Outdoor Photographer DVD. Scam or extremely poor marketing campaign?

David_S85

Anyone else subscribe to Outdoor Photographer? Several weeks ago "they" sent me a DVD. I assumed it was something similar to what many magazines do, like Mac World or PC World sending a mostly promotion/adware filled CD or DVD that includes essentially non-usable content or very basic Noob-type content. I never never never insert those things in my computer. Call me wise to scams/adware/viruses or sleazy promotions, but I've done stupid things like put those CD's into my machines before (long time ago) with unexpected results. So anyway, the original envelope and letter went to the recycling immediately and the DVD lay unviewed on the floor by the shredder where it belongs.

Fast forward to today. I get a letter with Outdoor Photographer's logo all over it telling me I need to pay for this DVD (or send it back in some special envelope they had sent with it) or get charged for the thing. Huh? What's this? Extortion from one of my favorite magazines? Apparently, yes.

I should point out that the letter is signed by Christopher Robinson, Editor, Outdoor Photographer Magazine.

This happen to any of you?

Richard

David_S85 wrote: »

Anybody have word of what to do about it?

Send them a link to this thread.

Harryb

This seems to be pretty clear. https://postalinspectors.uspis.gov/investigations/MailFraud/fraudschemes/FraudSchemes.aspx/othertypes/UnsolicitedFraud.aspx

David_S85

Thanks, Harry. I called Werner Publications, the owner of Outdoor Photographer and they know they have a big problem. Some time ago, Werner signed a marketing partnership with T.N. Marketing. Werner gave/sold all their subscriber information to them. It is T.N. which sent the DVD and who is trying to obtain payment from Outdoor's customers. Is it a scam? Yes, it appears to be, albeit a small one, and Werner is beginning to find out about it only now. They seemed apologetic on the phone.

This letter came today, Sept. 22nd. It asks those who received the DVD to send their money by Sept. 22nd (today) or to return the DVD by Sept. 22nd or else they'll be charged for the DVD. Panic. So people think they have to do something. 90% (a guess on my part) or more of the recipients probably tossed the DVD return envelope and then think they had better rush to get the payment out, $12.95.

There is this message, in very small print, and not on the payment voucher, included on the form letter, which I didn't catch the first two times I read the "pay me now" letter.

Service Guarantee: You are under no obligation to participate in the program, because you didn't order the DVD, you don't have to participate or send it back and can consider it a free gift. There are no minimum purchase requirements and you can easily cancel at any time - no questions asked!

OK, that's great, but not everybody is going to read that little ditty near the bottom.

People, don't pay the money.

Harryb

I would file a complaint with the Post Office about this scam (I have time on my hands, I'm retired you know).

David_S85

Go for it Harry! :davidto I am part of that "work for a living" crowd and don't have much time for all that legal running around stuff.

Sam

Two comments, I would have to take a look at the DVD. (open view etc.) Curiosity.

Second ignore the idiots, as you now know you have no obligation to pay anything.

OK, three turn this over to the post office, the useless BBB, and perhaps your states attorney general.

I would make a case for fraud. The company knows they have no right to bill you, they even state it in the fine print. To then attempt to invoice people they mailed the unasked for DVD is knowingly demanding payment they are not legally entitled to. That would be fraud.

Sam

David_S85

I'm sure not going to view the DVD now. If this company uses these tactics, I would rather burn it. Not sure I'm going to file a claim, but it wouldn't be a bad idea. They do have that little disclaimer on the letter, so its likely they'd beat that rap if it was handed down to them.

Back when I was in the retail business, I would often get something that looked like a bill from the yellow pages, or one of them. There would be an invoice with a dollar amount per month and a listing size and example. Problem was, most all were scams. They looked exactly like The Real Yellow Pages bill, and over the years, efforts from the scammers kept those invoice billings looking exactly like the real bills where we actually were an advertiser. In very very small print on the backs was the "no obligation" phrase. Again, my guess was that enough internal accounts payable people were duped into paying those bills for the non-existant yellow pages ad to keep those scams going.

r3t1awr3yd

Sam wrote: »

To then attempt to invoice people they mailed the unasked for DVD is knowingly demanding payment they are not legally entitled to. That would be fraud.
Sam

Except, on the bottom, it says "this is not an invoice" lol.

Sam

r3t1awr3yd wrote: »

Except, on the bottom, it says "this is not an invoice" lol.

No, this is not a get out of jail statement. It's part of the fraud.

While you could be right about them beating the rap, to put it kindly I have limited confidence in what I refer to as our criminal justice system, it would put them on notice and probably stop the fraud.

That would go under the category of helping others you don't even know.

Sam

redleash

I got the same DVD and offer--I sent the DVD back and then left town so I don't know if I also got the demand letter. I'm glad you brought it to the publisher's attention--maybe that will help prevent future problems.

Lauren

ian408

Since you didn't solicit them for the DVD, it's considered a gift.

Back in the book/record Club days, this was a common tactic used to try and squeeze money out of people. Courts deemed them gifts you don't have to pay for (so long as you didn't ask for it).

redleash

I am still getting demand letters, even though I sent the DVD back right after receiving it. I'll ignore it once more and then try to contact them to stop it.

Anyone else still having issues?

Lauren

aj986s

Interesting that the check is supposed to be made payable to "Ultimate PhotoGuide", rather than "Outdoor Photographer".

David_S85

No more demands for the video payments at my end, yet. I am getting re-subscription demands from Outdoor Photographer since I'm at the end of my two year subscription. I like the content and the writers but am hating the parent publisher and the editor for the deal they inked with that idiot ad partner. The main issue I wrestle with is that our own Marc Muench is one of the OP contributors - but luckily, I and we can interact with Marc directly here at DGrin.

DsrtVW

I had been subscribed to it but never received that. My sub ran out