Advice on a potential sale

Wiren

My local hospital (where I happen to work) just completely re-did their maternity ward. The facilities director asked if I did anything in canvas - to which I answered, "certainly!"

They plan to have a meeting with me next week to talk about their idea's on a "special" project to which my photos, in canvas, may play a pivotal role..... :clap

I have ordered an 8x10 sample stretched canvas print to have ready for the meeting. If they use my photo's in canvas to completely redecorate the maternity ward, it has the potential to be a huge sale for me. :barb

I am asking those of you who have nailed sales like this (3K and up) for your advice... what can I do or say to seal the deal? I think I have priced well enough (8x10 starts at $199.99 up to the 30x40 size for $399.99), to make some good money but not be enough for them to walk away...... I hope.

What say you about the pricing - I feel it's commensurate with my abilities and would be satisfied about the profit, don't want to price so high I lose the sale though.... would you look at my landscapes and tell me how you feel? http://www.onthewallphoto.net/Nature/Landscape/16746377_zhzkzz

Anything else I can do to prepare? What are the right questions to ask them about their needs/wants?

I would appreciate any and all advice, but mainly from those with experience in large project sales.

Thanks in advance.

Lee

Mark Dickinson

Well I think the thing they are going to look for and tell you is that.... We can feature your work here and help you sell them. The maternity ward here in Daytona Beach did the same thing. I offered to donate my work to them because they had old outdated baby pics and maternity belly shots. The benefit would have been great. I still don't know why they haven't accepted it or gotten back to me, they haven't made any changes and this was at the request of the person in charge of the mat ward.

Here's what I think, (I may be wrong)

A hospital has a budget, sometimes high sometimes low. By you working there they are going to see it as a hobby for you and a benefit. So tear that out and get the hobby out of their heads if they do that. Canvas' are hard to sell I currently sell about 500.00 a month in profits. I have marked my canvas' down to almost near cost with a coupon, and I just haven't sold them to clients specifically.

Stick with where you feel comfortable with, when you give the price, watch body language, and then work it in if you see negative responses physiologically and start to work in packages for 10 and discount the prices for all of them as a package if they look at you cross eyed. It seems the ratio is way off, in a benefit for them, 199 for 8x10, and the 4x the size for 2x the cost (they will hopefully see the benefit to go big).

If they offer to place them up for sale, (then this might be their option as well as a position to get them in there at no charge) they will either say give a cut or for putting the work in there to be featured is the benefit its self.

I hope you get the pay. http://shouldiworkforfree.com/ <--- says NO don't do it for free.

Wiren

Mark Dickinson wrote: »

Well I think the thing they are going to look for and tell you is that.... We can feature your work here and help you sell them. The maternity ward here in Daytona Beach did the same thing. I offered to donate my work to them because they had old outdated baby pics and maternity belly shots. The benefit would have been great. I still don't know why they haven't accepted it or gotten back to me, they haven't made any changes and this was at the request of the person in charge of the mat ward.

Here's what I think, (I may be wrong)

A hospital has a budget, sometimes high sometimes low. By you working there they are going to see it as a hobby for you and a benefit. So tear that out and get the hobby out of their heads if they do that. Canvas' are hard to sell I currently sell about 500.00 a month in profits. I have marked my canvas' down to almost near cost with a coupon, and I just haven't sold them to clients specifically.

Stick with where you feel comfortable with, when you give the price, watch body language, and then work it in if you see negative responses physiologically and start to work in packages for 10 and discount the prices for all of them as a package if they look at you cross eyed. It seems the ratio is way off, in a benefit for them, 199 for 8x10, and the 4x the size for 2x the cost (they will hopefully see the benefit to go big).

If they offer to place them up for sale, (then this might be their option as well as a position to get them in there at no charge) they will either say give a cut or for putting the work in there to be featured is the benefit its self.

I hope you get the pay. http://shouldiworkforfree.com/ <--- says NO don't do it for free.

Thank you for your response!! love that should I work for free page, awesome <img src="https://us.v-cdn.net/6029383/emoji/rolleyes1.gif&quot; border="0" alt="" >

The hospital tried to put one of my photo's up with name recognition previously - epic fail as everybody who has taken at least one shot in focus of a flower wanted their artwork up also, had to take mine down and no offering of that program any longer.

The community where I live isn't very affluent and they know that, I cannot imagine them trying to offer me space to show my work (limited to canvas) for sale... besides, that would spur the rest of the hobbyists to request letting them hang their photo's along my work - I don't think facilities would care to do that. So I am hoping this is for flat out purchase!

