Night Football

r9jacksonr9jackson Registered Users Posts: 129 Major grins
edited May 14, 2011 in Sports
I have an assignment to shoot a couple of players at a night high school football game. I think I need flash, but have some questions. First of all, will I be allowed to use flash (I think I can get permission to shoot on the sideline). If so, what flash is best?

I will be shooting with a Canon 7D and will primarily use my new Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 lens (with OS). I also have a 1.4x teleconverter-costing a needed stop. I have several flash units including a Canon 430EX, Vivatar DF400MZ and a Sigma EF 530 DG Super. I also have a Stroboframe bracket and an off-camera cord. I could fire a flash remotely with several other items I have in my quiver (although I can't quite see how that would work at a football game).

Will any of these be powerful enough or do I need to rent something like a Quantum to get a little more oomph.
Randy

SmugMug: www.randyjacksonimages.com
Email: randyjacksonimages@cox.net
Photography Blog: http://randyonphotography.com

Comments

  • r9jacksonr9jackson Registered Users Posts: 129 Major grins
    edited April 23, 2011
    Well duh!
    r9jackson wrote: »
    I have an assignment to shoot a couple of players at a night high school football game. I think I need flash, but have some questions. First of all, will I be allowed to use flash (I think I can get permission to shoot on the sideline). If so, what flash is best?

    I will be shooting with a Canon 7D and will primarily use my new Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 lens (with OS). I also have a 1.4x teleconverter-costing a needed stop. I have several flash units including a Canon 430EX, Vivatar DF400MZ and a Sigma EF 530 DG Super. I also have a Stroboframe bracket and an off-camera cord. I could fire a flash remotely with several other items I have in my quiver (although I can't quite see how that would work at a football game).

    Will any of these be powerful enough or do I need to rent something like a Quantum to get a little more oomph.

    I am way ahead of the season so now this is just a theoretical question. My friends parents were thinking way ahead of time. I still would like an answer from you more experienced shooters.
    Also, is it possible to use flash for night tennis or would it be too distracting? I would think it would.
    Randy

    SmugMug: www.randyjacksonimages.com
    Email: randyjacksonimages@cox.net
    Photography Blog: http://randyonphotography.com
  • nitewagnitewag Registered Users Posts: 31 Big grins
    edited April 23, 2011
    First off let me say I'm in no way a pro on this, but I've chosen not to use a flash for night football so I could never be accused of being a distraction. Using almost the exact same setup you described except my sigma is not the OS model i just bumped up the ISO until i got what I wanted. Here is a link to shots of mine from the worst lighting of the season last year http://billyvaughan.smugmug.com/Page-Athletics/Page-vs-Red-Bank/14548150_zCL9P#1082626317_qBgVQ May not be any help but at least give you an idea of what a novice can do
    www.billyvaughan.smugmug.com
  • nipprdognipprdog Registered Users Posts: 660 Major grins
    edited April 23, 2011
    r9jackson wrote: »
    (I think I can get permission to shoot on the sideline)

    That needs to be settled, before anything else. mwink.gif
    Jim

    http://www.knippixels.com
  • r9jacksonr9jackson Registered Users Posts: 129 Major grins
    edited April 24, 2011
    Sideline shooting
    nipprdog wrote: »
    That needs to be settled, before anything else. mwink.gif

    I will be working on that through the summer.
    Randy

    SmugMug: www.randyjacksonimages.com
    Email: randyjacksonimages@cox.net
    Photography Blog: http://randyonphotography.com
  • ChessmasterChessmaster Registered Users Posts: 10 Big grins
    edited April 24, 2011
    Nice job Randy
  • johngjohng Registered Users Posts: 1,658 Major grins
    edited April 24, 2011
    The sigma will be powerful enough. Not familiar with the others. Don't worry about remote flash - you wouldn't know where to set it. I wouldn't use the TC because of focus issues - when in AI-Servo, the focus assist beam will not function.
    Realize though that at 200mm you only have about 25 yards of reach - not a lot. You'll want to be in portrait orientation and make sure your subject fills 3/4 of the frame.

