Advantages of Lightroom vs PS Elements

GoofBckt

So, for the last 3 years I have been using PS Elements 7 and haven't bothered upgrading or switching to anything else because I felt PSE 7 had enough bells and whistles to do what I wanted anyway. I tend to like to keep things simple. However, I would love to hear some advice on why I SHOULD upgrade or switch to Lightroom, etc. ??? I downloaded a free trial of Lightroom last year and found it to be incredibly complicated. :dunno
Thanks, gang.

NeilL

PSE and Ps belong in the group of applications which have graphics capabilities. Lr is limited to photo development, analogous to the darkroom. The functions of Lr associated with file handling and asset management are not all that intuitive, and these have been revised in the latest version (beta). You cannot really jump in and begin to use Lr (up to the latest version) without first navigating through its tortuous protocols of import - library - development. All "big" software applications have what seems like a madness which only if you persist becomes a method you can begin to enjoy and exploit. Most people tend to resist this learning curve because they simply want to get in and adjust levels or saturation of something else basic in their photos. They don't want to have to spend hours consulting manuals and online forums and having to solve one seemingly cantankerous conundrum after another. However, all of these applications are the rite of passage to freeing your creative options and preserving the data of your digital files, and after the initial ordeal they are fast and very satisfying.

Neil

zoomer

Only reason to switch would be if you process A LOT of photos....so much faster in Lightroom.

angevin1

GoofBckt wrote: »

So, for the last 3 years I have been using PS Elements 7 and haven't bothered upgrading or switching to anything else because I felt PSE 7 had enough bells and whistles to do what I wanted anyway. I tend to like to keep things simple. However, I would love to hear some advice on why I SHOULD upgrade or switch to Lightroom, etc. ??? I downloaded a free trial of Lightroom last year and found it to be incredibly complicated.
Thanks, gang.

Incredibly complicated is a relative term. For instance so is Packing for a trip that you have no idea exactly what is there at your destination.

If it were me, I'd just go to Youtube and keep clicking until I found someone who had the magic-words of enlightenment for you.

I like to break things down simply as possible.

LR: is an organizer
LR: IS a viewer
LR: Is a great way to transform AN-Image or A-complete CF/SD card of photos in "ONE CLICK!"

LR is easier to learn than many other programs.

Did I mention learning new things like LR is great for your brain?

NeilL

angevin1 wrote: »

Incredibly complicated is a relative term. For instance so is Packing for a trip that you have no idea exactly what is there at your destination.

If it were me, I'd just go to Youtube and keep clicking until I found someone who had the magic-words of enlightenment for you.

I like to break things down simply as possible.

LR: is an organizer
LR: IS a viewer
LR: Is a great way to transform AN-Image or A-complete CF/SD card of photos in "ONE CLICK!"

LR is easier to learn than many other programs.

Did I mention learning new things like LR is great for your brain?

Now Tom, don't exaggerate. As the ad man says, thousands of people can't be wrong, and thousands of people, intelligent, patient people with the best will in the world, are to be found all over the web day in and day out in desperation over Ps and Lr, and other major applications. There are hundreds of people who make a living selling courses, tutorials, seminars, workshops, etc, etc - a whole parasite industry! - exploiting just this situation. Case in point Lr4 beta has revised their file handling protocols in response to a great deal of negative feedback.

No, Tom, these programs are not easy to approach by any stretch. The more experience you have with one, the easier it is to make your way in other programs. But there is an unavoidable and excruciating initiation for every neophyte. Unless you are born with Adobe already installed in your brain, something which I have not heard of. How is it ideal to offer the world tools that need endless clicking through YouTube to make sense of?!

I resisted and resisted Ps for a year, until, thankfully, I submitted to the ordeal of learning it. Now it's a breeze. That never ceases to amaze me! Most people who similarly submit to statistical analysis, biochemistry, software programing, Freudian Psychoanalytic theory, interplanetary flight navigation, and so on and so forth find those things a breeze. Does that mean they are easy. No it does not. Simply, no.



