Hey, everyone who's complaining needs to shut up. I'm using that line on my wife to buy my 5DMKIII or D800 when they come out. I don't want her doing a google search and finding the complaints about the ad!
Hey, everyone who's complaining needs to shut up. I'm using that line on my wife to buy my 5DMKIII or D800 when they come out. I don't want her doing a google search and finding the complaints about the ad!
I don't think you are reading me straight. I think you are reading way too much into this slogan and I don't come away thinking any of the points you are trying to argue in regards to what this slogan means. Nikon is in the business to sell cameras. For some images, gear does matter. For some it doesn't.
Marketing BY ANY company isn't based on rational thought, but irrational thought and impulse. To get bent out of shape over it is ridiculous just as you going on a rant about Nikon and then proclaiming this is why you shoot Canon.
yep I agree with you, but then you just repeat truisms that everyone agrees with anyway. most of the fun begins when you go underneath appearances and get in control of things instead of being tossed about on the surface of things at the mercy of all weathers - or all advertising!
just as you say, advertising works because most people don't think. but why then do you advocate that we shouldn't think about it?!scratch there are quite a few things I don't lie down and roll over for or suck up passively - or hand over thousands to Nikon to give me the gear they say I am nothing without!
but tell us, please, why you have bought the gear you have. that should be interesting!
yep I agree with you, but then you just repeat truisms that everyone agrees with anyway. most of the fun begins when you go underneath appearances and get in control of things instead of being tossed about on the surface of things at the mercy of all weathers - or all advertising!
just as you say, advertising works because most people don't think. but why then do you advocate that we shouldn't think about it?!scratch there are quite a few things I don't lie down and roll over for or suck up passively - or hand over thousands to Nikon to give me the gear they say I am nothing without!
but tell us, please, why you have bought the gear you have. that should be interesting!
Neil
I don't think it's worth thinking about an advertising campaign as deep as you do since its not meant for deep thought anyway just as it is not worth anymore of my time debating with you about this.
I don't think it's worth thinking about an advertising campaign as deep as you do since its not meant for deep thought anyway just as it is not worth anymore of my time debating with you about this.
why is advertising so powerful and why is so much money spent on it, and on "propaganda" generally? because it's effective and the biggest factor in how people behave. surely it's very sensible to think about it! anyway I recommend knowing what has got so much control over people. it's great to do some anatomy on the beast that has got so much of us in its gut!
I don't mind thinking, just about stuff that really matters. Take care, and good luck with your intellectual minutia about marketing techniques.
ok does food matter? do you avoid red meat, eggs and full fat dairy? do you eat dairy substitutes such as margarine and refined oils? do you eat plenty of cereals?
most people do. why? because the industries producing chicken, cereals, seed oils and corn and soy derived products have advertised so intensively and so successfully, even until recently coopting the FDA! now the latest science is revealing how these food lobbies exploited early and defective research far beyond what was scientifically justifiable.
eg high quality saturated fats, such as those in grassfed red meat, raw nonhomogenised dairy from grassfed animals, and free range eggs are now known by science to be heart protective, and the factory processed polyunsaturated fats damaging! eg high carbs consumption from cereals is now known to be a major factor in obesity and type 2 diabetes.
the health and wellbeing of many, many people have been compromised for the profit of certain industries.
now, I am not by any stretch a freaky food fundamentalist! like everyone else I went along for quite a while with what the ads were telling me. but because I think and get critical information about health from science rather than from the supermarket, my food choices are really helping to keep me in the best health.
life seems simpler just to not bother with any of this stuff, to remain in an infantile state of mindless sucking on what the market offers. until you hit the consequences!
I don't really want to appear a fool, as you insist I am, for checking out what is reality and what is commercial manipulation for profit. but I really do advise thinking about why we do the things we do and who is benefiting most from our spending - us or "them".
which reminds me, you have dodged my invitation to explain why you have made your photography gear purchases!D
What do you think? bad marketing? I read a lot of 'angry' replies from photogs...
So ... is this an ad for or against Nikon?
“To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
― Edward Weston
There's an old joke about this. Photographer gets invited to dinner, Hosts says "I love your pictures, you must have a great camera." Photographer says " I love your cooking you must have great pots and pans".
I think better equipment gives you the opportunity to take better pics, but doesn't mean that you will.
How about this one: "You can take great pictures with any camera, however not every picture can be taken with every camera." ?
