UV Filters needed these days?

wildviper

I just bought the 70-200 Nikon VR1 and was wondering how to protect the lens front. I see most photogs slap a UV filter on and that's it.

I was going to do that...but curious if UV filter is really needed...how about the Nikon no color simple filter? That is cheaper but is made by Nikon.

I thought that with Digital, the UV is taken care of on the sensor itself. No?

ziggy53

While I do recommend using filters to protect the front element of lenses, I don't ever recommend using cheap filters. Anything that degrades image quality should be avoided, and cheap filters tend to degrade image quality more than anything else other than cheap lenses. If you're the kind of person that uses Holga lenses as your primary imaging optics then a cheap filter might be justified.

I have standardized on the Hoya HMC and B+W F-Pro filters for my lenses. I have been reading good things about the better Marumi filters, which aren't too expensive.

Does the choice of filter really make a difference?

Here are a couple of links that may convince you:

(For this link scroll down until you see "Crye-Leike" for a serious comparison)
http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2011/06/good-times-with-bad-filters

Circular Polarizer tests:
http://www.lenstip.com/115.1-article-Polarizing_filters_test.html
Results from above tests:
http://www.lenstip.com/115.4-article-Polarizing_filters_test_Results_and_summary.html

My advice is to personally test each filter that you do buy to see what impact the filter has during the most severe circumstances. Tests like; shooting a spectral light (dead center and off to the edge), shooting with the sun just off camera, shooting with strong cross-lighting, shooting a color chart, etc.

These tests will demonstrate things like flare prominence/propagation or flare resistance, halation, color affectations, etc. Once you run the tests you will have a better idea when to remove the protective filter.

A very good source for filters:

http://www.2filter.com/index.htm

Matthew Saville

With such a nice lens, on a current generation digital SLR, you probably won't see much difference when using a UV filter compared to a simple clear filter. Try the Nikon, and let us know how it goes.

Personally, I only put on filters if I know I'm going to be shooting in a tough environment. Nine times out of ten, in the harsh back-lighting situations I find myself shooting in for work and other things, a UV filter just helps to ruin my AF accuracy... :-(

=Matt=

wildviper

Thanx Ziggy and Matt,

Ziggy...by cheaper, I didn't mean some run off the mill filter. This one is made by Nikon...I would think that they are good quality..no? Here is a link to them on Amazon: Nikon Filter

Matt, I had the feeling that it shouldn't make a difference...so its good to know that the UV filter can mess with your focusing. More ammo to go for the Nikon clear.

Anand

ziggy53

wildviper wrote: »

Thanx Ziggy and Matt,

Ziggy...by cheaper, I didn't mean some run off the mill filter. This one is made by Nikon...I would think that they are good quality..no? Here is a link to them on Amazon: Nikon Filter

Matt, I had the feeling that it shouldn't make a difference...so its good to know that the UV filter can mess with your focusing. More ammo to go for the Nikon clear.

Anand

The Hoya HMC, B+W F-Pro and Marumi DHG have many good qualities, which is why I use and recommend them. (I only have one Marumi c-polarizer and I haven't tested it enough to recommend it personally, but I read/saw enough positive test results to both purchase and mention it.)

The Nikon filter you linked has no mention of multi-coatings of any kind, not even on their corporate website**:

http://www.nikonusa.com/Nikon-Products/Product/Lens-Filters/2482/77mm-Filter-NC.html

A Marumi Super DHG protective filter, in 77mm threads and at 2Filters, is less cost than the Nikon filter you linked. This filter has both multi-coatings, to reduce internal reflections and flare as well as to improve light transmission, and an extra hardness coating to help prevent scratches and to help the filter shed water and oil.

http://www.2filter.com/marumi/marumiuvfilters.html
http://www.marumi-international.com/dhg/

For my money, a filter without multi-coating is a cheap filter, regardless of name or cost. Since the Nikon filters do not describe having "any" coatings, nor are they designated with anything besides the "NC"**(See update below), I rather have to assume that they are not coated and I would not recommend them.

The Marumi Super DHG is about as low as I would recommend, but I would rather recommend the Hoya HMC and B+W F-Pro filters which I have personally tested to be good filters and that's what I use.