Neil

kdog

zoomer wrote: »

Only reason to switch would be if you process A LOT of photos....so much faster in Lightroom.

I recently started using LR myself for larger shoots as opposed instead of CS/Bridge as I've always done. I'm actually pretty proficient in using the batch features of CS/Bridge, but LR blows it away for this purpose.

angevin1

NeilL wrote: »

Now Tom, don't exaggerate. As the ad man says, thousands of people can't be wrong, and thousands of people, intelligent, patient people with the best will in the world, are to be found all over the web day in and day out in desperation over Ps and Lr, and other major applications. There are hundreds of people who make a living selling courses, tutorials, seminars, workshops, etc, etc, exploiting just this situation. Case in point Lr4 beta has revised their file handling protocols in response to a great deal of negative feedback.

No, Tom, these programs are not easy to approach by any stretch. The more experience you have with one, the easier it is to make your way in other programs. But there is an unavoidable and excruciating initiation for every neophyte. Unless you are born with Adobe already installed in your brain, something which I have not heard of. How is it ideal to offer the world tools that need endless clicking through YouTube to make sense of?!

I resisted and resisted Ps for a year, until, thankfully, I submitted to the ordeal of learning it. Now it's a breeze. That never ceases to amaze me! Most people who similarly submit to statistical analysis, biochemistry, software programing, Freudian Psychoanalytic theory, interplanetary flight navigation, and so on and so forth find those things a breeze. Does that mean they are easy. No it does not. Simply, no.



Neil

I love you Neil, but is there a point in your text/reply somewhere?

Of course many of your ideas are true and hold water. But that doesn't help the OP at all.

I subscribe to the Feynman school....if you cannot explain it so a freshman could understand it, you don't understand it well enough yourself. Yet I go further...freshman becomes 12 y/o.

So that said, there are tons of folks better versed in ALL programs than me. So, get your big brains out and make this or any explanation as simple as possible.

sapphire73

Thoughts on PSE9 and LR3

GoofBckt wrote: »

So, for the last 3 years I have been using PS Elements 7 and haven't bothered upgrading or switching to anything else because I felt PSE 7 had enough bells and whistles to do what I wanted anyway. I tend to like to keep things simple. However, I would love to hear some advice on why I SHOULD upgrade or switch to Lightroom, etc. ??? I downloaded a free trial of Lightroom last year and found it to be incredibly complicated.
Thanks, gang.

It's hard to say what will work best for you, but I'll share what I'm using and why. I have been using LR3 for about 3 years now. I started shortly after taking a 3 week trip to Alaska where I shot thousands of images and wanted to be able to organize and find images from that trip and other shoots more easily. I did buy a manual by Scott Kelby and googled a bit to get an idea of how different folks approach the workflow, organize their folders of photos, etc.

Backing up for a minute, I started shooting RAW about that time and so I was tackling several learning curves at once. I soon found that I could do a pretty good edit of a RAW photo in LR3 and export it to PSE6 for minor tweaks - if needed. It wasn't until I started participating in the dgrin challenges that I wanted to be able to do more in PSE. Specifically, I wanted to work with adjustment layers, etc.

About 6 months ago, I upgraded from PSE6 to PSE9. It is a huge improvement in my opinion, and it is much easier to attempt some adjustments when I want or need to give an image extra attention. I don't know whether the differences between PSE7 and PSE9 are significant enough to warrant an upgrade.

I am an enthusiastic amateur - not a pro by any means. I know my way around computers and have a son who is a "digital native" and is willing to answer my questions from time to time. I'm still learning but I would be loathe to give up either tool. These tools simplify my life - now that I am progressing along that learning curve.

NeilL

angevin1 wrote: »

I love you Neil, but is there a point in your text/reply somewhere?

Of course many of your ideas are true and hold water. But that doesn't help the OP at all.

I subscribe to the Feynman school....if you cannot explain it so a freshman could understand it, you don't understand it well enough yourself. Yet I go further...freshman becomes 12 y/o.

