Advice Needed!

El Comat · May 25, 2011

Hello fellow grinners!

I'm shooting my first wedding in a month (favour for my wife's friend), and I'm starting to wonder if my setup is adequate. I have a gripped XSi, 580 EX II, 17-55 2.8, 50 1.8, 75-300 non-IS and will be borrowing a 70-200 2.8 IS for the day. Would I be wise to add a second body for a backup (or just to have two ready to shoot at all times)? I'm thinking about adding another XSi or perhaps a T1i/T2i. It's a rookie photog's dream day....outdoor ceremony followed by a reception in "The Cavern", which is dark and has rock for walls/ceiling :help. I was thinking of buying a gripped T2i for the wedding, then selling both the XSi and T2i to fund a 7d. Then if another wedding/event came up that required a backup, I'd buy another low cost Rebel for my 2nd camera. Any thoughts? I'm new to the "for hire" side of things and open to all suggestions, whether on gear or technique!

Adam

ThatCanonGuy · May 25, 2011

I wouldn't shoot a wedding for any friend or family member; if something goes wrong your relationship may be in danger.

ESPECIALLY IF YOU'VE NEVER SHOT A WEDDING BEFORE.

Hire an assistant for a few hundred bucks to back you up. It's well worth it.

ziggy53 · May 25, 2011

I regard a second body and lens as a "necessity" for a wedding. During the ceremony there is no time for error and if something acts up you need to be instantly ready with an alternate system. For other times you can have different lenses on each body allowing rapid changes of FOV. (I'm doing a wedding in 2 Saturdays and I will be the third photographer. I will have at least 4 camera bodies with me.)

I do recommend an external power supply for the 580EX II if you need rapid recycling. The external power supply also extends the life of your batteries, allowing longer times between battery changes. It does add weight and bulk to your setup so it's not for everyone or every situation.

Use a flash modifier and flash bracket to help disperse the light and get it higher off your camera. This will improve your images more than anything else. It is especially helpful for the dark "cavernous" shooting conditions where you get no bounce.

The one I particularly recommend for this situation (DIY):

http://www.fototime.com/inv/908195739C4C0D3

ziggy53 · May 25, 2011

ThatCanonGuy wrote: »

I wouldn't shoot a wedding for any friend or family member; if something goes wrong your relationship may be in danger.

...

Hire an assistant for a few hundred bucks to back you up. It's well worth it.

This is very good advice.

TaDa · May 25, 2011

A wedding is usually a once in a lifetime sort of event. You do not want to be the one responsible for the couple not having photographic memories of the event.

It's also difficult shooting situations (dark churches that do not allow flash, dark reception halls with variable lighting, etc.) Then factor in that the groom is usually wearing black and the bride is wearing white, it makes metering properly just another thing that you need to factor in. My advice is going to be even a little more extreme. Don't think about hiring an assistant. Have the couple hire a photographer that has earned his stripes with wedding photography, and then ask if you can be HIS/HER second shooter for free. There is much to learn and having a good teacher in the situations will greatly help you on your future endeavors.

El Comat · May 25, 2011

TaDa wrote: »

A wedding is usually a once in a lifetime sort of event. You do not want to be the one responsible for the couple not having photographic memories of the event.

It's also difficult shooting situations (dark churches that do not allow flash, dark reception halls with variable lighting, etc.) Then factor in that the groom is usually wearing black and the bride is wearing white, it makes metering properly just another thing that you need to factor in. My advice is going to be even a little more extreme. Don't think about hiring an assistant. Have the couple hire a photographer that has earned his stripes with wedding photography, and then ask if you can be HIS/HER second shooter for free. There is much to learn and having a good teacher in the situations will greatly help you on your future endeavors.

Thanks for the advice folks. The bottom line is that I'll be shooting the wedding by myself (with my wife helping out). The couple is very relaxed, and know that I'm doing this as a favour and to gain experience. They aren't looking for pro results, and I've made it clear not to expect that. I did their engagement shots, and they were very happy with them, and had many inquiries as to who took the pics. So with that being said, I realize that a wedding is different, hence coming on here for advice. I've found a 20d to use as a back-up/2nd camera, and will possibly buy a T2i or 40d if I find a good deal.

Keep the good ideas coming!

Adam

time2smile · May 25, 2011

if its the difference between, not having wedding pics and you.

i shot a wedding with a P&S Fuji 602, no backup equipment, they loved them.

Sometimes a couple just can't swing all the bells, put a disposable on each table, if you can swing it get a backup, if anything with a second lens, have fun, if the bride and groom appreciate what you did for them, all will be well, if they have a stick in them, well then you will never make them happy......

time2smile · May 26, 2011

Richy, thank you i fully agree....

As far as the original post goes, no one is ever fully prepaired......

things go wrong........sometimes, your lucky......

when i did the 602, well i've been shooting since the 80's, i would these day bring a second body with me,
i would rent up, and see the feathures that i am currently missing, but get to know your rented body well,

you are on the right track to care about this shoot, it shows that you are here....

Matthew Saville · May 26, 2011

If YOU are wondering whether or not your EQUIPMENT is adequate, YOU are probably not adequate. I'm not trying to be a prick or a young punk, I'm just trying to make sure the bride ends up with great photos of her wedding day. So, forget the equipment, my question is, ...how confident are you with your skills at the four following elements:

1.) Posing

2.) Lighting

3.) Composition

4.) Timing

These four elements must come together, all of them if possible depending on whether the shot is posed or candid... The bottom line is, an experienced professional could probably *kill* a wedding with the equipment you've listed, even though yes, a full-frame camera and a couple better lenses would be preferred.