Do you think I need to lower the pricing? Do I have higher than normal expectations in your opinion.

Appreciate your feedback.

Lee

Sam

As I see it your jumping all around and making all kinds of assumptions. Stop, you can't anticipate every scenario.

You work there, you have an in, you will be able to get all the facts and then make a proposal.

Simply take a note book to the meeting and listen to what they have to say. They said they had idea's on a "special" project that would involve your photography. Listen, don't anticipate. Get all the facts. What type of images are they looking for? What size are they looking for? How many? Very important, what is their budget? What is their time frame?

Once you have all the details you will be able to first determine if you have skill and equipment to complete the project. If not can you rent equipment, hire external help with the skill experience needed to complete the project? There are options! Don't try and negotiate on the spot. Leave the meeting do your home work and get back to them.

As A side note I think $200.00 for an 8X10 canvas from an unknown photographer is very high. That said I think $400.00 for a 30X40 is too low.

I personally would try and work out a package price, rather than a per image or print price. Don't approach this as selling photos. Think of it as taking their vision and turning it into reality, all within their budget, (if possible)

You may find the budget to be way below what is necessary to complete the project. If so you can attempt to explain why their budget won't work and if they can't see that or can't increase it, just thank them for the opportunity to discuss their project with them and walk away.

On the other hand they could actually have a budget higher than needed. If that's the case your in great shape.

These are my thoughs, please let us know how the meeting goes.

Sam

Wiren

Thank you Sam, very sage advice. It's hard not to jump to any assumptions or get hopes up when you have been trying to sell stuff and finally get something that may be more than the 2 or 3 print $20 profit sale. I will take your advice to heart and let you all know how the meeting goes.

I appreciate also your thoughts on pricing.

Lee

MomaZunk

The old saying in sales is "He who says the price first loses."
Do your best to understand their budget and needs before offering a price.
Assuming they are asking for new work, I also would not necessarily offer a price per piece either. I would look at pricing the overall project to include time on site, rentals, processing time, creative fee, then the actual finished product.

I would also be sure to have a contract that includes the licensing language associated with the images. With thoughts on how to price any additional copies for other hospitals(assuming this is a chain), or perhaps brochures. Who knows this could be a whole marketing campaign. I'm just dreaming big now I know.

Wiren

Update on the Sale
Ok, met with the facilities director and staff yesterday. Saw the "start" of the project... a corridor where they will need 6 large photo's to start. They will have 3 waiting rooms and some more halls later...

I showed them a sample of a stretched canvas that they liked, but I also showed them a copy of a metal print. That went over great, they like the durable surface, the way it hangs, no $$ for frame and that the fire marshal will love them not putting up anything that is easily flammable.

I tried to get them to name their budget.... no dice. They tried to get me to name price, when asked directly how much a 30x40 would be, I told them;

I do not want to give a direct answer right now, I will have to verify material costs before I give a concrete quote. They pressed again and I told them give or take... a 30x40 would roughly be a little over $500

They acted like .... well, we could go with these crappy prints we have a couple of...... (70's style water color type paintings of very round bodied people done by an artist clearly not a pro). I know they really want those metal prints...Yay metal!

I told them I would get them a gallery set up with suggestions and get them a price list to look at. I plan to offer as well as them purchasing from the site, that they can order direct through me at a price (that I have yet to set) that is a pre-order non-refundable down payment with the balance due at delivery.

So.... let's hear it, i'm ready for tips, pointers, lessons and advice on how to proceed.

Thank you

Lee

deb22

Good start, What I do is give them a discount for exposure but lock them into a multi year contract and turnover the pics at a 6month interval. That way you get exclusive rights to the area and hopefully additional work from the walk in traffic. This sounds like your first big sale so exposure is very important more than even money at this stage. make sure you cover your cost of producing and also a modest profit but do your best not to lose this sale. good luck!! and make sure you have an adequate contract to lock them into, don't assume you can trust them cause you work there.

Wiren

deb22 wrote: »

Good start, What I do is give them a discount for exposure but lock them into a multi year contract and turnover the pics at a 6month interval. That way you get exclusive rights to the area and hopefully additional work from the walk in traffic. This sounds like your first big sale so exposure is very important more than even money at this stage. make sure you cover your cost of producing and also a modest profit but do your best not to lose this sale. good luck!! and make sure you have an adequate contract to lock them into, don't assume you can trust them cause you work there.