So that said, there are tons of folks better versed in ALL programs than me. So, get your big brains out and make this or any explanation as simple as possible.

Tough love!

As I said, Tom, if you put your personal preconceptions aside, it's simple! Lr is NOT easy when you come to it FIRST time! (As the OP themself commented). I am agreeing. You are not.

To quote myself: "Does that mean [Lr is] easy. No it does not. Simply, no."

Again - Lr is NOT easy when you come to it FIRST time!

Lr IS NOT EASY WHEN YOU COME TO IT FIRST TIME.

You want simpler???!!!lust:D

Neil

angevin1

NeilL wrote: »

Tough love!

As I said, Tom, if you put your personal preconceptions aside, it's simple! Lr is NOT easy when you come to it FIRST time! (As the OP themself commented). I am agreeing. You are not.

To quote myself: "Does that mean [Lr is] easy. No it does not. Simply, no."

Again - Lr is NOT easy when you come to it FIRST time!

Lr IS NOT EASY WHEN YOU COME TO IT FIRST TIME.

You want simpler???!!!lust:D

Neil

Ha Sweet!

But the Big brains and explanation I was referring to was ( aka; make it simpler!): Tell the OP how to approach LR so it doesn't intimidate And help her make it an easier transition. A transition easier than you had, or I had.

And actually Neil, I didn't disagree with the OP's opinion that LR was incredibly complicated. I just said it was relative AND I said it's easier than some programs.

But for me the bigger deal is to help others approach a given software/hardware obstacle easier than perhaps you had it.

I wish I had more to offer the OP on LR But others chiming in like Zoomer, Joel and sapphire73 helps I hope.

No doubt about it. LR was a tough one for me to learn, but then it was probably only the second editing program I chose to learn. That was before I realized that I had a Loooonnnngggg way to go in learning other apps. And that there were so very many other apps. out there worth learning.

Carrie, I hope you find what you need in this thread. Your equine photos are wonderful. LR could be a fun way to ease through some post processing.

GoofBckt

I can't thank you all enough for all this great info and the various opinions. There are times when I feel LR would be advantageous for processing mass quantities of photos, however, I have found that with PSE, I edit each and every photo depending on the vision I see for the finished product, each and every one. I kinda like doing it that way, it feels more "artistic" to me doing it that way. BUT . . . someone said it's all relative . . . that being said, I do not have a thriving photography business with TONS of work coming in. I have a fulltime job and run my photog biz on the side. If that ever changes, I'm willing to bet I would find LR in the "MUST HAVE" category. You all helped immensely to answer my question and I think I'll stick with what I'm doing . . . for now. Or maybe upgrade to PSE9 after a little research. Thanks again.

angevin1 wrote: »

Ha Sweet!

But the Big brains and explanation I was referring to was ( aka; make it simpler!): Tell the OP how to approach LR so it doesn't intimidate And help her make it an easier transition. A transition easier than you had, or I had.

And actually Neil, I didn't disagree with the OP's opinion that LR was incredibly complicated. I just said it was relative AND I said it's easier than some programs.

But for me the bigger deal is to help others approach a given software/hardware obstacle easier than perhaps you had it.

I wish I had more to offer the OP on LR But others chiming in like Zoomer, Joel and sapphire73 helps I hope.

No doubt about it. LR was a tough one for me to learn, but then it was probably only the second editing program I chose to learn. That was before I realized that I had a Loooonnnngggg way to go in learning other apps. And that there were so very many other apps. out there worth learning.

Carrie, I hope you find what you need in this thread. Your equine photos are wonderful. LR could be a fun way to ease through some post processing.

sapphire73

Just looked at your work and it's beautiful. If I had looked before writing my message, I might have skipped replying but perhaps it will help another photographer wondering about this!