    Now, you can't shoot with flash like you would other sports - you can't rattle off 5-6 shots - 2 or 3 max and you have to give the flash time to cool down. Try and take 1000 photos in a half and you'll burn out the flash - literally. You do need to get the flash off the camera though - your bracket if it extends - but I prefer mounting on my monopod - more stable than a bracket and you get more distance from the camera.
    My setup:
    1015825251_esEeD-M.jpg

    results:
    1003055079_bPBrL-L.jpg

    1059484314_FjCL5-L.jpg

    1059486081_wsr5Q-L.jpg
  • S-squaredS-squared Registered Users Posts: 11 Big grins
    edited April 24, 2011
    Really great idea to secure the flash on the monopod... I will definitely give that a try next season.

    I take a lot of High School pictures and football is, by far, the most challenging. I doubt you will have any trouble getting on the sidelines, but you can always go to the local newspaper and get a media pass in exchange for free photos.

    You won't need the Optical Stabilization when shooting football, or any sports, because you won't be shooting as shutter speeds that slow. You will also want it turned off because the lens doesn't focus until it's stabilized. Which, in most cases, is hardly noticeable. However, football moves fast and you don't want any hesitation.

    A 70-200 f/2.8 or 80-200 f/2.8 (nikon) are the best choices for High School ball. You can typically get very close to the action and roam the entire sidelines. So, good luck! Try without a flash at ISO 1600 @ f/2.8. Then you can move the ISO up and down from there. The flash is going to slow you down and it takes a lot of shots to get good, usable photos of football. The key is being able to see the eyes of the players... Which can be challenging with the face mask, rapid movement, and low light. But it is such a great feeling when you get it!

    www.s-squaredphotography.com
  • schlpicschlpic Registered Users Posts: 35 Big grins
    edited April 28, 2011
    John--on the monopod setup--Do you ever feel it's cumbersome to use the monopod? Sometimes you need to move quickly to get out of the way of the players. It looks as though the flash is about knee height. Have you ever considered using a strap around your calf/or right above you knee for the flash, if you're using a 80-200 lens or something a little smaller (easily handheld) than is pictured (if you also needed the monopod for camera support in the setup shown). Just curious/thinking of next season. ~Shelley
  • johngjohng Registered Users Posts: 1,658 Major grins
    edited April 28, 2011
    I work with a sigma 120-300 2.8. I much prefer a monopod for that lens for load bearing. If I were using a 70-200 I wouldn't use the monopod. Truth be told the monopod doesn't really slow you down a whole lot. The biggest drawback to a monopod is how it impacts your ability to quickly pan. But that's more of an issue for other sports.

    Still, you could try your approach of attaching the flash to your leg. Whatever works.
  • TmetroffTmetroff Registered Users Posts: 92 Big grins
    edited April 28, 2011
    I currently work for a local newspaper and nighttime football is always the hardest. What I always use to do was crank up my ISO because the paper I work for doesn't care how grainy it is as long as I get a good action shot! But if you want more crisp shots I would suggest using a flash, its not as big of a deal (distraction wise) as it would be as indoor sports such as volleyball or basketball.

    As for getting permission I would say ask permission first, I have a press pass which allows me to be on the field. I doubt it would be a problem though!
  • 73Rocks73Rocks Registered Users Posts: 147 Major grins
    edited April 28, 2011
    r9jackson wrote: »
    I have an assignment to shoot a couple of players at a night high school football game. I think I need flash, but have some questions. First of all, will I be allowed to use flash (I think I can get permission to shoot on the sideline). If so, what flash is best?

