher camera position solves both problems. A two-fer.

angevin1

jimqjr wrote: »

Portraits NO shadows

b

Really, does it say that?

Icebear wrote: »

Whoa there cowboy! If you have no shadows on a face, you've crossed over into a very specific kind of portraiture.

Whew! That was close! I feel better now!

zoomer

Looks like you have some cute willing models.
My best advice to you is to find some Really Good portrait photographers, not just ok.
Look at their work and try to copy it....post for critique....try again...repeat.
It is a process:
Number one figure out how to get your exposures correct.
Learn to pick good settings in good light with non distracting backgrounds that don't compete with your subject. (yes portraits need shadows on the face for depth character and detail)
Once you have good exposures, in a good setting with proper light. You are most of the way there.

For what you posted the second group is much better:
Subject is not isolated from the background.
Angle is not ideal, shooting up her nose, double chin, light is flat.
She is a cute girl but you did not capture that with these shots.

Look at a lot of Good portraits, keep practicing, you will have it down in no time.

jimqjr

zoomer wrote: »

Looks like you have some cute willing models.
My best advice to you is to find some Really Good portrait photographers, not just ok.
Look at their work and try to copy it....post for critique....try again...repeat.
It is a process:
Number one figure out how to get your exposures correct.
Learn to pick good settings in good light with non distracting backgrounds that don't compete with your subject. (yes portraits need shadows on the face for depth character and detail)
Once you have good exposures, in a good setting with proper light. You are most of the way there.

For what you posted the second group is much better:
Subject is not isolated from the background.
Angle is not ideal, shooting up her nose, double chin, light is flat.
She is a cute girl but you did not capture that with these shots.

Look at a lot of Good portraits, keep practicing, you will have it down in no time.

Thanks everyone for the comments.
I have one more picture to submit. The highlights are blown out though it seems to work with the photo. Let me know what your thoughts are.
I found a portrait person that is going to work with me on Sunday...I hope it is a great day for photography outdoors and we see if you all think I am doing better.
Thanks again....last one of the group of photos.

zoomer

Sorry...that last shot is going the wrong direction.

Hackbone

To start try to find a shaded area such as under branches or awnings etc. Now make a fist and hold it up and turn yourself around,(your not doing the Hokey Pokey)and watch the light on the hand as it goes from bright to darker. Lets say your fingers are now the shaded area of your hand.....place your subject so her face is shaded just like your hand. If you get sploches of light on her face coming in thru the branches put something above her head to block the light. Now get a piece of white foam core board from an art shop and use it to reflect light back onto the face to brighten up one side of the face.

Memorize the look of the light you have in post 1 photo #4. That is what you should be striving for. There are other things you can do but get the direction of light down first.

Best of luck to you. Keep posting.

reyvee61

Off to a decent start and already plenty of great advice....I'll be watching your work progress here.