GoofBckt

I'm so glad you DID reply, it was very helpful. And thank you for the sweet compliment on my work. Made my day.

sapphire73 wrote: »

Just looked at your work and it's beautiful. If I had looked before writing my message, I might have skipped replying but perhaps it will help another photographer wondering about this!

jhefti

It takes some work to master either LR or PS, so ease of initial use is not a selling point for either. I use both, but for different purposes. LR is great for editing and cataloging large quantities of photos. The editing portion is not that hard if you just are doing global processes and some very light local fixes. PS gives you much more editing capabilities, so if you want to linger for hours over that great shot and really make it shine, PS is the better option. If you want to do quick editing, captioning, and cataloging of many shots, LR is the better option. And if you want to do both, there is an easy way to push a shot out of LR and into PS for more ambitious edits, then send it back.

However, don't make the mistake I did and wait until you have 50,000 shots before deciding to get LR and catalog them!

NeilL

angevin1 wrote: »

Ha Sweet!

But the Big brains and explanation I was referring to was ( aka; make it simpler!): Tell the OP how to approach LR so it doesn't intimidate And help her make it an easier transition. A transition easier than you had, or I had.

And actually Neil, I didn't disagree with the OP's opinion that LR was incredibly complicated. I just said it was relative AND I said it's easier than some programs.

But for me the bigger deal is to help others approach a given software/hardware obstacle easier than perhaps you had it.

I wish I had more to offer the OP on LR But others chiming in like Zoomer, Joel and sapphire73 helps I hope.

No doubt about it. LR was a tough one for me to learn, but then it was probably only the second editing program I chose to learn. That was before I realized that I had a Loooonnnngggg way to go in learning other apps. And that there were so very many other apps. out there worth learning.

Carrie, I hope you find what you need in this thread. Your equine photos are wonderful. LR could be a fun way to ease through some post processing.

Tom, pal, I did give the OP the only advice possible in the face of Lr's characteristics and huge complexity, and the attention span catered for in a half dozen lines here, and that was to bite the bullet and get down and wrestle with it and master it. See -

"However, all of these applications are the rite of passage to freeing your creative options and preserving the data of your digital files, and after the initial ordeal they are fast and very satisfying."

If you, or anyone, has the magic to help make Lr the opposite of "incredibly complicated" for the OP in one post in a thread in DG I don't begrudge them the heaps of $$ that must immediately and inevitably smother them!

Neil

Seamus

I use LR to catalog & keyword my photos which, imho, is one of it's strenghts. You do have to rtfm but it is worth it. You can also use the SmugMug plugin to upload your photos and sync keywords and captions. Dgrin thread here and help page here.

Add in the ability to adjust photos, quickly or using the develop option, the excellent Nik Software plugins, free tutorials and LR has become an app that I couldn't be without.

Having my photos cataloged and keyworded is essential to me as my library grows.

Moving Pictures

Maybe this is a bit out of left field, but my Windows-based workflow for pics intended for print involves Irfanview to page through downloads (and nuke the unacceptable material), with Photoshop loaded off as the editor. Irfanview can read raw files, so ...

GoofBckt

Haha!! I promise I won't. Thanks for the reply.

jhefti wrote: »

It takes some work to master either LR or PS, so ease of initial use is not a selling point for either. I use both, but for different purposes. LR is great for editing and cataloging large quantities of photos. The editing portion is not that hard if you just are doing global processes and some very light local fixes. PS gives you much more editing capabilities, so if you want to linger for hours over that great shot and really make it shine, PS is the better option. If you want to do quick editing, captioning, and cataloging of many shots, LR is the better option. And if you want to do both, there is an easy way to push a shot out of LR and into PS for more ambitious edits, then send it back.

However, don't make the mistake I did and wait until you have 50,000 shots before deciding to get LR and catalog them!

sara505

GoofBckt wrote: »

Haha!! I promise I won't. Thanks for the reply.

Once upon a time, I didn't know anything about Lr or PS, and now I do and am very, very, glad I put the the time in to learn these tools.

Lr, to people who have not learned how to use it, can be very daunting, but once you push past that painful learning curve, it is worth its weight in gold. I've been on it only since V2, but I honestly could not live without it. I still use CS5, but Lr does all my heavy lifting these days (I actually would not want to live without either LR or PS).