I so appreciate your response Deb... they are antsy to get this going as they have been booting it around for more than a month... with no quick response on here, I already gave them my pricing and am awaiting their answer. 30x40 Metal print for $450...

How does the contract deal work, sounds like a great plan... is there certain contract language and how does the pricing work that way? I know that they would never agree to list the artist... since I work there, they previously purchased one of my prints at a good discount and let me list my website on it at the bottom, trouble was, enough folks know me, all of the artists that work there demanded their wall space too.... facilities did not wish to deal with all the crap and took my shot down.. now they won't hang art where the artists name is visible :cry

Anyway, They are looking at getting 6 shots for now, if they purchase all 30x40 Metal Prints, I will make about 1K profit... I offered direct website sale, pay me up front, I order/deliver or.... (this may be dumb...) 50% down non-refundable order, balance on delivery....

Hopefully my pricing is good enough for them, it's a small community hospital in a non-affluent area, so we'll see. They did email me today with other syles of floral shots they found online which is a style clearly not me... I told them I showed what I do, and it's not that. Gave them reasons why I don't think what they saw before mine would fit the area or demographic and also reminded them that they loved the uniqueness of the Metal Print (which they have never seen before) and the reasons why Metal is the way to go.....

I will update the thread when I get their kind "no thanks" just to let y'all know what happened, hopefully they will bite... what did I show you ask... ? They wanted flowers, I gave them landscapes also.













I gave them 40 downsized photo samples, 2 lists of "artists suggestions", price list for print, canvas and metal and of course the link to the website and their private password protected gallery.

Thoughts? And I would love to hear about that rotating multi-month contract please

Lee

Mark Dickinson

Those look good. I was just adding a comment on, Balance on Delivery. (hospitals) might have an invoice system, and a financial department that might take 1 week to get. Might just do contract---and full payment.

Glort

So did you manage to pull anything out of this gig or was it a crash and burn?

Wiren

Glort wrote: »

So did you manage to pull anything out of this gig or was it a crash and burn?

Well, for all of their supposed urgency, they are still talking amongst themselves...

I stopped by their office the other day to check in and see if they needed anything else from me and the response was... we will be having a meeting over the issue in the next couple of days (that would have been today).

I've been trying to be somewhat aloof and non pestery while interested in their decision all the same. I plan to stop by tomorrow to ask for my thumb drive back that I gave them with downsized samples and check back in that way.

Hopefully we'll hear back soon. I will plan to post here to let you know what came of it. In the meantime, I have booked a wedding in mid Sept and a Senior shoot in early Oct.

Have any of you all played around with digital background software? i'm about to pull the trigger on Photokey 4......

Lee

Glort

Wiren wrote: »

Have any of you all played around with digital background software? i'm about to pull the trigger on Photokey 4......

I have been using Photokey for a few months now.

I'll be doing a corporate event for 300 people of Friday night with Photokey and printing onsite.
They have selected a background and i'll also be adding their corporate logo to the front of the pics.
I also just got another booking not 20 min ago for a 21st in November. The people were at the first event i did using green screen and were blown away with it and said they wanted me to do their function but just had to confirm the date and venue.
Onsite printing again but that will be a walk in the park with only 60 guests.

I also have a corporate Golf day early in December I have done for the company for the last 3 years and they want on course shots plus the green screen with shots of St. Andrews and maybe some wacky stuff for backgrounds.

You need to get your lighting right, but it gives you fantastic new opportunities to make awsome pics and open up new doors for work.

Sam

Glort wrote: »

I have been using Photokey for a few months now.

I'll be doing a corporate event for 300 people of Friday night with Photokey and printing onsite.
They have selected a background and i'll also be adding their corporate logo to the front of the pics.
I also just got another booking not 20 min ago for a 21st in November. The people were at the first event i did using green screen and were blown away with it and said they wanted me to do their function but just had to confirm the date and venue.
Onsite printing again but that will be a walk in the park with only 60 guests.

I also have a corporate Golf day early in December I have done for the company for the last 3 years and they want on course shots plus the green screen with shots of St. Andrews and maybe some wacky stuff for backgrounds.

You need to get your lighting right, but it gives you fantastic new opportunities to make awsome pics and open up new doors for work.

Glort,

It looks like this is a stand alone program. On a scale of 1 to 10 with 10m being perfect, how would you rate the extraction end result? Please note I am very detail oriented and would not be happy with chopped ragged extraction on the hair. Think magazine cover, and or fine art.

I can see how this would be efficient and really awesome for events and printing onsite where the quality doesn't have to be perfect.

Sam