“To consult the rules of composition before making a picture is a little like consulting the law of gravitation before going for a walk.”
― Edward Weston
0
Matthew SavilleRegistered Users, Retired ModPosts: 3,352Major grins
How about this one: "You can take great pictures with any camera, however not every picture can be taken with every camera." ?
That about sums it up for me.
* Photographers with a small budget and limited gear LOVE to talk about how they can out-shoot photographers with all the best lenses and whatnot.
* As soon as they save up enough money, they're off to the camera store to upgrade.
* Professionals with lots of experience can certainly rock any job with most any camera, if they were backed into a corner. Because, of course, what matters is experience and ability, NOT the exact aperture or frame rate, or megapixels etc...
* However, I personally would consider it downright irresponsible for a professional to repeatedly show up to "work" with just a rebel and a kit lens. Sure there are some jobs where that's all you'd need, in fact about $2K worth of the work I do each month doesn't require more than that. But my point is about professional reliability. There is a difference between "performance" and reliability". And even if a professional doesn't need a hundred megapixels or ten FPS, they still need reliability. Or at least a backup.
* Lastly, admittedly there are in fact some features that make your job WAY easier for specific uses. A frame rate is really helpful for a sports photographer. Focusing and ISO are really helpful for a wedding photographer. They're not mission-critical, but they sure do increase your chances of getting the shot, and in most cases they make photography more fun, plain and simple.
* So, while everybody is busy arguing over which camera is capable of doing what job, the bottom line is those above points. You can be BETTER than the equipment you use, indeed. In fact I prefer such a situation, compared to the other way around! I would hate to be "only as good as the equipment I use", wouldn't you?
The most refined of your statements on the matter to date, Matt, and therefore I have no argument with it!:ivar
Your line: 'I would hate to be "only as good as" the equipment I use!', is a perfect comeback to N's silliness! And describes the (usually) friendly rivalry between me and my gear!
Hate to say it, but to the OP it's just an ad. Tires are sold pretty much the same way. True it's a bit misleading, but marketing always does that if they can sell more stuff, no matter what the stuff is! lol
What I always say is..
"I'm just happy knowing that the pointy end goes towards the subject. "
If an excellent photographer with a mediocre camera/lens was sompeting with a mediocre photographer using an excellent camera/lens, the excellent photographer would win just about every time. However if two exactly talented photographers were competing, one with an excellent camera/lens and the other with mediocre equipment, the photographer with the excellent equipment would win hands down...
If an excellent photographer with a mediocre camera/lens was sompeting with a mediocre photographer using an excellent camera/lens, the excellent photographer would win just about every time. However if two exactly talented photographers were competing, one with an excellent camera/lens and the other with mediocre equipment, the photographer with the excellent equipment would win hands down...
... and yet we all know that some frames we shoot are better than others, even consecutive ones... a slightly different pov, a subtle change in light, something moves in the bg, the subject has a thought...
... we all often feel that though we have a good shot it still is not definitive...
so even for the best photographer their images will vary, even when using the best gear with the best technique and huge experience. I doubt that there is any photographer who doesn't have rejects
a huge amount of the success of an image is in the processing, well clear of the gear that got it. this has been the case with photography from the beginning. and this has a large component of trial and error
a huge amount of the success of an image is in the eye of the beholder
surely the relevance of gear is very variable. the shots that become stars are finally independent of all the details of their making
All I can say is my D7000 is in the shop, and I shot a baseball game at night under lights no flash with my D90. I had fewer keepers, and more noise.
I was really missing my D7000.
Comments
best reply yet! lol
yep I agree with you, but then you just repeat truisms that everyone agrees with anyway. most of the fun begins when you go underneath appearances and get in control of things instead of being tossed about on the surface of things at the mercy of all weathers - or all advertising!
just as you say, advertising works because most people don't think. but why then do you advocate that we shouldn't think about it?!
but tell us, please, why you have bought the gear you have. that should be interesting!
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
I don't think it's worth thinking about an advertising campaign as deep as you do since its not meant for deep thought anyway just as it is not worth anymore of my time debating with you about this.
why is advertising so powerful and why is so much money spent on it, and on "propaganda" generally? because it's effective and the biggest factor in how people behave. surely it's very sensible to think about it! anyway I recommend knowing what has got so much control over people. it's great to do some anatomy on the beast that has got so much of us in its gut!
take care, even if you don't want to think!