If you aren't highly confident with your abilities in those four elements of portraiture / photojournalism, then no amount of equipment will help, and in fact buying a new camera just one or two weeks before a big first job will HURT the images sometimes, if you don't have enough time to master the camera. Honestly, I don't feel truly comfortable with a camera until I've shot with it for like 6 months and a dozen or so jobs.

I agree with Richy, who says:

sometimes the reality is different. I'm not being a jaded auld buggah, just some life experience. many times the couple can afford someone else, they're just prioritizing their money elsewhere because they think they can get just as good for free on the photography side and hey that $500 tog budget buys a lot of beer for the party.

I won't jump to a conclusion about your couple in particular, but I will say that if you show up to shoot their wedding and they've got a limo, nice shoes / dress / boquet / cake etc. ...then congratulations, you've been taken for a ride by someone who doesn't appreciate photography. Probably, that is not the case in this case, but just so you know what to watch out for.

The absolute BEST thing I can advise is to use a community like this to connect with another, more experienced wedding photographer in your area, and ask them to assist you for a normal 2nd shooter fee. They'll at least get clean, sharp images of critical moments so that YOU won't feel so pressured. They might even be willing to do a couple poses etc, as long as you're processing the images. It should only cost the couple an extra couple / few hundred bucks, and their peace of mind will be very worth it. I do this all the time through the school for newer wedding photographers in Southern California...

Good luck,
=Matt=

El Comat · May 26, 2011

Thanks for the reply, Matt (and everyone else). I do feel confident in my lighting/composition/timing, and my wife is good at posing, so I think we'll be ok in those areas. I never questioned whether my equipment was adequate, but I was more worried about having enough redundancies and/or the proper setup. The couple has been living together for some time now, so it's not your typical old-fashioned, fairy tale princess wedding...the ceremony is in the bride's parent's back yard (I'll be praying for a cool overcast day!). Hiring a second shooter is out of the question, they aren't interested in spending big $$$ (heck, I don't even know what they'll pay me yet, if anything). I'm a bit of a perfectionist, which I think will help me. Even though I'm nowhere near a pro, I still aim for pro results. Perhaps I could upload a few sample shots from the e-shoot and I get get some c&c for my general technique. How do you upload pics at less than original size? I got harped on last time for uploading the full thing.

Thanks,
Adam

El Comat · May 26, 2011

I'm new to Flickr, but I think this link should work:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/63315848@N05/

Adam

Brett1000 · May 26, 2011

El Comat wrote: »

I'm new to Flickr, but I think this link should work:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/63315848@N05/

Adam

I think you'll do fine. I see some pics where the lighting could have been better. A fast prime that would help isolate the subject and for pics in the "cavern" otherwise a backup camera body and 70-200 2.8 and you're good to go !

El Comat · May 26, 2011

Thanks Brett! I picked up the 20d and 70-200 today, so I'll have to play around with both to get used to them, though the 20d seems remarkably easy to use going from an XSi, other than having to get used to the top display (very nice!). Also, I fired some test shots with the 20d and the noise at 1600 and 3200 wasn't nearly as bad as I thought it would be. The techy geek in me will have to do a Xsi/20d comparison, otherwise I'll think my eyes are playing tricks on me. I may have a good lead on a gripped 40d, as well as a 50d...any thoughts? I've heard the high ISO noise on the 40d is better, but the 50d has a few extra features along with 5 more MP.

Thanks,
Adam

PS - I have the nifty fifty if the cavern is really dark

Overfocused · May 27, 2011

Make them sign a no-expectations contract

Matthew Saville · May 27, 2011

El Comat wrote: »

Thanks for the reply, Matt (and everyone else). I do feel confident in my lighting/composition/timing, and my wife is good at posing, so I think we'll be ok in those areas. I never questioned whether my equipment was adequate, but I was more worried about having enough redundancies and/or the proper setup. The couple has been living together for some time now, so it's not your typical old-fashioned, fairy tale princess wedding...the ceremony is in the bride's parent's back yard (I'll be praying for a cool overcast day!). Hiring a second shooter is out of the question, they aren't interested in spending big $$$ (heck, I don't even know what they'll pay me yet, if anything). I'm a bit of a perfectionist, which I think will help me. Even though I'm nowhere near a pro, I still aim for pro results. Perhaps I could upload a few sample shots from the e-shoot and I get get some c&c for my general technique. How do you upload pics at less than original size? I got harped on last time for uploading the full thing.

Thanks,
Adam

Hey Adam,

I totally understand that some people just wanna get married, and even a "ceremony" is a bit frivolous. I mean when you want to spend the rest of your life with someone, that's really all that matters. The world doesn't revolve around portraits and photography.

The best thing to do is to just practice your "four important elements", and of course get to know any new gear before going into a "job"... If you get those ducks in a row, and especially judging from how well the engagement session turned out; the couple will certainly be delighted (and indebted) to receive your images.

I just want every photographer out there to take this seriously, prepare, think things through, etc... :-)

=Matt=

ThatCanonGuy · May 27, 2011

I bet that 20D feels nice after holding a Rebel

I'd take a 20D over any Rebel. You can't beat 8.2 mp @ 5fps (and a big comfy hand grip) for under $300 used

The 40D is very nice, and some people say it has better IQ than the 50D. Either camera would be fine, and would beat any Rebel IMHO.

WillCAD · May 27, 2011

Overfocused wrote: »

Make them sign a no-expectations contract

+1

No matter how much they tell you they'll be okay with whatever you shoot, there is always the possibility that the couple will find fault, or just as likely likely, that the MOTHERS will find fault, with the imagery.

Weddings are like boxing matches: Keep your hands up, and protect yourself at all times.

Advice Needed!

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