---

*(I believe that "NC" is short for "Neutral/Clear", although Ken Rockwell calls it "Nikon Clear". Anyway the NC designation does not appear on any other of the Nikon filters, polarizing or soft, so I don't believe that it's a coating designation.)

**(Thanks to a post from our user "Simo70" there is a link to a Nikon description that some of the Nikon filters may be multi-coated. http://dgrin.com/showpost.php?p=1686692&postcount=11)

Matthew Saville

wildviper wrote: »

Thanx Ziggy and Matt,

Ziggy...by cheaper, I didn't mean some run off the mill filter. This one is made by Nikon...I would think that they are good quality..no? Here is a link to them on Amazon: Nikon Filter

Matt, I had the feeling that it shouldn't make a difference...so its good to know that the UV filter can mess with your focusing. More ammo to go for the Nikon clear.

Anand

No, I meant to say that ANY type of glass you add between the lens and your subject might affect focus accuracy. It has less to do with the coatings on the lens, and more to do with simply keeping the filter clean. One good finger smudge, and especially your outer edge of focus points could take a huge cut in accuracy.

So, my point was, whatever you buy I would only use it when absolutely necessary for the protection of the lens. So if you find yourself often shooting in strongly backlit situations, I would much rather prefer a good lens hood. Mostly to protect the lens against impact actually, not so much to actually keep the sun out of the lens.

=Matt=

Matthew Saville

ziggy53 wrote: »

The Hoya HMC, B+W F-Pro and Marumi DHG have many good qualities, which is why I use and recommend them. (I only have one Marumi c-polarizer and I haven't tested it enough to recommend it personally, but I read/saw enough positive test results to both purchase and mention it.)

The Nikon filter you linked has no mention of multi-coatings of any kind, not even on their corporate website:

http://www.nikonusa.com/Nikon-Products/Product/Lens-Filters/2482/77mm-Filter-NC.html

A Marumi Super DHG protective filter, in 77mm threads and at 2Filters, is less cost than the Nikon filter you linked. This filter has both multi-coatings, to reduce internal reflections and flare as well as to improve light transmission, and an extra hardness coating to help prevent scratches and to help the filter shed water and oil.

http://www.2filter.com/marumi/marumiuvfilters.html
http://www.marumi-international.com/dhg/

For my money, a filter without multi-coating is a cheap filter, regardless of name or cost. Since the Nikon filters do not describe having "any" coatings, nor are they designated with anything besides the "NC"*, I rather have to assume that they are not coated and I would not recommend them.

The Marumi Super DHG is about as low as I would recommend, but I would rather recommend the Hoya HMC and B+W F-Pro filters which I have personally tested to be good filters and that's what I use.

---

*(I believe that "NC" is short for "Neutral/Clear", although Ken Rockwell calls it "Nikon Clear". Anyway the NC designation does not appear on any other of the Nikon filters, polarizing or soft, so I don't believe that it's a coating designation.)

I would tend to agree with this. Personally, I own B+W filters and I like them because they're so dang solid. Compared to the Hoya HMC DMC XYZ OCD filters, which feel paper-thin...

=Matt=

paddler4

I have used filters to protect lenses for years and have never noticed any effect on focusing, but I haven't done A/B tests for that. I have done A/B tests for image quality, and what I have found is that if the lighting is behind you (no risk of flare) and the filter is good, the effects are small enough that once I have forgotten which image is which, I can't figure it out again. On the other hand, if there is a risk of flare or ghosting, a filter may make it worse. I have not done those tests, but numerous people have posted some.

So I do pretty much what Ziggy does--I generally leave a good filter on for protection and remove it when it's clear that I don't need it or when it will detract from image quality. I have had several filters damaged by stuff that I would not have wanted to clean off a lens. E.g., I was shooting one indoor event and set my camera down on a kitchen counter for a few minutes. (I know, dumb.) When I came back, some unidentified liquid was on the filter, and I never could get it off.

I would never buy a filter that is not multi-coated. I generally use Hoya HMC and S-HMC, but like Ziggy, I recently bought a Marumi CPL because of a very good review and a cheap price. So far, so good, but I have not tested it carefully.

ziggy53

I should add that the "Canon" name brand filters also appear to be un-coated, and I would not recommend them. Likewise for Kodak and most other camera manufacturer filters.