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
I don't mind thinking, just about stuff that really matters. Take care, and good luck with your intellectual minutia about marketing techniques.
ok does food matter? do you avoid red meat, eggs and full fat dairy? do you eat dairy substitutes such as margarine and refined oils? do you eat plenty of cereals?
most people do. why? because the industries producing chicken, cereals, seed oils and corn and soy derived products have advertised so intensively and so successfully, even until recently coopting the FDA! now the latest science is revealing how these food lobbies exploited early and defective research far beyond what was scientifically justifiable.
eg high quality saturated fats, such as those in grassfed red meat, raw nonhomogenised dairy from grassfed animals, and free range eggs are now known by science to be heart protective, and the factory processed polyunsaturated fats damaging! eg high carbs consumption from cereals is now known to be a major factor in obesity and type 2 diabetes.
the health and wellbeing of many, many people have been compromised for the profit of certain industries.
now, I am not by any stretch a freaky food fundamentalist! like everyone else I went along for quite a while with what the ads were telling me. but because I think and get critical information about health from science rather than from the supermarket, my food choices are really helping to keep me in the best health.
life seems simpler just to not bother with any of this stuff, to remain in an infantile state of mindless sucking on what the market offers. until you hit the consequences!
I don't really want to appear a fool, as you insist I am, for checking out what is reality and what is commercial manipulation for profit. but I really do advise thinking about why we do the things we do and who is benefiting most from our spending - us or "them".
which reminds me, you have dodged my invitation to explain why you have made your photography gear purchases!
all the best
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
So ... is this an ad for or against Nikon?
― Edward Weston
If you think about it - exactly!
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
I think better equipment gives you the opportunity to take better pics, but doesn't mean that you will.
Like I've always said.....
"A photo is only as good as the person behind the box(camera)!"
No mater if it's a $5000 box or a $100 box.
Manfrotto Mono | Bag- LowePro Slingshot 100AW
http://www.graphyfotoz.smugmug.com/
― Edward Weston
* Photographers with a small budget and limited gear LOVE to talk about how they can out-shoot photographers with all the best lenses and whatnot.
* As soon as they save up enough money, they're off to the camera store to upgrade.
* Professionals with lots of experience can certainly rock any job with most any camera, if they were backed into a corner. Because, of course, what matters is experience and ability, NOT the exact aperture or frame rate, or megapixels etc...
* However, I personally would consider it downright irresponsible for a professional to repeatedly show up to "work" with just a rebel and a kit lens. Sure there are some jobs where that's all you'd need, in fact about $2K worth of the work I do each month doesn't require more than that. But my point is about professional reliability. There is a difference between "performance" and reliability". And even if a professional doesn't need a hundred megapixels or ten FPS, they still need reliability. Or at least a backup.
* Lastly, admittedly there are in fact some features that make your job WAY easier for specific uses. A frame rate is really helpful for a sports photographer. Focusing and ISO are really helpful for a wedding photographer. They're not mission-critical, but they sure do increase your chances of getting the shot, and in most cases they make photography more fun, plain and simple.
* So, while everybody is busy arguing over which camera is capable of doing what job, the bottom line is those above points. You can be BETTER than the equipment you use, indeed. In fact I prefer such a situation, compared to the other way around! I would hate to be "only as good as the equipment I use", wouldn't you?
=Matt=
My SmugMug Portfolio • My Astro-Landscape Photo Blog • Dgrin Weddings Forum
Your line: 'I would hate to be "only as good as" the equipment I use!', is a perfect comeback to N's silliness!
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
Sounds good to me.
What I always say is..
"I'm just happy knowing that the pointy end goes towards the subject. "
... and yet we all know that some frames we shoot are better than others, even consecutive ones... a slightly different pov, a subtle change in light, something moves in the bg, the subject has a thought...
... we all often feel that though we have a good shot it still is not definitive...
so even for the best photographer their images will vary, even when using the best gear with the best technique and huge experience. I doubt that there is any photographer who doesn't have rejects
a huge amount of the success of an image is in the processing, well clear of the gear that got it. this has been the case with photography from the beginning. and this has a large component of trial and error
a huge amount of the success of an image is in the eye of the beholder
surely the relevance of gear is very variable. the shots that become stars are finally independent of all the details of their making
Neil
http://www.behance.net/brosepix
I was really missing my D7000.
OK, is this horse dead yet?
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