    I will be shooting with a Canon 7D and will primarily use my new Sigma 70-200mm f/2.8 lens (with OS). I also have a 1.4x teleconverter-costing a needed stop. I have several flash units including a Canon 430EX, Vivatar DF400MZ and a Sigma EF 530 DG Super. I also have a Stroboframe bracket and an off-camera cord. I could fire a flash remotely with several other items I have in my quiver (although I can't quite see how that would work at a football game).

    Will any of these be powerful enough or do I need to rent something like a Quantum to get a little more oomph.

    I read your post and noticed that I might be able to offer a few tips.
    <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
    Seeing as I use almost the same equipment (Canon 50D, Sigma 70-200 f2.8, Canon 430EX Speedlight) I can tell you what I discovered over last season that works best for me. In dire circumstances I do have a Canon 50mm fixed f1.4 lens to use from time to time and although I can dial up the speed quite a bit with it, it regulates me to about a 30 yard span of action.
    <o:p></o:p>
    I wouldn’t use the Teleconverter as the extra range you will get will probably be out of your flash range.
    <o:p></o:p>
    1<SUP>st</SUP> of all, I am assuming that you will be shooting under “not the best lighting” conditions. Up here in NE SD where I shoot for a small paper at small school fields, lighting is my biggest obstacle. That being said, I can get good results by shooting in Manual, Shutter Speed around 500/sec, Aperture wide open at 2.8, and ISO of about 640 or 500.
    <o:p></o:p>
    Seeing as I have a press pass I can shoot from the sidelines which really helps me out. One thing I haven’t done is mount the flash on my monopod.
    <o:p></o:p>
    But by far the biggest tip that helped me out is to take my flash, put it to Manual, and cut back the power by at least ½. I was reluctant to do this as I was afraid that it would really darken my images but it works great. Try it once . . . you will find that your images will be a lot richer and there will be a lot less “red-eye” to process out.
    <o:p></o:p>
    Here are 4 shots from the last game of the season using the reduced flash technique:

    1069294572_cqRME-L.jpg

    1069294715_xyyG6-L.jpg

    1069295528_FW9Tk-L.jpg

    1069295658_5zMr2-L.jpg

    Hope this helps you out.
  • rwellsrwells Registered Users Posts: 6,084 Major grins
    edited May 3, 2011
    Sport Shooting at Night Using Flash
    Randy
  • RuntscalRuntscal Registered Users Posts: 122 Major grins
    edited May 14, 2011
    <a href="http://www.monicamanning.com/Sports/Football-2010/SGP-vs-Mesquite-Sept-2010/13625143_qyQDj#994861191_ogcTw-A-LB&quot; title=""><img src="http://www.monicamanning.com/Sports/Football-2010/SGP-vs-Mesquite-Sept-2010/msq0502/994861191_ogcTw-M.jpg&quot; title="" alt=""></a>

    <a href="http://www.monicamanning.com/Sports/Football-2010/SGP-vs-Duncanville-Loading/14220509_BpsRD#1060938777_ywbzs-A-LB&quot; title=""><img src="http://www.monicamanning.com/Sports/Football-2010/SGP-vs-Duncanville-Loading/dville6841/1060938777_ywbzs-M.jpg&quot; title="" alt=""></a>

    <a href="http://www.monicamanning.com/Sports/Football-2010/SGP-vs-Duncanville-Loading/14220509_BpsRD#1050494170_7NEEa-A-LB&quot; title=""><img src="http://www.monicamanning.com/Sports/Football-2010/SGP-vs-Duncanville-Loading/dville6596/1050494170_7NEEa-M.jpg&quot; title="" alt=""></a>

    Sigma 70-200 2.8 on monopod with Canon 50d at 1600 for night --- adjust shutter between 320 & 500 at 3.2 & 2.8 respectively (depends on field position).

    No flash ---- run images through Noise Ninja

    Randy -- noticed your examples were SGP Warriors ---- that's who I've been shooting.

    www.monicamanning.com Under Public Galleries - Sports - Football
    http://monicamanning.smugmug.com

    Thanks, Monica
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