The cheapest Tiffen and some other store brands, Promaster (et al), I have tested and know that they produce visible degradation in reduced contrast, flare, slight blur, etc. I sometimes get those attached to a used lens and I'll test them and then throw them away or use them for something else non-photographic or special effect (like a filter with Vaseline effect) where image quality really doesn't matter.

jww

I like B+W, though I have a few Hoya's as well. B+W just feels better quality to me and I like the results. The only Nikon filter I have is of the drop in variety, which is a circ polarizer. I mostly shoot motorsports and never want to risk not having a filter on the front.

Simo70

I guess I have to agree with Ziggy on this, although I got confused by Nikon support answer to the question about the presence of coating on the NC filters.

This is their answer: The descriptions available for these filters do not indicate that they are multi-coated. We apologize for the inconvenience this causes. Information on our filters can be found in the following article.

Answer Title: Using Nikon filters with Nikon DSLRs
Answer Link: http://support.nikonusa.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/13987

I hope this information is useful.


This is the description on Nikon website: Neutral Color NC Filters: Available in attachment sizes 39mm, 46mm, 52mm, 62mm, 72mm and 77mm, these neutral-color filters serve as lens protectors. They do not affect color balance. In addition, multilayer coating prevents light reflection inside the glass, thus improving color rendition.*

Now, do I miss something? They say the filters are not multi-coated but the specs says they are?

What makes me angry is that I have the NC filters on all my lenses, spent a good amount os $ thinking that buying Nikon was the best option. Well I should have read more before buying them.

Anyway, on the field they are not bat at all, the weak point is when the sun hits the lens and I get all kinds of ghosts, I am assuming for lack of multi-coating.

GraphyFotoz

Ok what about this Nicna Filter??
I have been told that SOME filters are made by lesser companies and have greater names on them.
Example I've been told that this Nicna Pro1D is the same as a Hoya Pro1 Digital....is this BS?

(I know they do it with car ties and the like all the time)

Hoya is good but....IMHO ONLY if it's Made in Japan....NOT the Philippines...those are junk.

Japan and Germany have the best Glass and optics!!

ziggy53

Nicna is a new name to me. I honestly don't know if they are the same or not. I suggest contacting Nicna to be sure.

ziggy53

Simo70 wrote: »

I guess I have to agree with Ziggy on this, although I got confused by Nikon support answer to the question about the presence of coating on the NC filters.

This is their answer: The descriptions available for these filters do not indicate that they are multi-coated. We apologize for the inconvenience this causes. Information on our filters can be found in the following article.

Answer Title: Using Nikon filters with Nikon DSLRs
Answer Link: http://support.nikonusa.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/13987

I hope this information is useful.


This is the description on Nikon website: Neutral Color NC Filters: Available in attachment sizes 39mm, 46mm, 52mm, 62mm, 72mm and 77mm, these neutral-color filters serve as lens protectors. They do not affect color balance. In addition, multilayer coating prevents light reflection inside the glass, thus improving color rendition.*

Now, do I miss something? They say the filters are not multi-coated but the specs says they are?

What makes me angry is that I have the NC filters on all my lenses, spent a good amount os $ thinking that buying Nikon was the best option. Well I should have read more before buying them.

Anyway, on the field they are not bat at all, the weak point is when the sun hits the lens and I get all kinds of ghosts, I am assuming for lack of multi-coating.

Thanks for the link. I would revise my own statement to "The Nikon NC filters 'may be' multi-coated."

I guess the uncertainty would still prevent me from recommending "any" filter that doesn't have a multi-coating designation on the filter ring, it's that important a feature. As such, I still cannot recommend Nikon or Canon filters. I do still recommend the previous brands and versions of Hoya HMC and B+W F-Pro, and the grades of filters above these from Hoya and B+W.

GraphyFotoz

Not much help but I did find this...

http://nicna.en.alibaba.com/aboutus.html

http://nicna.en.alibaba.com/product/245525470-209341434/Nicna_PRO1_D_Wide_Slim_UV_PMC_MC_UV_Lens_Filter_52_55_58_62_67_72_77_mm_offer_OEM.html?tracelog=cgsotherproduct1

ziggy53

Unless Nicna acknowledges that their filters designated as "Pro1-D" are the same as the Hoya "Pro1 Digital", also abbreviated to Hoya "Pro1D", it's pure conjecture that they might be the same. Until I see tests of the Nicna I cannot comment on how good/bad they might be.